A brain on drugs

“What is your point, Pusher Man?”

“Steppenwolf”

“dont bogart that joint my friend, pass it on over to the mexican!








JOKE, Im not against or contributing to every ones drug use! But DAM people let them do what they want to, why should any one choose for us.

FREEDOM! is it freedom or a controlled enviroment. Technically we are not 100 % free! just thought to be!”

“OK, let's take the 'alcohol is legal so why isn't pot' argument to the next step.

I can buy Hustler at any newstand, so why don't we legalize rape.”

“Dude rape is completely different!

That would be causing harm to some one else, not just YOURSELF! Rape is not even close to legalization! think!”

“"OK, let's take the 'alcohol is legal so why isn't pot' argument to the next step.

I can buy Hustler at any newstand, so why don't we legalize rape.

gordon
01:00:52 PM
02/06/02




Do you really think that that would happen? Little weak, eh?”

“Obviously you have never taken a logic course!”

“gordo? Are you feelin OK?

Your analogy is...you're not serious, are you?

Actually, I didn't pose it as an argument, I posed it as a question. And I mean no offense but if that analogy is the best answer you've got, your position is very weak.”

“Guess my post is a little late...I hadn't seen the other responses...”

“Yeah, there is a difference.

Rape is hurting one person.

Drugs impact society at large, impacting thousands to millions every year.

Drug users are pathetic losers and a net drain on society. They only good thing about illegal drug users is they tend to die sooner and thus benefit society in that small way.”

“gordon's good at this stuff.”

“The argument is that BY FAR the greatest negative influence of drugs on society at large is a result of the production and distribution being forced into the hands of criminals, and the resulting "war on drugs" as we have attempted to enforce those laws.

Take all of that out of the picture and I ask again...in what way is responsible marijuana use by an adult in the privacy of his or her own home, different from responsible alcohol consumption?”

“Mr.fritz's good at this stuff.”

“gordan sez -

"Drugs impact society at large, impacting thousands to millions every year."


I agree. With the cost of perscription medication going through the roof, it's a wonder that my Grandma can afford them to keep her alive. What about the prozac that that a lot of kids are taking? Did you know that in England, they do not have cases of ADD/ADHD? I wonder why that is. The American drug compianies are, to some point, just as bad as the illegal pushers. How much have your medical increases been this year? Perscription medication costs have risen almost 25 percent in the last couple of years, by far there biggest increase. I think, IMHO, that there are bigger fish to fry when talking about drugs.


"Drug users are pathetic losers and a net drain on society. They only good thing about illegal drug users is they tend to die sooner and thus benefit society in that small way"

So all the kids on prozac and Grandma are all "pathetic losers"? I know I'm taking it to extreme, but I'm trying to point out that blanket statements like that do no good. Unless we can get together on issuse like this and not just stand by and throw barbs like that, nothing gets accomplished.

Good Day!”

“Fast food impacts society at large, impacting thousands to millions every year.

Fast food eaters are pathetic losers and a net drain on society. They only good thing about fast food eaters is they tend to die sooner and thus benefit society in that small way."”

“That gem from gordon is priceless.

This from the guy who says that "environmentalism is re-hashed communism".......
All 'o that dude's ducks ain't quackin'.

Marijuana is relatively harmless.
But because it is illegal many young people are messin' around with truely dangerous substances to get a buzz.
They will use chemical inhalants or medicines such as Nyquil or antihistamines which can cause REAL damage or sto one's heart.

It is a fact that cannabis/weed/marihoona can not and will not stop your heart as will alcohol, cocaine, opiates, nicotine(highly toxic!).
It can and will make people silly, and THAT can and will not be tolerated!”

“FREEDOM! is it freedom or a controlled enviroment. Technically we are not 100 % free! just thought to be!"
prowler
12:56:37 PM
02/06/02

---

Prowler, it depends on how you define freedom, I guess.

I don't think 100% freedom for everyone is practical. I don't think I would want to live in such a society.

There must be limits, wherever the actions (the "freedom") of one impacts the quality of life of another.”

“The recreational use is no diff, alcohol, pot or some pill forms (even over the counter cold meds). Or tobacco and coffee. It is the degree of use, and the consequences of use. When someone is willing to do harm to another or siphon family funds because they want/need/crave a substance, or the money that selling that substance brings, then there is real trouble. Those people will be trouble whether the substance is legal or not.

Should we legalize something because it is no worse than other legal substances? Maybe. I would like to see more focus on fixing the human need for addictive substances. The surgery thing was a joke, but there does seem to be a physical propensity for some people to get addicted to something, whether it is a wayward gene, or a chemical imbalance. We could become a genetically engineered thin, strong and non-addictive species.”

“When someone is willing to do harm to another or siphon family funds because they want/need/crave a substance, or the money that selling that substance brings, then there is real trouble. Those people will be trouble whether the substance is legal or not.

Splash
01:59:30 PM
02/06/02

---

Those people probably will be trouble either way, but perhaps if the substance was cheaply and legally available, there would be a lot less stealing and hurting others.”

“According to this poll, support for legalized marijuana is higher now than ever before.”

“A good friend of mine was murdered while fishing by a stoned low-life. His defense attorney is now arguing 1) he is not responsible for his actions because he had diminished capacity (marijuana) at the time and 2) because of chronic drug use he is too brain damaged to stand trial.

Prior to the murder, this low-life made all the same arguments put forth here to justify his 'innocent' drug use and that drugs are harmless.”

“Well, apparently you can't tell the difference between reality and a crock of sh!t made up by a slimey attorney to get his client off the hook.”

“Would it have been better if he were killed by a drunk driver?”

“Maybe fishing should be criminalized. Sounds dangerous.”

“My opinion...the guy IS a low-life, and is 100% responsible for his actions.

Does repeated use of marijuana cause brain-function impairment?

Did the laws currently on the books, and the efforts of law-enforcement, do anything to help your friend?

Is it possible that, had marijuana been legal, the killer might not have sunken to the same level of socio-economic depravity?”

“Doesn't matter what the attorney claims. He was stoned at the time on pot and is brain damaged by chronic use. The only bullsh!t involved here is the argument that drugs are harmless and legalization will make them more harmless.”

“Fritz:

Oh, I see. Had marijuana been legal this guy would be a paragon of virtue and a pillar of the community.”

“Sarcasm is fun but not very productive if you want to have a serious discussion.

Gordon, if you recall, I said I have always OPPOSED legalization. I am now reconsidering, and I am trying to understand the issues better. Much of what you have written is not very helpful.

I simply asked the question...could it be that the unnecessary expense of marijuana, combined with the social stigma, contributed to the killer's downward spiral?

And Buddur's question was excellent (paybacks for ya, Buddur!) -- do you consider those who consume alcohol to be all pathetic losers, and do you advocate going back to "prohibition" of alcohol? If not....WHY NOT? (How many are killed each year by drunks vs. potheads?)”

“Surely a crime like this and the novel defense would have been reported in the newspapers. Do you know where we could read more about this gordon?”

“I had the same thought, Violin, but I decided it didn't really matter.

Gordon, I don't know you, only what I've read in this thread, and based on that it seemed likely your story was, um, a parable of sorts.

But if you really did lose a friend this way, I offer my sincere sympathies.”

“Fritz, I have always believed that weed should be legal (for adults only, same restrictions as with alcohol). All the reasons that you give for it were the same reasons that have been around for 25 years. Why are you just now starting to change your mind?

Gordon, people need to be responsible for their actions, period. If you work a double shift and then kill someone while driving home because you were sleepy, you should be held accountable. The lowlife that killed your friend should be required to have a section of his brain removed since it has been compromised by his poor personal habits. It is not quite an eye for an eye, but you get the drift.”

“Did the expense of marijuana contribute to use? If it had been cheaper would he have used less? As for social stigma, it is apparent from most of the posters here they attach no stigma no illegal drugs and consider it a form of recreation -- like a cat-and-mouse game to played with the government. Use is considered a badge of honor with many of the younger generation.

We need to reduce substance abuse in our society.

Legalization will INCREASE drug abuse and all the associated problems, not decrease it.”

“Gordon! If you have smoked pot, you know it doesn't effect you the way you are saying it does, and if you haven't, you have no room to argue! Alcohol is way worse than pot... you don't see pot heads fighting, but the local redneck bar is full of bar brawls all the time... Sorry about the guy, but this has nothing to do with weed!”

“We need to reduce substance abuse in our society.

Absolutely! But how best to do that, and at what cost? Ultimately the individual must be held responsible, not the government.

"Legalization will INCREASE drug abuse and all the associated problems, not decrease it."

Legalization would almost certainly DECREASE many of the problems. The only problem that MIGHT increase is addiction, and that is where my own uncertainty comes in... Of those who don't use pot now, how many would start if it was legal? Of those who will start over the next 10 years, how many would start if there was no street punk that could profit from pushing it?”

“Street Punk pusher?

Where the hell do you get your info from... The movies?

Get real!

This isn't a movie, it's normal people who like to feel good!”

“If we knew in the 20's what we know now about booze today it would most likely still be outlawed.

The only thing I have seen a pothead attack was a bag of BBQ chips!!!”

“LOL Briar, exactly!

If it were legal, I still wouldn't smoke it. I have enough trouble with coffee and raisinettes! But I believe it is on par with cigs and liquor.”

“It's amazing the difference in possession penetalities between states...take Ohio and Pennsylvania for example.

Ain't fair!”

“What about pacifiers and glow sticks?”

“Hey!!!

Buddur and Tarp Rat. Can you two breathe a little turf and then go over to the AreYouARealProfessional thread. There is a test we want you to take. Just curious about something.”

“Tarp Rat:

Marijuana does increase violence tendencies about 15-20% of users. And chronic use does effect mental function. Not even NORML disputes that. Pot is as carcinogenic as cigarettes and is addictive, even the second-hand smoke. High Times magazine is not a reliable source of information.

Fritz:
I disagree legalization will decrease problems. It will generate the same problems alcohol does now. Instead of drunk drivers on the road you will have drunk drivers AND stoned drivers on the road. I hardly consider that progress. On a another website recently I saw a post from young firefighters bemoaning the fact they can't smoke a joint before coming on shift every day, arguing because it relaxed them it made them better firefighters. Scary!

When I was growing up there was an joke about never trust anyone over thirty. My fellow managers all agree now to never hire anyone under thirty. My company tries to hire students every summer as interns. Several of us are opting out of that practice because of the difficulty in finding a young worker who comes to work sober and on time every day willing to work and learn. We'll hire a retiree instead. Most of the students withdraw their application anyway when they learn they must pass a drug test.”

“Naa, glow sticks are too hard to keep lit!”

“Dude I am a Business Analyst and Mortgage Banker, What do you do?

And what is turf?”

“Tarp Rat, I was not trying to insult you. The thread that I was directing you to is funny. I didn't create the title, it really doesn't have much to do with someone's profession.”

“I already looked at the test, Ms.splash, and "cut the giraffe up so it fits in the fridge' wasn't a choice to the first question and after reading the second silly question I didn't care to go any further.

I simply believe that decriminalization, whether it be reformed laws or looking the other way, should occur. There's too many people in jail that don't deserve or belong to be there. Save incarceraton for those who need to be separated from society.”

“If you don't do drugs, why do you give a crap if it's legal or not?

It shouldn't really effect you if you're not buying?”

“Like I said drugs suck!”

“Splash is a dude?

I must be stoned or something.”

“One reason Pot has not been legalized is the lame arguments that dopers use to justify their criminal actions. I mean if ya lay around stoned all day how good an argument can you make?

Its always someone else causing the problem, not the users. They rationalize it is the Government's War on Drugs. Somehow the straight people are blamed. Consider this. If everyone stopped using illegal drugs the problem would go away. Scary concept, huh?”

“As long as a doper is just killing his/her own brain cells and not harming anyone else I have no problem with it. Unfortunately this is rarely the case.”