Litterbugs

“This summer, I did more mountain biking than I have for the past 5 years and it really allows you to see a lot of terrain. One thing I noticed that is striking is the increase in littering here in Northeast PA. On our watershed land this summer I've seen loaded diapers in the water along with a car transmission, old toilet, tires, furniture, appliances, bottles, cans, on and on. You name it and it's there. The roadsides are just as bad and there's enough aluminum cans to rebuild the entire aircraft fleet. Old construction materials, tires dumped on the gamelands and even burned out cars. The Dept. of Transportation just bought 2 machines that pick up litter on the roadways it's getting so bad. I could go on and on, but I think I made my point, but what's going on? Is it only around here or are people this dirty everywhere? Our watershed land is our drinking water supply and even the water company doesn't care. I'm starting to think that people just have no respect for anything anymore.”

“People today, some - not all , are becoming more careless with there trash. Sounds like someone has found a place to dump there jumk. Outta sight, outta mind?

Here in the Detroit area, our contractors just find a street deep in the hood with no street lights on and up there junk. Some people down there wake up with a junk pile on there front lawns. Too bad people don't know any better....”

“Several states have created more jobs and prevented as much as 70% (statistic from college conservation class) of road side trash and litter with the “bottle laws”. Of course, with any conservation law there are also some disadvantages. So who lives in a "bottle law state”? Do you like it or hate it?”

“What exactly is a bottle law? Do mean a recycling effort or a littering fine?”

“A bottle law requires the consumer to pay a small (.05 or .10 cent) deposit on each can/bottle at the time of purchase. When the consumer returns the container to the store, they get the deposit returned to them. I used to live in Oregon, and we would have church or school groups come around to our houses on a 'bottle drive' to raise funds for thier groups. The program did help with recycling and keeping cans and bottles cleaned up.
Now I live in Nevada which does not have a deposit return. Recycling in this state is not a priority at all. I have heard, but cannot verify, that the local recycling company that comes and gets the stuff takes it to the landfill anyway, and does not recycle it.
I agree with the trash problem though. It does seem that their is more junk laying around the woods and highways these days.”

“Michigan has a bottle deposit porgram and IMHO, it works. I remember back in the day, highways and street were peppered with bottles and smashed glass. A real mess! That program has helped! Hasn't cured all of the problems though.....”

“Where I live in CA, you almost never see a can or bottle. The few that do get dumped get picked up almost immediately by homeless or nearly homeless people gathering them up to make some money. However, I do notice a lot of other kinds of litter. Back in the ol' days, there used to be a huge anti-litter campaign nationwide. Remember the people throwing a bag of trash out their car window, only to have it land at an Indian's feet as a tear rolled down his cheek? Kinda sappy, but the campaign worked. I think nowdays, people grow up without anyone ever telling them it's NOT OK to throw a gum wrapper in the street. Seems to me I heard that the "Don't Mess With Texas" anti-litter campaign was hugely successful.”

“In Bamer our most advanced concept of recycling is making it from Monday to Friday with the same pair of underwear so I know someone can define these programs more accurately. But the idea is that plastic or glass beverage containers are worth 3 to 5 cents. Of course, you pay an extra 3 to 5 cents for the product. In the states that have these programs, a recycling company can pick up your plastic or glass containers and pays you a half price per container and deliver them to the local recycling facility for the full refund. Of course, you can deliver the containers yourself for a full refund. At least that was the original concept. I've heard that state and local gov't have got involved and screwed up the whole process, which has discouraged people from recycling. I'm sure someone can give a better explanation. I know Michigan and California had/has bottle laws.”

“I am a very slow typer.”

“Forgot to add that many/most folks that I know of around here just put their cans & bottles in the curbside recycling container that gets picked up every week or two - it's not perceived to be worth the hassle to take 'em in for the refund.

Also, a related issue is that many areas have a way for people to dispose of odd items like old toilets, small appliances that no longer work, etc. so they don't get dumped where they shouldn't. In my city, you can arrange for the garbage company to come to your house once a year to pick up 3 cubic yards of almost whatever you can drag onto your driveway. For free.”

“How about the people who throw cigarette butts out the window while driving especially during a severe drought didn’t anyone ever explain to them what an ashtray is for. I was behind one guy recently who threw is butt out of the window while driving through a state forest right in front of a sign that said “Fire Danger EXTREME” I couldn’t believe it.”

“In some areas here the ciggie butts at the stoplights look like snowdrifts. I've watched cops chuff 'em out the window, and I know cops aren't supposed to be smoking in patrol vehicles. Just more nonenforcement.”

“We don't have a bottle law here; we have extremely high property taxes. One way to keep those down is to do extensive recycling rather than pay to truck the garbage out of state. Our town used to charge for every bag of garbage picked up. The recycling got so ingrained that the town lifted the bag charge. I usually put one garbage can out a week for a family of four because I take about 5 cans of stuff to recycling each week. We don't have a lot of litter on the sides of the road here because so many civic groups go out and collect it. I think it helps raise awareness along with the extensive anti-littering teaching that goes on in the schools here.

Closer to the big cities, the litter is much worse. Do Tri-State city people care less about not-littering, or is garbage harder to get rid of in cities so people give up trying? Is there an immigrant effect (are some immigrant groups more likely to litter?) in the cities? I don't know the answers to these.

The areas where Rich is seeing litter is closer to the heartland. I think that it is ignorance behind it. Maybe the schools and civic groups are not making non-littering a high profile issue, like they do in some other regions. The litter is probably local although the ATV damage is probably more likely to come from Jersey and Philly where there is no place for suburban idiots to run around in their toys.”

“On my last hike in PA, we saw a diaper and a formula can left in a fire ring. How #&%!$ing gross can you get?! They could carry it in along with the baby, right?

They use prisoners to clean up roadsides here and I can’t say that’s it’s any worse than I remember along the road but there is a lot of dumping in remote spots. Too many municipalities limit how much you can put out at curbside. It saves money but is shortsighted as many people just find anyplace to dump it. Same thing with forcing people to pay their garage to dispose of used tires. That should be included in the price of new tires.”

“Violin, aren't tires recycled?”

“I do a lot of trail trekking in our National Parks. That's me. I just like it. For the past couple of years, I have become disgusted enough to carry a plastic bag with me and pick up some of the blatant tossings of others. If everyone would donate just one day of trail maintenence a year, it would make a HUGE difference.
No matter how many "do not litter" signs and imposed fines are out there, there are those that will do it no matter what. Our National and State Park Services just don't have the staff to clean up after every slob that pays their 3 bucks to get into a park. Congress passed a law that all Parks and Recreation facilities must be self supporting in order to stay open. Harsh budget cuts came in close behind that. So, there went the money to pay the kids $5.50 an hour to clean up after everyone else. I was called the self rightous fool (here on this board) for doing this. But, when you are out there on the trail and see volunteers doing cleanups and maintenence, have you ever just stopped for 30 seconds and THANKED them ???? And, after a 8 or 10 mile hike, you could use the 30 minutes of "warm down" time to walk around and pick up just a few cans or a little bit of trash in the area. (I'm not talking about tires and major dumping here) It's good excercise and limbers up the stiff back and knees.
- - - just my dos centavos - - -”

“I pick up what trash I see on the trail (and I would guess most people here do too) but I just couldn't bring myself to pick up that used diaper.”

“Every time our scout troop goes hiking, we take a pack of garbage bags. On one particularly memorable trip in Ocala I think we came out with 25 full bags of garbage we picked up. In one day. Sick. We do this every place we go, hiking, canoeing, whatever.

I forget how many bags of garbage we picked up just at Stafford Beach campsite on Cumberland Island.”

“Violin, next time, pour some of your "multi-fuel" on it and cauderize the entire area !!!
I'm with ya on that one, budroe !!!”

“trailhound
people are really good about recycling the aluminum cans around here (B'ham) because they can make a little money. The problem with the plastic bottle is that you can't get a truck or trailer big enough to haul enough of the plastic to cover the cost of the gas it takes to drive to the recycling center.”

“If asking people to help out and thank those who do makes one a self rightous fool then I and about 40 scouts in my troop are guilty as charged.

I teach the scouts to carry garbage bags and pick up trash wherever we are, clean out fire rings, and do light trial maintenance in the form of clearing blowdowns.

In 2001 on our hike of the Florida Trail through Osceola NF over 24 miles we filled the back of a full sized Ford to overflowing with trash. Thank God for the logging roads (never thought I'd EVER say that) as they allowed us to pull out the majority of what we found.

We have a saying
"We didn't put it here put we sure aren't going to leave it here."”

“Yeah, my statement about Bama is true about the entire south. When it comes to the environmental 3Rs were about a decade behind the rest of the country.”

“Hmmm...I see Treebait beat me to bragging on our boys.”

“I think you know that Cumberland Island is in my backyard. My personal thanks to you, HPM and your troop of Scouts for a job well done!!!!!
(Oh yeah, the JSO does have a no-smoking rule in their cars and while in the public eye)”

“They tried to get a bottle bill passed in PA years ago, but it never made it to fruitation if I remember correctly. It's really needed though. They built a new Amphitheather on a ski slope a few miles from where I live and the litter on that road after a concert is incredible. I ride my bike there frequently and after a Rap concert the litter and broken glass is even worse for whatever reason. They did start picking it up on that road, but just can't keep up. I even rode out of the woods one day after fishing and a concert was about to start. I got out near the main road and there was a large group of people men and women relieving themselves on the side of the road. Good thing I was one my motorcycle to get by that group faster.”

“suck!!! end of story.

I was driving down the road and my napkin blew out my window...I stopped and went back to get it...

But I'm practicing now, so that in my next life,I can walk on water. I wanna be a God, when I grow up in my next life.”

“Today when I came home from the bank this car drove by and whipped out a cup of some drink and I just wanted to beat there @ss!!!!!

I don't know what I would do if I saw someone on the trail litter I would go off real bad!!!!!

8|”

“just pick it up and hand it back, saying "I think you dropped this"”

“Ya and smash there face with it!

8)”

“The thing that leads to a lot of major dumping in my area is that if you have anything large or environmentally dirty (Engine parts, used oil, etc.) it's nearly impossible to get rid of it legitimately. EVERY auto repair place is supposed to take used oil, for example, but every one I've ever gone to refuses to take it. So, I'm forced to drink it.
Actually, after giving up on trying to hand in the oil, I just drive up and leave the container right next to their garage door. I have never seen them throw it in with the regular garbage, or simply spill it on the street- They're watched for that kinda stuff, I guess, and they're forced to dispose of it properly.”

“don't you...when is the last time you saw Evergreen???

Violence is not the answer...all we need is love...and if you can't be with the one you love...love the one your with.

Words to live by.”

“I live pretty close to the city of Detroit. You can almost tell when you hit the city limit. Just ahalf mile from my house, there's crap trash and junk littering the streets. One time when I was in D-Town, while stopped at a stop light, saw a guy dumping motor oil down the storm drain. I said What are you doing? He said What else you suppose to do with it? Funny, but very sad. I just think that either people think someone else will clean it up or they just don't care. Maybe they grew up with no respect for nature??”

“If you can't be with the one you love, love the sound of a litterer's nose splintering under the force of your knuckles.”

“Littering sucks!

8|”

“Walk softly and carry a big stick...preferrably hickory...nothing like a good peice of hickory.”

“I never even mentioned the litter left behind by the ATVer's. They've turned hiking trails to double rutted beer can trails that lead to a new filty firerings that just keep popping up everywhere. If they put up signs to keep them out they tear them down. They put up gates and they tear those down too. These people seem never to be satisfied unless they can destroy something. You couldn't do better if you went out and devised a plan for maximum destruction, maximum impact and maximum disturbance to wildlife and the land. I've never seen a group of outdoor users that have more disregard for the outdoors and other people than this group.”

“Argghhhh! Motor oil in the storm drains! Where do these people think that their drinking water comes from. This summer the drought was so bad that the newspapers were reporting that the Passaic river was almost 90% sewage and was the sole source of drinking water for several communities. But the water was treated before being piped out so it was okay to drink, until further notice, said the reports. I was so thankful to live in a town without Passaic River drinking water. But if someone dumps motor oil into the storm drains in my town, it could make its' way to the town aquifer. We need a zero tolerance on littering and a continuing education campaign for people who still don't get it.

And a heavy littering surcharge on all ATV registrations, IMHO.”

“If you beat the crap out of a litterbug and they die on the spot, isn't that littering????”

“90% sewage, that sounds terrible. It's even more amazing that they can get drinking water from that. Yuck!”

“Nah, a body just becomes fertilizer.”

“With the ever increasing frequency of drought conditions in this area don’t be surprised if the Tocks Island Dam comes back to life.”

“is when Im on the trail knowing theres agroup ahead of me, Im trying to stay back but after finding there candy rappers, "Sqeeze It", bottles I get pist and begin DEATH MARCHING to catch up w/ them.

When i do, what do ya know its a bunch of YOUNG kids w/ there dads that dont know a thing about "Leave NO Trace"!!

What would you say? I just keep it to my self and moved on(because of the young kids), but I would love to stick the trash up there parents arses for teaching them good habbits!!!! The other thing that ticked me off was that the parents where behind the kids trailing them, and they didnt bother picking it up.”

“They need to keep the dams we have in service. In my area, I can think of 4 reservoirs taken out of service in the past 10 years. With the development taking place on the watershed land it makes you wonder if it will effect the ability of the reservoirs to recharge themselves. There may be problems down the road, but nobody in charge seems to care since they're making so much money selling off this land on the watershed. The legislature refuses to pass laws to protect the water supply.”

“ATV's on hiking trails...two words...piano wires.

My friend and I were mtn. biking on a biking/hiking trail. We were on a section that was going downhill....I was leading, not going too fast. Luckily I saw the piano wire tied across the trail between two trees. Some jerkoff, probably someone who got scared or hit by a biker tried to hurt innocent people.”

“That's dangerous. They used to put piano wire on roads in World War II to bring down jeep and motorcycle patrols. The Allies made a jeep with a large piece of metal welded to the front to cut the wire before a driver would hit it.”

“A person couldn't be more miltant vs. littering. But don't gimmee this "people today" b.s. What about when the NY mets won the World Series back in '69. The crowd stormed the field and ripped it up to score a piece of Shea Stadium dirt. That kinda thing wouldn'ta happened today. People have ALWAYS sucked.”

“It's funny this thread came up today. Yesterday, as I was going for a ride, I saw some punk kid whip his 32 oz. taco bell pepsi out his car window on the street. I took down his license plate, and as he passed, I yelled you're busted! I've had it with these people. We have laws that are meant to deter such actions, so I called the police, gave the info., and told them I'd be happy to bear witrness against the dude.

BTW - I want to commend the Michigan Mountaineers. Every time I hike with them, they bring garbage bags, and pick up all trash along the trails (including diapers, but we usually save that for Birch). They are a great example for all of us.”

“Thanks for the reminder, Buddha Bear, I should start to do that on my dayhikes in the NW Jersey area.”

“Its a shame that when you walk along a nice beach that you have to see trash along it!

Man people who litter just flat out need a @ss kicken!!!!!

8|”

“Dumped farm fish surface off Van. Island
Three-kilometre stretch of dead salmon pose unacceptable risk, society says

Nicholas Read
Vancouver Sun

Friday, September 20, 2002

A three-kilometre-long slick of dead, rotting Atlantic salmon was discovered earlier this week by scientists researching ground fish west of Vancouver Island.

The salmon, which numbered about 250,000 and weighed more than 900 tonnes, were dumped there by a Campbell River fish farm after an algae suffocated the fish.

And that presents an unacceptable risk to the wild marine environment and the ground fishery, says the the head of the Canada Groundfish Research and Conservation Society.

In a letter sent to federal Fisheries Minister Robert Thibault on Thursday, society executive director Bruce Turris said: "How could the federal government permit as much as a quarter of a million pounds of dead, exotic, possibly diseased, antibiotic-laced fish to be allowed to foul and damage important fishing grounds and habitat?

"If a trawl vessel had caught those dead Atlantics in a commercial trip, it could have contaminated the entire catch."

On Monday, Grieg Seafood B.C. Ltd. of Campbell River dumped 250,000 salmon -- about 919 tonnes -- off the coast of Nootka Sound after receiving approval to do so from Environment Canada in consultation with the Department of Fisheries and Oceans.

The fish, which represented 30 to 40 per cent of Grieg's stock, were killed by naturally occurring algae that suffocated them, said company environment manager Tim Davies.

He said the fish died within 24 hours and the farm's nets in Esperanza Inlet on the west coast of Vancouver Island were in danger of sinking or breaking under the weight.

Consequently, the company sought permission from the federal government for an emergency ocean dump. Normally, dead fish are taken to the Lower Mainland for rendering, said Davies, but there wasn't time.

"It took us a week to dispose of 919 tonnes at sea. That would have taken at least four weeks to do by truck, if not more.

"And all that time those dead fish were on the bottom of the nets attracting other wildlife, which could have harmed other fish and fish habitat in the area."

Turris said a society research vessel spotted a 3.2-kilometre swath of floating dead fish near Nootka Sound on Monday.

"The skipper said there were floating salmon as far as the eye could see," he said.

The vessel, which is doing a deep-water assessment survey of groundfish, said its nets also brought up 71 dead Atlantic salmon and several species of groundfish with salmon in their stomachs.

Turris said such bottom-dwelling species as long-spined thorny-headed rockfish and sable fish (also known as black cod), don't eat Pacific salmon as part of their normal diet, and that Atlantic salmon could have a deleterious effect on them.

"The point is that we don't know whether or not the discarding of such a large quantity of Atlantic salmon will foul the habitat. Those fish are clearly exotic. We don't know if they have disease. We don't know what medicines they may have been taking; what antibiotics may have been used."

Otto Langer, director of marine conservation for the David Suzuki Foundation, said the dumping sets a "bad precedent."

"Fish farmers seem to be immune to the Fisheries Act," Langer said. Under normal circumstances, the act forbids dumping of dead fish at sea.

"Raised or farmed salmon do have higher levels of contaminants in them," he added. "They're not the cleanest fish to dump in the ocean.

"We think it's a loose permit and it was rushed."

Fisheries and Oceans spokeswoman Christian Coté said a permit was issued because the situation was an emergency, and because the fish were not diseased. Therefore, she said, the department decided dumping the fish did not present an undue risk to the environment.

Turris disagrees. "It's certainly a risk we don't think the [fishing] industry should have to face especially when there are other options for disposing of fish that would minimize risk to wild resources."

He said samples of the dead salmon have been taken and will be presented to the DFO for analysis when the society's research vessel completes its research early next week.”