A**HOLES W/DOGS

“Just wonderful. Here I sit down in Louisiana hoping for more Trail Talkers to show up and all I get is Steve Hiker. I miss the mountains. Three weeks till Cheaha.”

“I'm headed down to cheaha Memorial day weekend...whooo hooo”

“One of the main reasons to get out in the wilds is to see what's there and dogs tend to limit such opportunities

and besides, the dog (and other pet and livestock) numbers in the US should be severely reduced.”

“The only opportunity a dog limits in the backwoods, as far as I can tell, is the opportunity for complete solitude.”

“I personaly feel that a dog would bring more opportunity. Most dogs are more attenitive to the surroundings and will alert you of things to see, both good and bad things.

Heck My dog knows whats happening 2 blocks down the street while inside the house. You see her ears move to a coner like radars. Peek outside and you will see someone walking down the street or a couple of squirrels playing around.”

“1st off, Im one of the A-Holes with a dog. I was also a dog handler and a dog can do things you cant dream of. Its up to the owner to be responsible and believe me, I have met tons of people who own dogs and the dog just wont behave , and yet this is not a dog issue its a owner issue. Me personaly I bring my dog with me most everyplace because he's my buddy I feel safe with him I feel comforted just having him with makes me happier. Do I just judge all people just because of their dogs or how they look or dress or whatever no, I judge everyone on how they present themself with interacting with me. I agree totaly dogs can be a hassle and you know what? So can kids and the parents Ive been all over in stores in parks you name it and there are the brattiest kids I ever saw, all over the place. Again this boils down to the parents, There are obnoxious people all over, you just have to suck it up and deal with it or move along. I dont see where Banning dogs from trails or certain places is the answer. I dont think we need more laws or stricter laws, laws are created because people dont like how other people are acting and they want to keep them in line, its a matter of people not having manners or common sense or whatever. Why not Respect each other? what you do is your business what I do is mine, if I dont hurt you or anyone why must I have some law that affects me? My dog is not just a pet to me he's a buddy and I prefer my dog over many people I have met. That all being said. Hiking with a partner, group or a dog is just more fun than being alone (to me personaly)
Be Safe everyone.
--Doga Yonv
ps. sorry about the huge post, had to vent.
last edited: 4/30/05 8:18:45 PM”

“Ran out of room sorry, I also wont let my dog run free and jump up on people or bark at people or intentonaly scare people. It is my responsibilty to control my dog and kids and myself, just like its everyone elses to do. Everyone would be better off if people respected each others opinions, and minded their business.”

“wow that was a flame if I ever saw it....:)
I like dogs. Hey. welcome to the forums :)”

“Sorry, I didnt mean it to come out sounding like a flame, I just dont like it when people go harsh and trying to force everyone into doing things their way because its the only way. I just believe in choice. If you dont like dogs great, if you do great. But let me decide for myself If I like them. know what I mean :)

again, sorry if it seemed like a flame, not meant to insult or yell at anyone.
There are good people with and without dogs, there are good hikers and packers with and without dogs. Thats all Im trying to say :)
last edited: 4/30/05 11:51:59 PM”

“I was in a park with my dog and saw two people sitting on a bench next to a trail where people were walking with their dogs and this dog on a leash looked like it was ready to walk towards these people and the weeny guy says, "me and my wife are allergic to dogs". Did they meet at an allergic dog convention?

Now I know and understand not everyone are dog people and don't even want a dog to sniff them, but they are both allergic? He was full of crap and sounded like an idiot.”

“Hey nvwoti, do you mind sending me an email with a tip or 2 on how I can control my dog when it comes to barking. She generaly does not bark alot but there are cases where i am with her and she will just not stop barking at a certian person that we pass by.

In the training course we have taken her to we never learned how to control her barking.

She behaves pretty well but every now and then she decides she wants to bark at someone and It has been impossible to silence her.

Thanks, my email is jason@recklessdriverspb.com”

“lh, how do you know he as full of crap and lieing about it. Are you assuming it because it was a guy who said it and not the female. real cool comment about him being a weeny guy....geesh

You seem to think all men are bad.”

“I know your question wasn't directed towards me, but when I did dog obedience training with my dog, the instructor said to take a soda can an partially fill it with pebbles or marbles, then seal the can with tape. When the dog barks, throw the can on the floor or ground. This will startle the dog and generally they will stop. When the dog does stop praise them and give them a treat. The instructor said that squirting the dog with a water gun would also work.”

“Thanks lumberzac, I will keep that in mind. I wonder if I can use that tactic then get a word associated with it so that she will stop barking on command.

I would like to be able to have a command for her because I dont want her to think it is wrong to bark, I just want her to stop at my command. I want my dog to bark if something is not right or atleast until my wife or myself verfiy that it is ok.
last edited: 5/02/05 3:00:23 PM”

“Another good tact is teach her speak. I know it sounds wierd but teaching her to bark on command will show her she's to only do it when you want her to.”

“Yeah She actualy knows speak very well and will do it on command, We have tried to use that command to create the opposite action and associate it with hush, but that has not been successful yet. So far for all our commands we have voice and hand signals. There are times we can get her to hush using the hand signal for it, but sometimes she will zone out and be in her own little world.

In honesty this will sound judgemental, but I can certianly tell why she barks at some of these people, you look at them and they seem out of place. I personaly do not judge people outright because some of my best friends are the kind of people that if you judge them by looks then you wouldnt want anything to do with them, but they are some of the nicest people you will ever meet. heh.

Thanks for all this advice!”

“If all else fails you can pick up traing calors for about $100. These work very well.”

“OMG...my dog just farted and it sounded like OMG like there was a missle falling from the sky...:|”

“Ewker, I don't think men are all bad, but I do think it's hard to find someone you are compatable with which will make a man seem bad or even a woman seem bad to a man.

Hmmmm, what are the percentages that a couple are both allergic to dogs? I suppose if a person walking their dog is not sensitive to keeping the dog away from people, then the "allergic" routine is a simple way to deter the person from letting their dog walk over to them when they really don't like dogs, are scared of them or find them dirty or who knows what else.

Nigal, I hope you don't mean shock collars. Again, sending volts into your dog is not acceptable, not to say that's what you meant, but what kind of collar costs $100.

If someone shocked me, I'd punch them in the face. A dog cannot do that, so they just become fearful and distrustful of their owner. I know if there is trouble brewing, my dog sticks close to me, because she knows I will protect her.”

“Yeah on the trail sasha hides behind me when a stranger approches...yeah...great guard dog LMAO”

“Spirit, she is guarding you. What she plans on doing is hiding behind you and jumping out to surprise the person if they are bothering you:) Staying close to you is a way of guarding you.”

“The Name Sasha actualy stands for guardian of mankind.

Hehe My Dogs name is Sacha, Samething just spelled it with a c LOL”

“Soem guy tried to pet her the other day and she wouldnt let him. didnt growl or try to bite. She jsut kept far enough away from his hand.”

“My dog is Capri named after the tiny island off the Italian coast and if anyone goes near me, she goes tazmanian on them.

I have to tell people quickly not to pet her when I'm holding her because people will walk by and just stick their hand out to pet her without asking which no one should ever do, ask first.

While hiking yesterday, I told this one girl hiking past me that stopped to look at her that she is not friendly, but she come closer and Capri started growling and freaking out. She scares people for a minute, then they laugh since she is only 3-1/2 pounds.”

“Hey its those 3 and a half pound dogs you gotta look out for. 90% of the time a smaller dog will have the sharpest teeth you have ever seen.”

“Yeah...i know...if I ever see my neighbors dog out loose again... >:(. Shoulda killed the rat...The damn thing attacked me when I stepped out my front door and tore up my knee. Guh! what is it with everything conspiring to kill this knee? It has so much scar tissue you cant see the skin anymore lol (this wss the second time a dog has torn it open) on top of having surgery on the blasted thing...OY!
last edited: 5/02/05 4:16:30 PM”

“It sounds like your knee has its on gravitational pull.”

“Yeah my Vet once told me they are bit by more small dogs every year than every big dog put together.

You dont need electric collars or most fancy stuff BUT, they do help. This depends on your type of dog, there is a big differnce from shocking your dog and making a buzz to get attention I have electric collar, prong collars, choke chains, halti, muzle and tons of other dog training aids. everything has a place of use and a way to use it.
I can control my dog verbaly without having to touch him, but I put effort into him, I have also seen other people when I walk by the petshops who are in one of those $20 training classes and some of them are jerking their dogs completely off the ground.
Good teachers and bad teachers. All you have to do to train your dog is keep sessions short no longer than 10-15 minutes each time and no more than 1-2 times a day at most. Or they will come to dread training time.
And the tone of your voice and how you present yourself. If you Talk angry and louder when you repremand the dog, its bad and they associate it with being bad. if you talk happy and pet the dog its good and they learn its not hard just keep it short and keep the tone right. Ive trained tons of dogs and the dogs are easy no matter what the breed its the owners who are hard to train :)

My father used to train dogs in 3 weeks they would pay him $700 drop the dog off at his kennel and pick it up 3 weeks later and he would give them some sessions on use of the dog. It didnt take long before he stopped doing that, the dogs are eager learners the people will not stick with the game plan :)

All animals are great you just need to give them a chance and understand them.

Back to what you people were talking about is sniffing and dogs wanting to do this. I personaly am against this. Nothing in life is 100% guaranteed and sometimes accidents happen. I have seen lots of dogs bite people who have never bitten anyone before. And besides that, its rude to let your dog just smell someone dont care if he or you or whoever means well. for a tiny little toy poodle to smell someone maybe isnt a big deal but like the other person said maybe they dont like dogs, maybe they are allergic, who cares your still invading their space without permisson. And what if you have a larger dog like my working dog was 149 pound rottweiler for him to be allowed to just walk up and smell whoever he wants upsets people it makes them uneasy. Just because you love your dog or think your dog is fine doesnt mean the person being sniffed feels the same way.
I look at it no differntly than me sitting on a park bench and someone comes right up and sits directly on me and leans their head on me I would be alittle weirded out if this were a stranger it might be funny it might not depending on the situation but you see my point. Dogs are great but in todays world thier life doesnt amount to much in the eyes of the law and it takes VERY little to get some jerk to complain and have your dog put in a kennel where he can get kennel cough or be beat badly by some dog hater while they determine if your dog is a threat to society or not. These things happen and your dog can be put to sleep easily as well. The laws just dont protect animals in todays world. I would just feel better knowing my dog didnt get taken away from me even temporarily just because I let him sniff someone and the situation turned ugly for what ever reason, its just not worth it.

Another huge post sorry LOL

-- Doga Yonv”

““Nigal, I hope you don't mean shock collars. Again, sending volts into your dog is not acceptable, not to say that's what you meant, but what kind of collar costs $100.”

No that’s exactly what I meant. And it is very acceptable. It doesn’t even cause pain unless used on the highest setting which I never had to do. It simply gives a little tickle and gets the dog’s attention. It is not used for a punishment but a training aid. That’s why they are called “training collars“. It has been the most effective training aid I have ever used.

“If someone shocked me, I'd punch them in the face. A dog cannot do that, so they just become fearful and distrustful of their owner.”

100% false. Honey has never been fearful or mistrustful of me. Have ever used a training collar?”

“I was thinking about Dogs being allowed on trails and my other point of view is, How many times has a person hiking or camping and been attacked by someones dog? I bet almost never. Sure people get inconvienced and Im sure its always the owners fault. But on the other side of the coin. We have deer and bear and birds ect all nature, bears raid peoples camp sites ect you have to be cautious and go out of your way to camp in bear county with special bags or containers and tying your food in tree's ect. But this is all accepted because a bear is a animal and we are in his domain. Well the way I see it, Wolf and Coyote and Dogs Are all animals and all related. Just because its "normal" for humans to have a dog as a pet doesnt mean he is not an animal. Dogs came from the Earth and they belong in nature also. Dogs love to go outside as much as we do. Everyone hikes/camps for personal reasons, maybe its to get away maybe its to be free maybe to see beautiful things maybe its to see nature. Maybe the dog has reasons for going to?

Im all for animals, they are great. But Im all for them behaving like I said before. I wont let my dog pee on everythig or sniff strangers or be in paths way ect. if I want to take my dog its my job to make sure him and I are safe and not in the way. And not to disturb things just like if im alone its my job to clean up and not cut down tree's or change the scenery. We have alot to learn from the animals around us be it a "wild" bear or a "tamed" dog. Maybe we need to listen more. If you take your animal way out away from everyone and spend time with them all alone. You might be suprised in what you learn and acomplish.

Be safe everyone, Without nature camping/hiking wouldnt be the same. I cant imagine myself backpacking it to walmarts parking lot and setting up camp. Those tree's and mountains ect all nature us and animals all belong to it, we need to share. It doesnt seem fair that we count our selfs higher on the food chain and move all the animals out. If that is how people think maybe they should just go camping or hiking in the zoo and they can see all the pretty happy well kept animals. Me personaly I want to go in the mountains and take my buddy and have some peace go back to where I came from.

Be safe everyone

--Doga Yonv”

“Nigal, I belong to a dog forum where there is an animal behaviorist and she is against shock collars and other negative reinforcement. Yeah, if you electrify your kitchen table and the dog gets the shock of his life, he won't put his paws up there again, so it will work, but I just don't like that method of teaching a dog how to behave.

When I hike or walk in a park, I don't let my dog as small as she is walk up to anyone or go near anyone. You have to respect a person's space. If someone is hiking faster than me, both myself and my dog stand to the side.

nvwoti, I was told dogs are not allowed in National Parks anymore, because people had them off-leash and the dogs would chase down wildlife like deer etc.

In WA state, I have plenty of non National Park mountains where I can take my dog on the trail, thank goodness. She loves to hike.”

““Nigal, I belong to a dog forum where there is an animal behaviorist and she is against shock collars and other negative reinforcement.”

Then she is not a very good behavior list because it’s not even a negative reinforcement. As I stated before, it’s not used as a punishment. It’s a conditioner.

“Yeah, if you electrify your kitchen table and the dog gets the shock of his life, he won't put his paws up there again, so it will work, but I just don't like that method of teaching a dog how to behave.”

Again, this is not even in the same sphere of training. So I take it you have never used a training collar then?”

“My $.02: I've hiked with a few dogs in my lifetime. NEVER had a problem. Actually I only had problems when arses jumped to conclusions and berated me while my dog sat down basically ON my foot, looking at me, wondering what is wrong with the human race. I've seen deer walk across my path, all the dogs I've had take a startled look, act like they're gonna give chase - and then stop in their tracks and look at me to see if I give them the 'go-ahead'. If I say something sternly they behave, if I say something excitedly they go at it.

And for the record I don't give them the 'go-ahead' if I'm on a public trail. Only on private land where my purpose of being there is to let said dog run around like a maniac disturbing the fauna.”

“Nigal, remember, I have a 3-1/2 pound full grown chihuahua, lol:) They don't even wear collars since it can collapse their trachea. Capri wears a harness.”

“A training collor, or a shock collor, what ever. Is possibly the best method of taking a dog to the highest level of education. With out any anger shown what so ever. In order for a dog to effectively be trained with a "shocker", and taken to the higher level of training. Such dog already understands what is expected of them. I understand why people, that have no understanding of the methods that are required with a "shocker", are not in favor of using them. Thats fine, other methods can be used instead of them, for some dog breeds. When "Dude" see's the "shocker" he comes running and is happy, as he knows he is going out, and is going to be doing stuff that most dogs can't. At a very long distance I can still communicate with the dog I am training now, and I can reinforce teaching methods as they are needed, not after the fact. As for the smaller breeds, the "shocker" can be used on the area just in front of the hips. These types of training aids are not cheap, and are not a quick fix for bad behavior.”

“My dog does nothing wrong. She can't jump up on people and knock them over, she can't get into garbage, it's too high for her, she can't pull on her leash, she's too tiny, she doesn't chew on anything in the house....Capri is just perfect. I could never shock her anyway.”

“I agree with waterdog, There are many types of training aids for dogs, from collars to leashes, you name it. And most work if used right but even the most effective one will not work if used wrong. I started with a 6 foot lead, graduated to a 40 foot cotton lead then from time to time have used a electric collar, it is effective in the right situation. Depending on your dogs breed and temperment there are times when you must maintain control and its like the condom theory better to have and never need then need and not have. What will you do if your dog takes off running and doesnt come back? And your in the middle of a woods? Nothing try and chase them with your pack on. If you had the collar and they have been trained properly and the dog bolts on you, you can give a buzz (noise) and that will almost always stop them you dont need to shock them and if for some reason the buzz doesnt work you could resort to the shock and its not like you want to give your dog the electric chair for 5 minutes, the collars deliver a pulse and I have used the collar on myself to see what it felt like and almost all but the very highest setting didnt hurt at all it just scared you because you didnt know what to expect. Anyway if the worst thing my dog ever had to suffer was a small shock thats tons better than them running over a rock ledge or chasing a bear or deer or hurting someone or themself. Thats My personal opinion. Like needles I dont like them but if the doctor says its gonna save my life sure give me 1 :)

And also I dont want to go hiking and see my dog chase a deer this to me is not acceptable. He is domesticaed even if he is an animal and he no longer has to hunt for his food he can still be a dog without tormenting other animals. Its not diiffernt than when we're at home and he gets rough on the cat he has to stop no matter if the cat starts it or not.

-- Doga Yonv”

“Wow, I'm so glad I have a tiny quiet unobstrusive dog. Everyone on my dog forum mostly have problems with their big dogs. I don't even usually go into the behavior section since I have no behavior problems with my dog.

They have problems with walking their dogs, aggression w/their dogs towards other dogs, barking and chewing problems, etc.”

“I cant tell you how many times I have been in petsmart and had some tiny dog come charging and barking at my German shepard. Usually in those cases my dog simply starts wagging her tail cause she thiks its about to be play time when the small dog has no intentions of being friends.

LH, if you ask me you got lucky or you have done a good job of rasing your dog. Most all smal dogs I know are the worst. That is why I wont own one. I use to work at a vet in the kennel. The big dogs were always the easy ones. We even had a Chow that has been known for biting come in and he didnt give us any problems at all. Matter of fact I ended up playing with him for 20 minutes one day.

I am simply saying No matter the size of the dog They can all have those problems.

I personaly like big dogs better, I am a big guy and I always feel like I am going to crush tiny dogs if I play with them LOL”

“I have had two dogs recently, one Rottweiller and one German Shorthair. I never had to use any kind of device to keep the Rott in line. He knew what the word NO meant from a very very young age. I used alpha male/pack training to teach him and it worked well. One time he was attacked by a female Black Lab and it was absolutely hillarious. She came charging up growling and snapping and Front Row (My dog) reared back on his hind legs and came crashing down on her back and chest with his front paws. He pinned her to the ground and slobbered all over her till she settled down. Another time he touched a dog was when I was coon hunting and had a blue tick in the back of the explorer. He took one look at that hound, laying on my coat, he reached in, picked the hound up by placing his jaws over the dog's back, turned around and spit the hound out. Then he jumped in "his" truck. The hound, a veteran of many bear hunts just lay there covered in slobber, trembling. My Shorthair on the other hand was a handful. After paying a buttload of money for him as a puppy and sinking another 2000 into him for training I had to have a way to control him from a distance, without fail. I used a shock collar even though I was against them. When the trainer put the collar on the lowest setting and told me to put it on to see how it felt I barely felt a tickle. All it is is a reminder to the dog that he needs to pay attention.”

“small dogs get a bad rap.

the main problem with them is that they are often owned by people who will not discipline them at all.

so those small dogs believe that they are in charge of their pack/family. they don't know that they are small.

big or small, all dogs must know their place in their pack/family.”

“"Is possibly the best method of taking a dog to the highest level of education."

And you get them to a higher level of trainability quicker. I only had to use the collar for fine tuning. Most of Honey's training was done through obedience classes and repetitious train.

The most useful thing I've used the collar for is for on the trail. It's like having a 1/2 mile long leash. One other thing that needs to be remembered is that you don't even have to shock the dog to be effective. The collar I have also has audible cues. When she get's a shock she gets a negative tone. When she complies she gets a positive tone and lots and lots of praise. Even after the shortest time you can just the audible cues.”

“Good news:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/05/06/dog.mauling.appeal.ap/index.html”

“Thats crazy I hate hearing these stories about dogs killing someone or attacking someone or another animal its so sad the owners wont control them. :( Ruins it for the rest of us.”

“frantic, sacco is right to an extent. The chihuahuas will run the house. We can't help but let them. They are like having a tiny baby all the time that you want to make happy and they know how to steal your heart.

Capri definitely does not know she is small. She will walk minding her own business on her harness, but if a dog like a pit bull went to lunge for her once, she went right back at him trying to lunge at him. I had to hold her back.

People letting their dogs be abusive to people in stores or parks is just rude on the owners part. A worker at Petsmart said this lady's chihuahua was pulling on her pant leg, and the lady said something about it being cute. I don't think that's cute at all.

My dog is not social because I bought her when she was 5 months and was not socialized but I warn people not to touch her. People will still get down on one knee and call her over and she goes over wagging her tail, then she gives then a tiny growl and walks back over to me. The people just laugh their heads off at her bravado and how cute she is with her small growl.

Some people will go and pet her quickly before I can say not to and my dog is so taken aback, she lets them. Part of her problem is that she does not like to see hands coming at her. This breeder must have had her penned up and never picked her up.

Sacco, smaller dogs aren't big chewers so we don't have chewing problems and like I said, they are too small to pull you on a leash or get into things. I'm lucky that she is quiet too.”

“LH, huh?
what do you mean big chewers?
well, i know what you mean, but are you confusing me with someone elses post?”

“sacco, I guess I was confusing you with frantic who said I was lucky with my dog or raised her well. I was just saying small dogs are not big chewers so it's one problem small dog owners don't have where big dogs may chew on your livingroom table leg or couch.”

“Any dog of mine, be it big or small, that snaps at a person gets instant karma. That crap has to be put down or the dog will believe it can get away with it.”

“gotcha.
that's what i thought LH”

“hey; I find some job ok any”