Pennsy's BFT ECT

“Yikes Rich! Sorry to hear about your arm and I hope it heals fast.

Neat bridge Splash! Great story Buddur. I can just picture that happening.

HOI - I was thinking of some kind of aqua sock that could double as a camp shoe/sandal, but those waders look intriguing. Very light and no need to take off your boots. hmmmmmm.....”

“That bridge she built with the keyboard was so cool.
The feather waders are the hot ticket for crossing streams when the water is cold. I just bought a new pair last summer for fishing and use my old ones for backpacking. The ones I bought are called Hodgeman Bantam weight hippers and are very light. Well made too for $28.50”

“Well, Ramsey's in Ledgewood did not have Hodgeman weight hippers, and they didn't have Hodgeman hip waders either. I did get a Columbia sun hat, though.
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“Oh forget it, it just doesn't look quite right.”

“I just went to the Hodgman website and didn't see the hippers I bought last year listed so that probably means they aren't making that style anymore. Cabela's has something similar, but it has a neoprene bootie built into it. They aren't as light, but you probably won't need any additional footwear with them either. Actually this type is probably better. The biggest size might fit right over your hiking boots. I have the Cabela's waders too, but mine have about ten patches on them and are almost shot. You can tell I fish a lot by how many pairs of waders I go through. What was that picture you were trying to make?”

“Spalsh: About blowdown log bridges vs. using waders… Rich B will verify from personal experience that waders work only if you use 'em! :-)

Buddur: Two seconds to dry off and get booted eh? LOL I can imagine!
Hey, Sparky says woof-wuhuf-woo-wooooooh --- something about wanting to know if you and Buddur are comin' to the BFT with us? …and something else sarcastic about brown dogs from Ohio wearing Z-rests on their backs ;-)

Rich: Let us know when that pic of Slate Run is up on your PictureTrail site. I hopped Slate Run at both crossings several years ago during summertime, and it was no problem at all. But Spring crossings are different, as you well know --- especially on makeshift bridges. BTW, I don't know what Splash's last two drawings are supposed to be, but I see she's doing some curious bridge designing here -- perhaps in preparation for the next trip on the Loyalsock? Or maybe she's interviewing for a new position with PennDOT soon?

Better take some art classes there, Splash - what on earth IS that anyway?

QUESTION: If I had crossed Kettle Creek okay on our makeshift log bridge, and if Rich B used his plastic bags to safely get to the other side without breaking his arm, would Splash STILL fall in the creek using *either* option? ;-)”

“Would I have made it across with my pack on, without falling in? We just will never know, ya know?

I was trying to make a bigger smiling face, but it just looked like a Picasso, or a kindergarten drawing, one of the two.

I did see waders with neoprene socks attached, at Ramsey's but they did seem a lot heavier than what Rich had.”

“Next time we get out to Kettle creek the stream might be low enough that we won't have to worry about crossing it. That doesn't mean I'm leaving my plastic bags or waders home. I'll look for that picture and let you know when it's posted.”

“A.A. Outfitters in Blakslee,PA. still has the Hodgman Bantam weight hippers on their website for $28.99. That's where I bought mine last summer.”

“Oh wow, snakes, bears and stream crossings oh my! Sounds like we're in for quite an adventure!
I'm still in. Trying to decide who to start up with on Friday. Pennsy in the early am or M. Silver later in the day. I kind of like the sounds of a 4 mile hike and sitting around an listening to the peepers. But looking at the map I'd hate to miss too much of the trail either. What a great problem!”

“Finewhine, you have your whole life ahead of you so what you don't see this trip you'll see the next. I'm sure there will be many more TrailTalk BFT trips in the next couple of years.”

“finewhine: Snakes, bears, stream crossings ...and decisions, decisions -- oh my!”

“Come on finewhine, git outta bed early and meet us (me?) at the beginning.

Ok Hog on Ice - I bit and ordered the light Wiggy waders. You'll get a full review as per your request. Besides, I might be needing that Shenandoah shuttle in May. ;o)”

“Here are 2 more pennies' worth (Man! somebody's getting rich!) regarding my BFT proposal as it applies specifically to any members of the Friday-Sunday contingent, including any trekkers from last Fall who want to complete the trail's entire 42½ miles:

First let me point out that on Sunday, the total mileage from the proposed Chestnut Ridge campsite (mile 9.96) to the Pump House parking area would be about 13 miles. Tack on about 3 more if we end up camping at/near mile 7 on Saturday night. Either way, you have a relatively long haul for Sunday, then drive home the same day. So, if any of the Fri-Sun people want to shorten Sunday's trek, the plan I previously posted could be amended as follows…

Instead of starting at the Pump House parking area, drive a little farther up Route 44 to where the Blackberry, Santiero di Shay and Pine Bog trails all meet at Route 44. A parking area is there that can hold several cars. Head west on the Blackberry Trail for only about ½ mile to connect with the BFT at mile 17.52. Then turn left and take the BFT to the Route 44 crossing at mile 23.61. Immediately after crossing the highway, leave the BFT and head north on the old RR grade to the Pump House PA, then walk Manor Fork Road to re-connect to the BFT at mile 37.21.

This option will add about 6 miles to Friday's trek (bringing Friday's total to approx. 10 miles), and would require hitting the trail earlier on Friday in order to get to the Foster Hollow Pond campsites at a decent hour. But later it'll pay off, as it would also shorten the Sunday bail-out trek by a few miles (while still allowing anyone from last Fall's trip to complete the entire trail). An even shorter, 8-mile Sunday version is another option, but it would shave off about 2 miles from completing the BFT (good reason to come back again for a day hike!).

For anyone who's not concerned about completing the whole trail, a variation for Friday would be to head EAST from the above-mentioned parking area, using the Pine Bog Trail to connect with the BFT at the junction of Manor Fork Road and Pine Hollow Road. Then head to the Foster Hollow Pond campsite. This option wouldn't require an early start on Friday.

The BFT has so many possibilities! I'm thinking about taking the Santiero di Shay Trail on Sunday from about mile 13.5 all the way back to the Pine Bog parking area. This is tempting to me since I've already done the entire BFT.

Sorry if any of this seems confusing and/or complicated. But if you refer to the maps, I think you'll see what I'm suggesting. Once again, the above suggestions would apply only to the Fri-Sun group. The four-dayers could stick to the plan I previously posted, if they wish.”

“RichB, how is your arm healing? Have you been able to do any dayhiking? If I wasn't busy the next few weekends I would talk you into car camping. Hope that you are feeling better. The weather hasn't been that great anyway.”

“without reading the volumes that are part of this thread, what are your date plans. I spoke with Don, I don;t know wheather he is inclined to go out with a bunch of psychopackers...LOL...but I want him to know that there are options for him...sitting around a crappy apt and looking at (literally) 4 walls (its an efficiency) would drive even me nuts, and he has lived there for 4 years...so...he is a gonner...I wish I was on the east coast...I'd be joining you all and kidnapping him with me. Thanks for emailing me and leaving the option open.”

“yeah Rich, how's the arm? I sure hope you can make the trip.

I really like MSilver's plan for the 3 and 4 day'ers. I'll repost his 4 day itineray (spel?) below:

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Just south of the village of Slate Run, there's a parking area on the west side of Pine Creek at the end of Navel Run Road. The Friday to Monday troupe can start there by doing a quick jog up along Navel Run for only about ¼ mile, to connect with the BFT at about mile 31.5, then head northward.

Friday (April 26): Navel Run parking area to Foster Hollow Pond (c. 9 miles). This stretch features a few relative ascents, including the notorious climb to the top of Gas Line Ridge, plus some glorious vistas that I expect you may want to stop and relish along the way. Later on Friday, you'll meet any 3-dayers (including myself) who start at the Pump House parking area (and/or perhaps elsewhere), at Foster Hollow Pond (mile 39.5) where there are two large campsites and an excellent, reliable spring.

Saturday:
Option 1: Foster Hollow Pond to Slate Run/Morris Run (c. 10.5 miles). I recall seeing some multi-tent camping areas at this location.
Option 2: Continue on to Chestnut Ridge (c. 13 miles total). I can check out the water situation beforehand at mile 9.96, where there's also a large camping area.
Anyone who can't start until Saturday can hook up with the rest of us at the Slate Run trailhead - or anywhere between there and the Slate Run/Morris Run confluence.

Sunday: Chestnut Ridge to ???. The going will be very easy from mile 9.96 to about mile 16, and we should all make good time along that stretch. Somewhere/sometime on Sunday, the Fri-Sun people (including myself) can bail out for the Pump House parking area and head back home (shuttle to Slate Run trailhead for anyone needing it). Those who continue on the trail can camp at any one of several spots between mile 21.5 and either side of Route 44, depending on how far you want to trek.

Monday: Final stretch to Navel Run Road parking area (shuttle as necessary, to Slate Run trailhead).
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How do these plans fit in for those thinking about making the trip? Splash, Fritz, Adventurist etc..?”

“Stikmon, I can't nail it down until my son decides if he is coming or not. If he comes we'll probably drive up early Friday morning and leave on Sunday. If not, I will probably do the whole trail, using 4 full days.”

“Sorry...Can't make it. Mrs Adventurist and I will be in Las Vegas that weekend looking at apartments. We still need to get a lot done before we put the house on the market in June... Going to be really busy in April and May.

How's everything going otherwise Pennsy? Having fun with that new camera? Wish I had your camera the other day for the 2 Bobcats in the backyard the other night...
I got within 50 feet of them. I think I interrupted their mating from the sound of it.”

“Adventurist...you loser!

Just kidding, wish you could make it....”

“Vegas?? Did I miss something?

Everything is going great now. I did practically nothing in Feb so I got a bit out of shape. But I am having a blast with the new camera and hitting the outdoors a lot more now. That would have been pretty cool catching those bobbies in the act.

Hey Fritz - you're a bp'ing stud now. If Ian comes along, you'll just have to do the whole thing in 3 days. ;o)”

“No problem...I think Don is a bit shy about meeting strangers. It would be different if I was there...meeting strange people...errrr... I mean new people new people is what I live for...and if they are strange...all the better...you folks have a great trip...If I get back to Pa, I will try to do it around a trip and bring my gear.”

“So whatcha doing the last weekend in April???”

“My arm is feeling a little better everyday. I can tell it's loosening up in my shoulder joint where it was sprained. I'll know more April 2nd when I go back to the bone doctor and I hopefully trade this sling for a lighter, less restrictive one.
I've been out day hiking at least 3 times per week on easy terrain just so I don't lose too much fitness that I worked hard at for the past year to get.
Splash, I'd love to go car camping or any kind of camping right now, but I wouldn't be able to do any camp chores with my arm bound up like it is so I'll just have to wait. I got pretty good at tying my boots with one hand. I've been working on a few cheap, light weight ideas for crossing streams high and dry and came up with some good ones. Yeah, the weather hasn't been that great, but I'd still like to be out there. I still hoping on making the BFT and as long as I have enough mobility back in my arm and no sling on, I plan on being there.”

“Hey Rich, we will definitely help you with the camp chores, so don't worry about that. Now that I have the same Hilleberg, I might even know how to set it up. Of course if the weather is great you'll probably use your tarp. But I'll bring the Hilleberg only because I didn't get to use it yet. I'm planning on going, but at this point I don't know what itinery I'll use. I'm sure that I'll meet up with everyone at the campsites most of the nights. MSilver's idea for the full trail was a good one.

Stikmon, fly in for the trip. One of us will be able to pick you up at the airport, for sure. Just let us know.”

“Pennsy.. Look at the Viva Las Vegas thread.”

“If I've done the math right...so far the pot is up to .06 cents (all from M.Silver I might add)! and before I give my final answer (I'm hoping to win the pot in case I want pictures), I'd like to pole the audience (I've already done the 50/50 and I'm saving my phone-a-friend until the trip gets closer)! I think I have my 15 year old son talked into this trip (he needs the miles for the backpacking merit badge) if it's okay with all of you...let me know. He has the experience for the trip (30 miles on the WRT last June in the rain).

I have a question for Pennsy...Are you planning to hike on Friday from Rt. 44 to Little Slate Run (mile 31.5) or to Foster Hollow Pond (mile 39.5)? I'm leaning towards ending up at Foster Hollow Pond on Friday night, but I'm not sure of my starting point Friday am. The rest of the itenerary (you forgot an 'r') looks real good. I plan to meet up with Landsurfer on Friday am. He's planning to do the whole trail begining on Thursday. I'm afraid if I start at Rt 44 and hump it to Foster Hollow Pond I'll live up to my Fine-Whine reputation! I'll explain how that came about on the trail...thanks to landsurfer!”

“Oh, Mr Silver has contributed more than 6 cents, and I've already grabbed it! ;o)

I'd like to follow MSilver's great 4 day itenerary (thanks for the spelling) and start at the end of Naval Run Road. Cross Pine Creek at Slate Run off rt 414 and make the immediate left for Naval Run Rd. It dead ends at a picnic area (?) with a short walk to the BFT 31.5 mile marker. I remember this because this is where I bailed out on the section I did in Jan.”

“Yes Pennsy, there are a couple of picnic tables there. The walk to the BFT is about a mile on an old logging grade? used now as a horse trail. You park, walk a little ways, cross the creek, walk a longer ways, and then reach the BFT in time to cross the creek again before starting the climb up to the Gas Line Trail, Jerald Trail and vistas of Hemlock Mt. This section was very pretty.”

“Hey Splash, You're pretty good at setting up the Hilleberg tent. If you remember the problem I had setting mine up on the link trail you were the one who figured it out. I'll bet your dying to use your Nallo 2 since you've had it a while now and haven't had the chance to use it. I should be able to do camp chores by then, but if my arm isn't healed enough to do simple things then it won't be well enough to make the trip. I'm hoping it will be.”

“The weather has been great the last two days. All I can think about is getting out and using my new Nallo. But I have too many family things going on; have to wait. May have to do a backyard campout.”

“I ordered the Wiggy's lightweight waders. Will probably test 'em before the Slate Run crossings on the BFT trip.”

“Heehee, we'll all show up with these waders and there will be 4 inches of water. Now if we brought plastic bags, the water level would definitely be three feet deep.”

“Why don't we just bring an inflatable boat and everyone can cross at once.”

“My Wiggy waders came today. Very light and rolled up, takes up very little space. Gonna try to test them tomorrow on the waterfalls trail at Rickett's Glen.

I like the boat idea, and since Splash 'volunteered' to do your chores Rich, she can carry it. ;o)”

“Who draws the short straw and carries the motor and anchor?”

“Ha! Very funny guys. I can see that Rich is planning on fishing; otherwise why the anchor? And forget the motor, I'd rather have a nice loud radio.

I have a small inflatable boat, but I'm not volunteering to blow the d$@M thing up.

AHHHHHHHHggggggg! Time to go backpacking!!!The kids had a sleepover last night. They were asleep after midnight, up again before 6.”

“No fishing for me if I'm able to make the trip. Too many extra things to carry. I may make a serious attempt at going ultralight.”

“I tried out the Wiggys Light Weight Waders this weekend.

First, they are quite light, about 8-9 ounces. They roll up nice and small fit easily into the mesh side pocket of my pack for easy access.

The website says one size fits all but they called me 4 days after I ordered and asked what size shoe I wear. I wear size 9 1/2 so they sent me a large. They slipped over my boots easily with no tugging at all. There was room to spare so a large will accommodate a bigger foot than mine. The extra room might be nice for winter trekking with overshoes.

The waders come up pretty high, just about up to my crotch and the draw string cinch cord helps keep them from sliding down. The rubberized sole is pretty thin so I wonder how durable they will be.

Now the actual tests....
Saturday I waded through a shallow stream at Ricketts Glen. The water was below knee level and calm. The bottoms of the soles have that black 'kinda sticky' stuff on them so I did not slip on any rocks. After wading around for a few minutes I took them off and everything was dry. Passed that test!

Sunday, I was up at Raymondskills Falls near Dingmans and really put them to test. I've been dying to get across this one stream for the last 2 years to get the only decent vanatage point for the lower falls. The water was above knee level threatening to go over the top of the waders, and the current swift.

I got across no prob, but a little bit of water seeped into the waders. Just enough to get my boots slightly damp. I did not do any seam sealing so I will try that this week.

Bottom line......
I liked that they are a snap to put on and take off, the weight and the little space they take. Hopefully, the seamsealing will stop and further leaking, but I'll still bring them along for the BFT stream crossings. I'd be more happy if they were around $20 instead of $50.

That said... JUST A FEW MORE WEEKS TO THE BFT!!!!!!”

“Pennsy: thanks for the review. I got my Wiggy's waders too -- they arrived yesterday. Tried 'em on in the house - easy on/off with a roomy (though not excessive) fit. I ordered them in large size to accomodate my insulated winter boots too. I cut and tied a piece of elastic shock cord to hold the arch and ankle more securely, so that (theoretically) the boot won't move around too much inside the wader, thereby keeping the rubberized bottoms where they should be. I'll try 'em out in the streams sometime soon.”

“Are you sure no water entered over the top of the wader? I would think that the seams should be already taped like they are on all featherweight fishing waders. If they aren't that's pretty inexcusable on a wader since home sealing probably won't last long for something that gets used under water. I've patched and sealed leaks on many pairs of waders and no matter what I use it never seems to last that long, but I use mine a lot. Still, I can't believe that the seams aren't taped in some manner.”

“The seams are indeed taped. My pants were bone dry so I can't see how water got in through the top. I'll have to do some more investigatin..”

“Here is the link to RichB's pictures of the Slate Run crossing on the Black Forest Trail (choose the last album, BFT 1995 pictures).

RichB's Pictures”

“I think we should use that "item" in the last pic to cross the stream.

I perused the rest of the galleries as well. Some great shots!

Splash, are you Rich's agent or something?? ;o)”

“Agent 99, at your service, Mr. Pennsy! Pretending to fall into creeks, get lost and drool over new gear are just ploys to gain everyone's confidence so I can learn your backpacking secrets, for Control. We have to get the edge over those dastardly Chaos agents!”

“And I'm Agent 54. I'll be the one doing surveilence from inside the bear can.”

“I'm still planning on a Thursday start. I am thinkng of hooking up with the BFT via the blackberry trail north of the pump station.
This will put me at about the 18.5 mile mark.Then hiking to the campsite above Navel Run road. Looks to be about 14 miles.
Whiney is planning to meet up me on Friday morning and I am assuming their are others with the same plan to start at Navel Run. Then follow the silver devels Itinerary.
Any thoughts or suggestions?”

“Oh, one thing I forgot to mention is that I am going to bring along a flouresent orange hat to wear on Saturday, as this is the opening day of the spring turkey season.Just as a precaution others might want to do the something similar.Wouldn't want to lose any of our flock!”

“Dose the 200th post win a prize?”