First hand report from lost hiker in the N.H.

“One of the best regional boards is the AMC board. I learn a lot from it, and there is no better source for useful, current and on target information about events and hiking in NH's White Mountains. A regular poster, was the subject of a big news story when he was missing for a few days. If you click this link, you will see how the story got discussed and see read the hiker's report when he returned.

http://appalachia.outdoors.org/bbs/messageview.cfm?catid=3&threadid=1237&STARTPAGE=1" target="_blank"> lost hiker thread ”

“Ped --

Because I am a member of the AMC, I get the magazine . .. .

In this months issue (which has the article re: the lost hiker), the cover photo is of Algonquin in the ADK. Snow covered. Wher I was this past weekend.”

“Actually Lee, this is a guy who came out just a day or two ago... not the NPR reporter in the magazine. This was much more serious... hypothermia risk of death around Dry River/Eisenhauer.”

“OH!!

I gotta hop on the link then! Thanks.”

“That is a pretty amazing story.

He was prepared, experienced, and aware of the potential problems, and he still fell into them one by one.

At the same time, he managed somehow to do what had to be done to survive at crucial points along the way - maybe not with the utmost of grace, but through some intuitive sense.

Thanks for posting it. There are lessons there for us.”

“Ped ped ped ped --

I got questions.

I signed up to join the AMC board but hav not rec'd my password.

Have gone to lots of wilderness first aid thingys, have had hypothermia myself (relatively mild, first stage, had not lost my marbles).


QUESTION:

Do you have any idea how it was that this guy went 36 hours in a mid-level hypothermic state?????

That is . . .from the time he set up camp (probably before) the first night, through the time he walked out . . .he (by his own telling) was very drifty at CRITICAL junctures.

That is . . .(I am not getting this out very well).

If you are in such a state that you BLOW getting dinner and adequate shelter one NIGHT ONE . . .how the everloving bejeezus do you go on from there?

Why didn't he just die??

He got up and had food on morning 2 (which undoubtably helped) and then walked all day . . .but then at 4:30 HE CHECKED OUT again . . .got drifty . . .woke up with one shoe on and one off, had hallucinations . . .

I thought Hypothermia was progressive . . .yet he seemed marginally functional . . .then petered out by days end.

Weird story.

Very scary.

I would have argued that, if you have the consciousness to stop and fix dinner . . .that you are most of the way there. But he kept falling just short. I wonder why??

Please don't misunderstand my perspective. I am thinking of myself in a similar situation . . . I have always assumed that with the right emergency food and gear . . .you'd be fine (short of debilitating accident, or falling in water or otherwise getting soaked). Very scary to hear a story like this. Why didn't he eat dinner??

WHY WHY WHY”

“He might have been suffering not so much from hypothermia as exhaustion and very early stages of hypothermia.

It is bizarre that he kept somehow reviving himself. Sometimes even a little rest is all we need to perk back up and keep going.

He may also have been very strong, or had strong will power. He mentioned his family. That is a powerful survival stimulus.

And maybe it just wasn't his time. I've survived one potentially deadly illness where I was already in a state of shock and my body was shutting down. Got medical care at the last possible moment and made it through.

Who really knows the answers? We call them miracles because there really is no explanation.”

“I read about a woman hiking the AT who got hypothermia. She hiked into a shelter on the AT, and passed out. Fortunately, there were other hikers there and they took care of her. But if the shelter had been empty, she would have died.”

“It's nothing to mess with, and you can come down with it in relatively balmy temperatures - up into the 50s.

I have found that a sleeping bag is the very best resource if your body does become chilled and you start shivvering. Crawl inside, move around as much as you can to get the blood flowing, and you will warm up.”

“Geo . . .

Again . . . I have played the "stranded in the woods" scenario over in my mind EVERY time I go out. It's how I prepare my emergency kit.

BUT I have always assumed that I would eat and find shelter.

My hiking buddy and I play a game during the day . . .

It goes like this:

"Hey . . .do you think you srvive the night under that rock", "Hey . . there's a good spot, with some dry wood trapped in it"

Hey, there's an overhanging ledge that is out of the prevailing wind", Hey, do you think you could be protected in that thick scrub if you had to be"


We have never played the game:

HEY . . .it's late in the afternoon (or well into the evening because we thought we'd make it out) and . . . we are too tired/hypothermic to make shelter and eat.

That not a fun game.”

“We lost the trail in the winter like that once – going downhill too. We had a topo and a compass but couldn’t find the turn for a long time. I’m sure it would have been obvious where to turn without snow but we backtracked several times before we found it. It was about a 110 degree turn so we’d have to be looking over our shoulder as we passed it. We were hoping no one would follow our tracks and get lost. We even thought about bushwacking downhill like he did. I could definitely see this happening. Solo in the winter anyone?”

“Lee... those are good questions (about Rambler's hypothermia.) It sounds like he turned things around at few places - but didn't get out of the woods entirely (literally or figuratively). Maybe you could ask him (on the thread).

As you see, a lot of people vouch for him. He clearly knows what he is doing, I've read a lot of his posts and traded ideas with him at least once (about Hammocks).

As far as the bulletin board goes, I think you just register and pick your own password. That's what I did (but maybe the format has changed?).”

“Viol Man:

I don't think I will hike solo at in winter conditions. Certainly not at my current level of knowledge and experience.

A few years ago, I hand a pretty intense crash. I'd only done about 9 miles and had been coming down hill. I was low on water, but not really dehydrated. It turned out that I had a condition that caused me to be hyper-calcemic (too much calcium in the blood). I was close enough to dehydration that the calcium became very concentrated. I barely made it for another mile to camp and them crawled into a tent and was useless for hours... if that had happened in the winter - especially if I was solo, I might have been toast... even without making minor mistakes. As it was, my son cooked and pumped water and I was good to go in the morning.”

“Confusion is also part of a hypothermic reaction. I don't know how prepared you can be for it. The problem is, you often don't recognize or accept that you are going into hypothermia.

Lee, that is a perfectly great point to raise. How good are we at finding emergency shelter. Oh, we pass rock overhangs and mentally tell ourselves, that's a great shelter. Build a fire in front of it and you're fine.

But what do you do when there is no rock overhang, you have no tent or sleeping bag.

My dayhike pack includes a space blanket, several large plastic trash bags, a survival stove with pellets, some Cup-a-Soup, a metal cup, Army-issue waterproof matches, a watertight container of hemlock tinder, a windbreaker, extra sweater in season, dry socks, gloves, and a few energy bars. There is a rudimentary first aid kit and a small flashlight.

It might not be pretty, but it should get me through.

Finding a trail is always an issue. I have lost trails even in summer conditions. Even then, bushwacking out requires some thought and the willingness to trust the compass. You need to be familiar with the topography and where you are in relation to roads or other trails so that you are always aware that going downhill to the west will bring you to the road where you parked, or whatever.

The question, and he apparently was as prepared as any of us would be, is always whether you will be so confused that you will not think to do the things you have to do to survive.

Would you have the sense to stop and build a fire at a critical juncture, or would you plunge on wildly? Walk around in circles? Forget to use the survival tools you had so thoughtfully included in your kit?

We never know until it happens, and then our instincts bring us through or they don't. It doesn't scare me, but it does make me think and does make me prepare.”

“One of the weird things about hypothermia, in its beginning stages, is you can know exactly what you need to do to 'fix' things, but be utterly incapable of going from thought to action.

I can get chilled really fast when I stop hiking, especially if I'm wet. Several times I've been borderline hypothermic. I can remember sitting in a shelter in the Catskills in November, knowing I had to take off my damp clothes and change into dry and I kept just staring at my pack, unable to move. My thoughts ran, "Get our your hat." "Okay". "No, I mean it, open the pack and get out the hat." "Okay." "Now." "okay." Finally my husband had to dress me.

Last summer I got chilled in an all day cold misty rain. When we stopped for the day, I couldn't get my hands coordinated to put the tent poles into the slots. All I could do was fumble with the poles and curse in frustration. Another time on the AT, my hands were so cold I couldn't undo my belt buckle to take the pack off to put on my jacket and hat, even though I knew that that was what I needed to do to get warm. So I kept hiking until I ran into another hiker, who was able to unfasten the belt for me. That's one good reason to take a partner when it's cold or wet. If one of you starts having problems, the other can help. One thing I've found when I get cold, although it helps to get warm and dry, I don't actually start warming up until I eat something. I've shivered in my sleeping bag for two hours before I finally got the energy to find some cookies. Five minutes after eating, I was fine. ymmv”

“Scary.

Ginny's story seems to be on point.

I wonder if there is a "priority" of "self-first-aid" for hypothermia.


That is . . .always always continue eating for instance. If it is late, and you are trying to make destination "B", keeping snacking until you are physically AT destination "B" and are able to fend for yourself.

NOT just in "known" situations of potential danger (e.g not just when you are lost, or its dark, or you are running late, wet, cold, tired etc) but all the time.

It would seem that keeping fueled and hydrated ALL the time, to ward off bonking/mental collapse makes sense.

If you are hiking in the rain, or cold, or if you have some distance to go . . .you can't always be warm and dry and rested . . .but you can control your food intake and hydration.

Interesting.

Sometimes I feel full. And stop snacking until I feel hungry again . . .usually that is late in the afternoon when just trying to get some miles under my belt. I figure . .heck . . .I'll be back at the tent in a couple of hours anyway . . .just keep going. For awhile I kept a snacks in a tiny stuff sack that hada loop for my waist belt. I think I'll start doing that again.”

“On my last backpacking trip, I discovered how much it hurts to drink ice cold water when the temps are in the thirties. I will be heating water during winter hikes from now on, and I need to make a thinsulate bottle cozy to keep the fluid hot as long as possible. If we hadn't heated water for tea at lunchtime I would have been dehydrated by the time we reached the trailhead, because I couldn't drink the cold water as much as I needed.”

“Interesting thoughts Lee, Lyndy and Ginny.”

“Everyone has some good points. I should have read this thread before my little misadventure this past weekend.

http://appalachia.outdoors.org/bbs/messageview.cfm?catid=7&threadid=1281”

“We get too soon old and too late smart.”

“I asked this in my previous thread:

"I wonder if there is a "priority" of "self-first-aid" for hypothermia?"


Let me re-phrase:

WHAT IS THE "priority" for "self-first-aid" for hypothermia?"

1. Food
2. clothing
3. shelter?

See here's my problem . . .it would seem that the answer is "use your common sense"

Like, if your friend (or you) fell in a river, or, got wet hiking all day and it was still raining the priority might be:

1. Shelter
2. Clothing
3. Food.


But what if common sense has left you??

That is the scary thing here . . . Rambler (on the AMC thread), and Ginny both seem to have lost their "commonsense". [I say this out of NO disrespect, obviously I hope].

We take it for granted that we all know enough so that we would just use our commonsense . . .but this just doesn't seem to be the case.”

“I don't know, Lee. How many of these life threatening situations happen because the person suffering, doesn't do something about it fast enough, because they are going along with the group, and don't want to hold everyone up. Would you be quicker to drop your pack, put up your tent, sit in your bag and eat anything available, if you were hiking solo? I kind of think that you would, one because you are solo and can't afford to take a chance, and two, because if will only impact your schedule and no one else's.”

“Madriver --

Just read your link . . .

Guy I see down inthe gym was headed up to the Long Trail in VT this weekend. He was going to be just East of Bennington, where the trail crosses Route 9 (I think).

Saw him down in the cafeteria this afternoon. He was what, 60-70 miels north and a bit east of you?? He had snow. Light fluffy snow.

Friday was a good day for them weatherwise, but it started to snow overnight, by reakfast it was coming down an inch an hour with a couple of inches on the ground. They cut the trip short and had a good second day hike out on Saturday. Snowed the whole way, and was a little slippery underfoot . . .but not the treacherous icy conditions you had.”

“Good point LindyS.

I can think of at least one situations recently where I should have stopped and made camp rather than push on. I was doing a 4-day solo trip to Mt Washington and the weather turned and I should have made camp but I had no way of contacting family who were waiting for me. If I had stopped, they would have probably called S&R. They would not have known that I was ok, just decided to spend an extra night. I therefore decided to push on and arrived at the summit exhausted, cold, and wet. As it turns out, my family was just about to call S&R when I was able to contact them from the summit. Aside from a cell phone, which I don't own, I don't know how to rectify that type of situation.”

“MadRiver's tale for those to lazy to cut&paste.

Good story. Would a tent not survive an ice storm?”

“Well that is true, MadRiver, I don't know what to say, except that it is good to not overplan your trip if people are going to call S&R when you don't show up on time. On my last trip, we got a little lost and came down out of the mountain to the trailhead just before dark. The ranger was a little worried about us, and was getting ready to start looking around. It never occurred to me that he would do that, and it kind of upsets me. It means that we need to give ourselves a much larger margin of time to avoid impacting the rangers, but when you only have a weekend and it gets dark at 5PM, that kind of cramps a hike. If you have overnight equipment, I would have expected them to wait until the next morning to look for us.”

“Thanks for the report Madman! (I didn't know you were MRH over there).”

“That is a scary trip report, MadRiver, this was a bad weekend for backpacking in New England. Good thing that your vehicle can handle backroads in that condition.”

“The tent might have survived the ice, but after seeing the photos in our local paper of all the downed trees I have a feeling that the trees and the branches would have caused more injuries than the ice. I would be interested in knowing if the campsite at Sage's Ravine sustained any damage.”

“Pedxing, I messed up my initial registration at the AMC, so I couldn't use MadRiver. So I used MRH (mad river house) instead. What can I say, I'm technologically challenged.”

“I guess InfuriatedRiver just doesn't have the same ring, huh?”

“or BrainDeadRiver.”

“Crazy River would be better.

MR: I'm particularly interested in your report and Ramblers, because I've vowed to do a good bit of winter hiking this year. I may be asking for advice somewhere down the line.”

“this is a very good thread. i have been wet (more than just damp) in sub-freezing temperatures many times in the past. i have never been to the point where i lost any of my faculties or ability to function in any manner. i have been to the shivering stage, but never sat down to rest before changing into dry clothes or getting something to eat. i have stopped to eat, but always remained standing and moving. it makes me wonder how close i may have been. this thread has certainly stirred thoughts for me. i often get into the frame of mind that i am strong and know just what i am doing and don't give enough thought to it. i do often ask those i am hiking with how they are doing when we are in cold, wet conditions, strictly for the reason of heading trouble off at the pass. i really do appreciate this thread.”

“oh, i forgot to plug my newest favorite.

"take fruit cake with you".

it is the best thing going for high calorie intake in a small (slightly heavy) portion. 2" cube is 420 calories. fat, carbs, protien and sugar. its all in there.”

“wow, Madman. That's quite a report! I'm glad it all ended well. All it would have taken is one bad stumble downthose icy hills...
You crazy fool! So, when are we hiking with you again?!

Always an adventure, eh?
:o)”

“these 2 trip reports make me and my trips look cool and easy...but in all seriousness...Its a jungle out there and even my little forrays into dissaster might have turned even more sour, had I not had some luck.

These are 2 great stories that remind us all to take great pains against the perils that might exist. No joke!!!”

“"Hypothermia was coming on fast. Aware of it, but unable to stop it, I fell into a strange calm, I knew what had to be done. Dry clothes, shelter and hot food. None of the tasks were completed, but the emotions of fear, anger, frustration were not there. Everything seemed to be Okay, sleep would be easy, no worries. In reality, the situation was dangerous. Dinner was cooked, but not eaten. The shelter was pitched, but sagging almost to the ground in the middle. I had only partially changed into dry clothes, and I never got into my sleeping bag which was partially exposed to rain. Wet down. (The next day found me) standing in slush 4:30 PM, I was starting to shiver. Quickly I had to set up camp. Too late. Next morning 6:30 AM. I awoke on the ground, sleeping next to a log on a patch of snow with the last of my dry clothes on and one foot totally bare. I knew I would not survive another night. ...

"What does hypothermia feel like? It was like living a peaceful dream. For example, when I went to get water, I could not find my campsite, but I saw what looked like other campsites, a rock looked like someone else's cooler, and I trhought oh, that is site #1, I must be in site # 3 over there. I think that is the real danger of hypothermia. All seems fine when really it is not. Drowsiness was also a problem. A few times I almsot fell asleep while standing. It really is strange and hard to describe. My advice would be to set up camp early, so when temperatures do drop, your warm palces are ready. I consummed by my drive to go on, but it would have been safer to have stopped earlier before I became cold. Eat, get under shelter, and into the warm sleeping bag."”

“He should of done some pushups. Would have warmed him right up and made him perky again!

When its cold
and you're feeling bold
dont take a chance
hypos waiting to get ya
drop down and give me 50”

“To answer Lee - getting warm for me depends on getting dry, primarily, then eating, then just snuggling in the sleeping bag until I warm up. My worst problems came when my hands froze up (Reynauds) and I couldn't coordinate to do even the simplest tasks. Do you have any idea how hard it is to open a ziplock when your hands won't work? Try it wearing mittens, and you'll understand, a little. That's why it's nice to have a partner who doesn't cool down as quickly as I do. (He makes a very nice warm 'furnace' in the bag too.) The brain freeze is odder, but less painful, and really less frustrating because, as Rambler said, there is a real disconnect.

I also have done the "Keep hiking because my family is expecting me home and I don't want them to call S&R death march" Caused a lot of trouble and endangered me unnecessarily. Twice I would have been much safer to stay put until dawn, but I kept hiking to save myself from embarrassment. Fortunately that's no longer an issue. The only one who would worry hikes with me. If we get lost, or decide to hole up for the night because the conditions have deteriorated - who would know or care? Possibly my boss, but by the time he noticed, I'd be safely out.”

“I'm continue to enjoy this discussion. Some of it, especially the issue of hurrying to get back vs. staying the night and being safe made me think of this trip report from the begining of the year:
http://home.earthlink.net/~ellozy/Bonds.html" target="_blank"> a more formal winter trip report ”

“AmyG. I would be more than happy to hike with you again. I'm taking a week off in June and planning to do several trips. I recently adopted part of the Davis Path through the AMC trail adoption program so I plan to do several overnights on Mt Washington.

To add to the discussion, if I stop for more than five minutes I always put on a sweater to keep warm. If I don't, I notice that I begin to get cold. I also agree cold hands are the worst things to have so I usually carry a pair of gloves and a pair of mittens.”

“My fingers really hurt when they are cold, but I don't like heavy mittens. I've bought some polypro liner gloves from Sierra Trading Post for $8 and love them. They are small enough to keep in a pocket so that they are accessible when your hands get cold. You can also sew some thin elastic straps on so that they can hang from your wrists when not in use, so that they don't get dropped and lost. For colder weather, layer mittens over top of them.”

“I only put on the mittens once I am in camp, or stopping for a long time, like lunch. I once made the mistake of carrying only one pair of gloves, and once they got wet, they were useless. I should, however, use my glove liners while hiking and not just for skiing.”

“this is why i don't like winter hiking. well.....plus the fact that being cold REALLY SUXXXXX!”

“I carry many pairs of hand options. In the ADK last weekend I carried rag wool gloves that lasted for the first part of the first day. Then they were wet, and we were head above treeline into the wind, so I swapped for my GORE windstopper fleece gloves and they sw me through the rest of the day.

I also had shrunken wool mitts and goretex overmitts in my emergency pack, as well as three sets of hand warmers and two sets of toe warmers.”

“I now like to err on the side of caution and carry more clothing than I might need. I made a stupid mistake on that trip to Washington last year by not bringing gloves and a wool hat. Although it was in June, by the time I reached the summit the temperature was below freezing. I ended up putting a pair off wool socks on my hands as I hiked down the Ammonoosuc Trail. After that, a wool hat and gloves has become part of my ten essentials.

In the past two years I have learned more from my "misadventures" than I have on trips that go well, although I wouldn't recommend this as the best way to acquire experience.”

“Yeah, I just bought the hand and toe warmers due to a previous thread about winter hiking. Good to have and lighterweight than I expected.”

“Also, the polyester fleece that you can buy in the fabric stores is pretty easy to work with. You can make some easy lightweight hat - neck gaiter things with a cordlock and a little thread. It is so easy to sew that you don't even need a sewing machine. Pretty water resistant too.”

“Thanks LyndyS, that sound like a good idea. Like an idiot, I forgot to bring home some of my winter gear not thinking that during my 5 week hiatus from NH it would be wintery conditons in CT. Oh well, live and learn.”