Who believes in Global Warming?

“

[whispering] "It's Leo!"”

“Belief in a peticular cause of global warming is not the same thing as the fact that the global temperature is warmer now than it was 10,000 years ago.

Homo Sapiens have surely benefited from the warming trend.
last edited: 10/28/05 6:34:47 PM”

“John Stossel reporting for ABC News asked

'Why worry about global warming,

if you want to golf, its better when its warm!'

Idiot.”

“Rule 42 (I believe it is) In The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy says:

DON'T PANIC.

Do not worry, nor fret as in any case an intergalactic expressway may be built inpromptu through your planet's space.”

“http://news.independent.co.uk/environment/article325016.ece

Interesting article by Joe Simpson, (Touching the Void) on the disintergration of the Alps with the rapid increase in temperatures.”

“Asking who believes in Global Warming is like asking who believes the earth is NOT FLAT.

It is not a belief.
It becomes a matter of whose "scientific" perspective will you trust?

The details will differ. But the facts are out there for all to see.

It is in the interpreting of the facts that we betray or reveal our belief systems.
YES>>> the planet is warming>>> YES/// we are PART of the reason>>>> Yes, there are other reasons and LOTS of details to consider.”

“Wait a few more years

We have seen anything yet

Weird and bizarre weather will be happening

I believe.

Yep,the tops of mountains like the Alps and other high mountains like Mount Rainier have essentially been frozen and are held together by being frozen for centuries

if they were to thaw out enough they would be as a melting snowcone

justing running down with frequent and large muddy slurry landslides.
last edited: 11/05/05 1:33:50 PM”

“I don't know, but it is getting colder. It was 30 degrees warmer a month ago.”

“Didn't see any facts to back up their claim in the article.

The reason I say that is it struck me as odd in the first place.

About 25 years ago, I was taught it doesn't snow much at the northern poll area, but the cold keeps old snow there. That was 25 years ago ... so did it start snowing like crazy 15 years ago and then stop again? Oh, and that was back when they were warning of a soon-to-be ice age.”

“Heavier snowfall and freezing rain events will increase the energy expenditure of caribou and reindeer when migrating and searching for food, and could lead to significant population declines over time (Gunn and Skoglund, 1997)”

“There have been 24 ice ages in the 2.4 million-year lifetime of the Earth. The last plunge into an ice age was 18K years ago. The one before that was 50K years ago and was the coldest of the 24. They are thought to be triggered in part by changes in the Earth's tilt on its axis (between 21.5 degrees and 24.5 degrees) and the elliptical nature of the Earth's orbit. There was a "mini ice age" that occurred between the 15th and 19th century that was a huge disaster in Europe. This was followed by a period of warming (like each of ice age before it). So it's an observed fact that climate change exists and is the result of natural phenomena. The speculation is that human activity contributes to this cycle in a way that is comparable to other mechanisms like the variable axial tilt of the Earth. I see a lot of writing that points to the symptoms of climate change and uses this as evidence that this change is caused by humans. This article is classic:

Evidence that humans are pushing up global temperatures is growing ever stronger, ranging from a shrinking of ice in the Arctic to a warming of the Indian Ocean, many experts say.

These are all symptoms of climate change. We know climate change exists as an observed fact and that it is driven my natural mechanisms. These symptoms point to climate change and not to a new contributing factor to climate change.
last edited: 11/22/05 1:37:31 PM”

“Sorry to say, but I have to agree with .... sarge. Tears in my eyes.

Although the burning of fossil fuels has many negative side effects, such as the high levels of mercury and the increases in respiratory illness, too much emphasis has been placed on global warming. The evidence is mounting that the world is going through a cooling trend but the connection between this trend and global climate change is tough to prove.”

“That struck me, too JS.

They really don't offetr any evidence in the article that humans are causing the climate change - they just keep mentioning evidence for the chang.

I've seen lots of good reasons, elewhere to show that human activity might play a major role. I see nothing like a smoking gun. In the article there is lots of weird language. I note also:

"Environmentalists say that any suggestion that humans are causing warming "beyond a reasonable doubt" might spur lawsuits against nations accused of doing too little."

Obviously this would be way different than "any suggestion that humans might be causing warming"”

“I thought the earth was around 4.5 billion years old, not 2.4 million. Still you bring up a good point and that is scientists are not sure if we as a species are affecting global temperatures. We have plenty of things that are damaging the environment and if we tackle these things I thing we would probably take car of the greenhouse gasses that may or may not be causing global warming. I find it disturbing that there is a lot of focus (at least in the new media) on an issue such as global warming, but very little on acid rain, where there is documented proof that humans are causing the problem. I say lets try and fix the problems that we already know exist, but still keep an eye on those that could potentially be problems.”

“There have been 24 ice ages in the 2.4 million-year lifetime of the Earth. The last plunge into an ice age was 18K years ago. The one before that was 50K years ago and was the coldest of the 24. They are thought to be triggered in part by changes in the Earth's tilt on its axis (between 21.5 degrees and 24.5 degrees) and the elliptical nature of the Earth's orbit. There was a "mini ice age" that occurred between the 15th and 19th century that was a huge disaster in Europe. This was followed by a period of warming (like each of ice age before it).

Where did you plagiarize this from?”

“At least you spelled plagiarize correctly.”

“Oh yeah, and I probably did get the age of the Earth wrong. I think the first ice age that we observe geologically was 2.4 million years ago, the start of the Pliocene.
last edited: 11/22/05 2:16:37 PM”

“It really doesn't matter, I was just nit picking. 8D”

“You are both wrong. The age of the earth is under 10000 years and oil is a myth created by "scientist" to further their argument by any means possible. While they play with their "numbers" we shall read from the book of fact know as the Bible.

I think you need to reflect upon your faith.

By the way is this trolling or hijacking?”

“By the way is this trolling or hijacking?”
mjc
3:25:48 PM
11/22/05
ignore this user

I think it's both. LMAO”

“I believe in global warming…


















And Santa and the Easter Bunny and the freedom of liberalism.”

“The world is near the end of a natural warming cycle which would culminate with the sudden melting of most of the polar icecaps which would send rivers of fresh water flowing across the surface of the oceans (fresh waters tends to float atop saltwater) resulting in disruptions of the ocean currents which moderate the world's weather so bringing on the next ice-age.

Human activities, mainly quickly increasing the levels of CO2 in the atmosphere,

will simply speed up the process

so, shortly now,

Very warm, then, very cold, I think, not necassarily believe!”

“Zac: I definitely agree that problems with demonstrated links to human activity, such as poor air quality and acid rain deserve more attention.”

“This is classic!

Got an email from seti@home.

Here's a snippit:

BOINC lets you donate computer time to multiple causes, divided up however you want. For example, your PC could spend 40% of its time searching for extraterrestrial life (SETI@home), 30% studying climate change (http://climateprediction.net),

So you can look for E.T. or look for global warming trends.

hehehe”

“It's all a bunch of bull. No such thing as global warming. Nope. Icebergs aren't melting. Storms aren't getting worse. Data is not accumulating. Man never set foot on the moon. It's all just one big hoax.




NOT!”

“I think it is selfish to think that in the BIG PICTURE, we might fight to stop our own natural destruction. Are we supposed to live on earth as it is forever? Would we have fought to stop the coming ICE AGE? The period that would have destroyed the beauty of the lush green planet, frozen it, carved glacial mountains and new lakes. So perhaps after the smog clears and the globe cools there will be the dawn of another era. People possible not included. But why should we be so arrogant that we should be included?
We could be just a blackhead on the planets history....
Some fodder to chew on...
last edited: 11/23/05 1:22:41 PM”

“First major glaciation: Late Archian(~3400 my)”

“Ice and glaciation are relatively very recent features of this world

and, 'tnprime', I sometimes ponder the future world with no or very few people also and suspect some of those alive now will survive until such a time of very limited numbers of people.

One thing is certain, many eons were required for the biodeposits (oil, coal, topsoil, limestone, even congregations of iron ore from bacterial action, etc.) to form

and the current gluttonous orgy of consumption has only been possible due to accumulated biodeposits

so any soon revival of humanity after the 'eminent crash' will need to occur without the benefit of the fortuitous biodeposits.

Of course, after about 500 million years, the biodeposits might be back close to their current levels, so allowing another generation or two to once again conduct a gluttonous orgy of consumption, if the survivors can hold out that long.
last edited: 11/23/05 2:56:01 PM”

“biodeposits ... orgies ... bacterial action ... lonesurveror, this is a discussion about global warming, not some sicko scientist fantasy.”

“It's not all about if the warming trend is happening. The argument that the earth wams and cools is not disputed by anyone. It's just a way for the naysayers to try to avoid the subject. Nearly all credible research on the subject indicates that humans are having a role in amplifying natural cycles. The climate is too complex for us to have a concrete case with our level of understanding. It's ludicrous for us to do nothing until we learn more. And even if the case was cast-iron there would still be people their head in the sand. There are many people out there, particularly Americans on the right side of things, who have taken upon themselves to try and pull down the theory of evolution, which anyone clear thinking person can see with their own eyes.
What makes you think people like this are capable of looking at the evidence of a human role in climate change and come up with a rational view on the subject?”

“Only people with Y2's POV are rational apparently. Is that rational?”

“humans have played a role in warming... but human nature is natural and part of the worlds evolution. So "speeding up the earths warming cycle?" you mean naturally contributing to it as humans would. All these millions of years to form the deposits of oil were worthless to anything/one until 100 years ago... perhaps the next glutonous species will devour something else that took eons to create... and it wont be oil. It will be part of nature however.”

“Interesting you would say that tnprime. You have mail.”

“Shafts of ancient ice pulled from Antarctica's frozen depths show that for at least 650,000 years three important heat-trapping greenhouse gases never reached recent atmospheric levels caused by human activities, scientists are reporting today.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/25/science/earth/25core.html?oref=login”

“Those ancient humanoids were slackers.”

“Hey, does that mean we can ice skate down the streets, like in Iceland? I think last year....they had a few days of freezing rain and ice....and for the first time in 25 years or something like that....that their citizens could ice skate everywhere....just like the good ole days.”

“How many times in our history have our scientist stated theories that have been totally wrong? At one time the best "thinkers" of the day thought the world was flat. Scientist are never wrong. :)They don't even know how old the planet is, they just have a theory and they CAN'T prove it.”

“yeah, they messed up that penicilin thing too, and going into space, that was wrong..... Heart transplants.... they obviously don't work.”

“Y2 - You sound like you are trying to argue jgeils' point. If that's the case, you pointed to things that did work. jgeils did not say that scientists are always wrong, that there aren't things scientists have done that are "right", therefore you didn't really argue his point at all. He is saying that they are wrong "many times in history" with their theories. Even scientists would not argue that. That is what a theory is all about, something that needs to either be proven, or revised.”

“Thank you Sarge.”

“Well my point was that they are also often right.”

“Of course they are often right. I just don't know they are about global warming and especially the cause. The planet obviously warmed up each time after an ice age before we were even here.”

“Actually jgeils - the idea that the world was flat was pre-scientific. It was a notion popular among some Biblical literalists who interpreted the Bible as describing a Flat Earth until this was disproved (actually there are still Biblical literalists who argue the earth is flat).”

“Tell the rest, about the dragons mouth and all that stuff...”

“pedxing - I wouldn't call them Biblical literalists. Maybe a few Biblical extremist nuts, but not literalists. That is too deprecating to too many people undeserving of the umbrella.”

“Everywhere I look the earth is flat. And florida is also on the edge of the world. boats go sailing out and I never see them again. Even airplanes disappear off the coast of Florida.”

“I guess there are variations of Biblical literalism and some are more strictly literalist than others. Certainly saying that the biblical reference to the "Four Corner's of the Earth" means the Earth has four corners is a form of literalism. However, your point is well taken - it is a position that the vast majority of people who consider themselves Biblical literalists would reject and would not want to associate themselves with.”