the pledge is unconstitutional!

“Here's the low down on the history of the pledge:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,56320,00.html

Copy and paste it, sorry.

mtn gal : No, HE is NOT my God. I do not believe there is a God. I feel that you can achive a spritualness without having a religion. The universe is a pretty big place and we have yet to even to begin to understand it. I have no problems with people practicing whatever, just don't jam it down my throat. This country has a lot of double standards. For right or wrong, this person is pointing out this. We need not to jump to conclusions about this, but understand that if we are to practice what we "preach", that part must go......”

“laqtis To see the logic of leaving God out of the equation, consider this:

Frog + Princess’s kiss = Handsome Prince (fairy tale)
Frog + Chance + Millions of years = Handsome Prince (science
By definition, no one knows what lies outside their tiny circle of knowledge. To claim YOU know there is no God is to claim you have exhaustively searched every part of every universe and dimension with an infallibly accurate method of detecting every non-physical entity that could possibly exist. The claim that God has taken the initiative and chosen to reveal himself to some people is not nearly as unbelievable.
Quickly,close your mouth,I would not want you to choke.I have never had anyone shove anything down my throat.What does that feel like? HE IS MY GOD!:)”

“Solly, just got a chance to catch up on this story...it doesn't concern Canada....yet. I feel like such a fool for spreading false rumours.....but then again, maybe I'm clairvoyant.”

“I find it curious that people who preach Brotherhood are making death threats against the doctor who brought the suit.

That says it all for me.


"Love thy neighbor (like I say to) or I'll kill you!"

Whatcha say, Mung, old boy?”

“hey Aero, with my $15 price tag, do you think everyone in this country could afford to be under me? guess again!

Gear Slut, "Billy Graham oders," LMAO! niiiiice.

i've always thought this pledge was dumb-dumb-dumb-dumb-DUMB! i used to refuse to say it in elementary school, all by myself. it seems antiquated to say the least...i think the fuss being made right now is pretty kewl. i don't really care whether or not it's found to be unconstitutional, because it does seem a little fussy to take everything so literally...what really counts is that everyone's having to reconsider what the pledge really means, and if they believe in it.”

“Excellent post, Lyra. Yes, that is one of the greatest aspects of living in the USA. Nothing is static and all is open for re-inspection, just as it should be.”

“I just threw you into the mix. You couldn't be worse than SATAN (or could you?)

I remember in 2nd grade, standing and mumbling the Pledge in unison each morning. Now when I hear the Pledge a tear comes to my eye as I recall Mrs. Wymore whacking me with a ruler for pulling Missy Peterson's hair. Eat paste, be happy.”

“As for the pledge = idolatry statements. That is ignorant. No one is worshipping the flag, it is simply a statement of loyalty. The flag happens to be the symbol of this nation. Old Glory = USA. get it? A pledge of support to the nation that allows you to hold the views of your choice and air them, that allows you to believe in the god or no god of your choice, that allows you to rise or fall to the level of your choosing.

The pledge isn't compulsory and a lot of people just don't say the under God part. I have no problem with you leaving it out as long as I can leave it in.”

“thanks, Dunadan! you get a discount.

i bet you just did that so she'd hit you with the ruler ("yes, yes, harder, harder!"), huh Aero?
;-)”

“lyra-I bet that's what all those congressmen were thinking while they were reciting the pledge on the steps of the Capitol yesterday.”

“I am not too concerned with the 9th Circuits ruling until the Supreme Court reviews (assuming Cert. is granted).

Should be an interesting opinion by the High Court.”

“This is stupid.

First off . . .if the "under God" wasn't put in until 1954, and wasn't an integral part of the pledge to begin with, then what could possibly be the fuss about taking it back out again? No biggie.

Folks who believe in God can worship him/her/it at their own churhc/synagogue/sacrificial altar on their own time. Why the bother to include ""god" in a declaration of loyalty to my country.

I am absolutely loyal to my country. But I wouldn't want to confuse that with loyalty to a God.

Futhermore, and perhaps more importantly, its kinda stupid because, of course, THERE IS NO GOD.

To paraphrase Gov Jesse "the Snake" Ventura (who otherwise is a blithering saphead)"belief in a God or religion is a crutch for the weakminded".

As I get older I am more more convinced that this is true. The vast majority of folks who believe are utter morons. I say this knowing full well that 70%+++ of the American population profess some sort of religous conviction.

What a bunch of blithering sapheads.”

“Dam Gear Slut - yer pretty defensive bout this religion stuff huh?

I nerver said anything about how it should be or who should make the rules. The fact is the majority of laws have a basis in some type of religion. Seems thats where the basic rules of right and wrong came from.(Actually I don't know that it's a fact)

Personally - as far as the pledge goes, it's a patriotic thing with me and saying it is part of being a good citizen, with or without god in it.

I am very conservative but do not beleive in any type of prayer in public school. If you want yer kid to pray in school send them to religious schools.

Take all the religion out of goverment, just don't insert aetheism(sp) in its place, which is just as bad in my opinion.”

“Aero gets the award for the best post: "eat paste be happy". LMFAO!

Awww, don't worry, Lyra, your post was a close second.

It really IS interesting to reexamine something like the Pledge, done daily for years and years and never really thought about. Whoda thunk a socialist would come up with something like that?”

“Thanks, Lee. The sap keeps the rain off my head during storms.

This is an example of secular deism. The belief in God is so ingrained in the culture and the use of the "Under God" or "In God We Trust" has been used for so long in the public discourse that it no longer is a religious profession. Reciting the pledge with these words is a sign of patriotism, not religious belief.

Kind of like when you listen to or play Mozart or Beethoven. Most of the music has religious themes, but many nonreligious people sing it for the beauty involved. Many don't think twice about the content.

This is a red herring issue. If this liberal judge hoped to make the world safer for the nonreligious, then it has backfired. Things will be more difficult.”

“Uh-oh, am I reading threats, now? People, get back on one of the gear threads before this whole thing starts to blow!!!!”

“whatever, kleetn...you're on my #&%!$ list.


”

“Munga - Good for you. practice, worship, slaughter animals on the altar, it's all good. I'm glad that you feel so strong about it. For most, religion gives people a set of rules to which to govern there lives. Gives an answer to to burning human question "what happens when I die?" and give explaination to the unexplainable "It's Gods will". For the most part, organized religion is a good thing. I was Christian until the age of 11. Went every weekend. From what I can tell, there is more evidence of a natural, galactic process going on here than a divine thing a happening. George Carlin has a pretty good rant about this. For a good chukle, catch the HBO special that's playing.

Now to disprove myself. I read that in a few years, we will be able to create, in a lab, conditions close to building a galaxy and one might happen. Creatorism? At that point, yes I could believe in it.”

“Drop the weiner, Ralphie.”

“Drop the weiner, Ralphie.”

“SSSOOOoooo... you're saying that god is a weiner and we shouldn't use Pledge on him/her/it? Them really is fightin words.”

“you'd better keep a close eye on that squirrel.”

“One of the more common statements used in the U.S. military is "For God and Country", used in relevance to a particularly dangerous mission or such. It helps to have something to believe in when you face danger and an uncertain future.
God or no god, the U.S. is still a great place to live.”

“Sooo, little Kleety doesn't have to believe in God, because he has a squirrel.....”

“the judge who wrote the opinion was nominated by a republican president (Nixon), not a democratic president.

lawyers had nothing to do w/ this, the complainant was pro se.

the 9th Circuit may clean up its own mess with an en banc proceeding and it may never even get to the supreme court, would be a quicker resolution.

it is untenable to ban all religion references from public life, it is a part of our culture. i'm more concerned with continuing religious tolerance in america and resisting the efforts of some right wing religious beliefs to transfrom america into a theocracy. we need to insure all beliefs can practice freely here without intimidation.”

“well said, jmitch”

“Its good to see the court shake the tree now and then.

That'll usually knock some of the nuts to the ground.

lyra and areo..........
Hell, its too close for ME to call.
Its people like them that make life matter.

Its nice to know that bacpac is out there fightin' for my freedom.
I'll just sit back and relax.”

“Curiouser and curiouser.”

“jmitch, well said. "With Freedom, equality, justice, and tolerance for all."”

“Saw on TV last night that WVa Sen. Robert C. Byrd stood up and declared in his inimitable drawl, "I've pledged allegiance to the flag, many times, and so have all of us. Judge, come and arrest us."”

“Funny, I don't think all Athiests are stupid. Then why do Athiests assume all who believe in a higher power are stupid?

You can't prove it and I can't prove it. But if it were proved then what would be the point of faith?”

“I wish we could all just unclench our POO MUSCLES and get on with life!”

“The whole issue isn't about whether you're an atheist or not. It's about keeping religion out of government. People have the freedom to worship whatever they want outside of government and that should be good enough.”

“Yeah, Bobby Byrd!

He gave us the Otter Creek Wilderness Area!”

“Aero is the funniest man alive and I pledge allegiance to him. However, if Lyra gives me a discount too, then I will change my allegiance.”

“Did you know that there is a day set aside in this country just for atheists,to honor and remember them?











It's on April 1st!:)”

“WHERE THE OUTRAGE???? I said Sapheads and you said . . ."fixin' a hole where the rain gets in".

I said "blithering" and you said "I don't think all aethists are stupid."

Where's the anger??!!!! To misquote Rodney King, my personal hero, "why are we all just getting along??"”

“And Futhermore . . .

I pledge allegience to whatever Lyra and Newgirl are up to.”

“Shame on you Mongo, A truly righteous "believer" would have nothing but kind things to say!”

“I want to see Newgirl making use of Lyra's discount...”

“What's this discount stuff?”

“I dunno. But I am willing to pay FULL price . . .for the exclusive rights.”

“As said before consider the context when "G-d" was added. It was the end of the 2nd world war, not only was the nation trying to differentiate itself from the "godless" but also, I suspect to overcome the fear that still loomed, and to counter some doubt about what the nation had done. 'Course historically, victors have often claimed that the god(s) were with us.”

“aaaahhhhhhahahahaha!! newgirl and lee, you crazy little monkeys are toooo much. :-D i AM getting a little tired of my job...”

“And there we have it . . . Lyra is ready for a change of pace. In Lyra we trust!”

“as well you should, because i'm no lyre! i promise!

*ting!*

(that was the sound of my halo.)”

“Okay, so what's the cost and what's the discount!!?”

“it makes me giggle so many people are getting their knickers in a twist when the majority of Americans can't correctly recite the Pledge of Allegiance, don't know how to correctly fly a flag, and DON'T vote...

bunch of hypocritical morons we are”

“Oh yeah, most Americans don't go to church regularly or tithe regularly either...”

“Halo?

Hail No!”