stun gun, good or bad idea??

“so, hubby is worried if I go hiking by myself. What do you guys think about a little 700,000 volt stun gun (for human attack)? Not that this is going to happen, but just to make him feel better. Not worth it or something to think about??

Found some other link about bear spray (mace???). What do you think about that? (for bears of course)

well, if you thought you've heard it all there comes gemini with some really strange questions... (sorry)”

“are stun guns legal? i don't know anything about them.

i'd definitely carry pepper spray.”

“I'd say the bear spray.. that way it's dual purporse, and you could use it against some whacko in the woods as well.

Having said that, and I know you probably realize this, you are probably MUCH safer out in the woods than you are walking down the street.”

“I know they aren't in MI. Bear spray sounds more reasonable to me. It'd be alot easier to carry a bear spray canister than a stun gun at all times.”

“There is a persistent fear amongst people that you will meet "some whacko out in the woods". My wife's grandmother is convinced I will be killed and eaten while out hiking someday. I think it can be blamed on ignorance and "Deliverance", lol....

Stun guns are classified as firearms in some jurisdictions. So is pepper spray, but generally only in places like NYC. So I'd go with the bear spray. You can always tell the ranger "It's for the bears", and still use it on some whacko who goes after you, should you actually be unlucky enough for that to happen.”

“Get the bear spray; it's cheaper and legal. If your husband dosen't believe that it will work, ask him if you could test it on him! =80”

“But is bear spray as effective on humans as it is on bears?

I had heard it was less effective.

When it comes to personal security, I would go with something tried and true: OC spray (for humans, that is)”

“Everyone freaks when I'm out in the woods alone. I really don't think a whole lot about it. One afternoon I was walking in the buisness park where I work and these guys in this huge "bubba truck" passed me...turned around and came back...passed again...and then a few minutes later came back the other way...I was pretty scared at this point and kicked it up a notch to get back to the office. The truck was just so out of place for where I work and I was just waitting for them to pull me into the truck. After that I thought 'get me back to the woods' I feel much safer there!!!”

“But is bear spray as effective on humans as it is on bears?

I had heard it was less effective.
Mutt
11:00:24 AM
01/09/03


OH YEAH!!!!!!!!!! I had a leaky canister last year and accidently got some in my eyes. Trust me, it works grrrrrrreat.”

“I carry a big ole hiking stick.
All dogs understand sticks and will stay away from it.
You already have it in your hand ready for use.
You have to FIND your bear spray.
Bear spray is a good thing to have.”

“If I was gonna carry something for self defense, it would be something that would "reach out and touch somebody," not a stun gun. But I don't pack while hiking anyway, so it's a moot point.

I do carry pepper spray for use against dogs or bears. I'd suggest you get a can of that and tell the old man you are protected.

In most cases where people were attacked on the trail, they never saw it coming. The reason is that we hike relaxed, not wary. For a means of self defense to work, you have to put yourself into the frame of mind where you suspect everybody and are always on alert. That is an abnormal level of stress of the kind cops and soldiers in war carry, antithetical to backpacking or hiking.

There are two realities at play here. One, there are whackos who attack hikers from time to time, but two, your chances of encountering one are very, very slim.

I was hiking the Long Trail in Vermont in the summer of 73 when a psycho who killed some people in the Adirondacks was loose and supposedly headed to Vermont. That news kept everybody overly suspicious of anybody they met, but the fact was, the guy never went to Vermont at all and was eventually captured within five miles or so of where the crime was committed. My question all along was, "What will we do if we find him?"

Even if you were armed and somebody aroused your suspicion, what then? Would you produce "Ol Betsy" and brandish it? Would you move on? Would you shoot the person and later find out they were innocent? Having the means of self defense does not automatically make life any easier. It carries a ton of responsibility and the knowledge and will to act if it should be necessary.

In all my years of hiking, the only whackos I've ever met have been eccentric, but harmless. I don't hike with my guard up and don't plan to.”

“Gemini, if you do settle on bear repellant be sure to get "spray" and not "stream"
I believe it was Backpacker mag that tested various brands so you can most likely get on their web site to see how each brand faired.”

“I just got this ridiculous image in my mind of a backpacker trying to get his stun gor out on a grizzly in self defense. Stun guns are illegal in some jurisdictions and circumstances. When stun guns first came out, one of our courthouse deputies bought one. He fell asleep during a boring crimninal trial, and as he slouched down, his body pressed the trigger, and he shocked himself for quite awhile much to the amazement of the Judge Meekins and the jury.

Backpackers are statistically safer from violent crime than any other activity I know. If your worried, bring bear spray and hike in a group.”

“but I still like my CZ 75 B.”

“thanks all. That's exactelly my point, you are much safer in the woods then out on the street, but tell that to my husband. I was figuring that he will let me out more often (not that I don't go anyway, but at least he is in a better mood when i leave :). I don't even think about whackos while hiking. I guess the mace or bear spray will have to do.

Geezr...they can leak?? ahhh, hope mine will never ever leak. Even if it doesn't work that well, I could always get a small bottle of mace too.”

“no real guns for me. I am screered of real guns. (can someone finally tell my if I spell "screered" right??)”

“the correct spelling is "skeered." :-)

personally, i'm scared out of my mind to go hiking alone. (of crazed maniacs, that is.) i'd never do it, even though that doesn't make any sense.”

“The Bear Spray Link . . . I hope

Yes, it leaked where the spray nozzle entered the can. However, it was five years old.”

“Requires proximity, the assailant has to be very close.

What about in the rain, or even if you are wet from leaves etc, electric current likes wet, you may fry yourself as well as, or instead of, the other person.

Bear spray sounds like a better alternative. But like all weapons still leaves the question of when is the right time to use it. Too early and there will be mistakes, too late and the assailant will take it off you before you have time to use it.

Then think through your actions AFTER you have had to use a non-lethal weapon. The assailant is only temporarily out of action. You still have to get yourself to safety, or completely incapacitate the assailant as the second attack will be much more dangerous.

A lot easier to think through what to do now than when the adrenaline is running. Bear spray will not work for a "tie them up" option. So the choices are "run" or "brain em". If flight is the option, what do you take and what do you leave? are you capable of intentionally and deliberatly injure another person who is now not an immediate threat?. This is both a physical and emotional question.

The best option has already been posted a couple of times, aware of surroundings and hide. See and be unseen, but you still need some idea of your options if that fails.

Don't bet everything on the dog. If they are prepared to harm you, they will be prepared to kill the dog. Another reason to only take a well trained dog on the trail. The dog will always detect the intruder before you can, but the dog needs to understand if hide is your choice, and be able to hide.”

“now that you brought up the dog question. A couple of weeks ago I have read somewhere on the internet not to bring a dog during bear season. They have not explained why. I wonder if the dog attracks the bear (because the dog senses the bear and is going nuts because of that reason)...or what? Hmm, dunn no.

(see, after talking to my husband I was thinking about a dog)”

“You also have to weigh the distinct possibility that any weapon can be taken from you and used against you. Since the stun gun has to be used right up close, that is a very real chance.

You don't have any tape of that deputy being shocked do you prosecutor? What does ‘America’s Funniest Home Videos’ pay these days?”

“I usually carry 2 or 3 fireams in the woods. Since you are a woman and don't have the superior muscle mass of a man like me, I suggest you leave the sawed-off double barreled 12 guage at home. I recommend you carry a .22 magnum in semiautomatic. Don't bother with any training either, it's a waste of time. Just point and shoot. Your bound to hit something!”

“You could fight this from the other direction, Gemini, meaning fighting your husband's belief that the woods are a dangerous place to go. Driving your kids to school in your car (assuming you do) is probably the highest-risk activity you engage in on an everyday basis. So simply start cutting out reports from all the newspapers you can get your hands describing deadly car accidents, and to be fair, clip out reports about hikers being attacked in the woods as well. Eventually, he'll get the message.

Then, of course, he'll come up with some other reason for you not to go hiking and backpacking, lol!”

“The higher the concentrate of capsaicin, the better the spray.

Most "over the counter" readily available spray is 2%, rendering about 150,000 Scoville Heat Units (like a really hot Habernero)...while this will cause major irritation, I prefer something more heave duty.

This is 15% rendering 2 Million SHU. As a side note, the NPS carries 5% minimum, 10% preferred. I am not sure 2% would do any more than piss off a bear (two legged or 4 legged).”

“typo,,,"heavy duty"”

“LOL bitpusher :) Honestly that's not a bad idea though. He does NOT forbit me to go hiking, I just like the face he makes when I tell him... Just like I said, I go anyway, and he doesn't even say no anymore. (knows me too well to even think about saying "no")”

“chili, it would probably do quite well for "heave duty" as well...

Gemini, I don't like the face my wife makes when I tell her I'm going backpacking either, but she's mostly just envious of me being able to get away from it all for awhile...”

“Check the "women only hike" for the hiding options. I'm good at it. :-) ALTHOUGH I FRICKIN' HATE A WOMAN HAS TO THINK LIKE THAT!!! Then again, to be fair, a man alone on a hike might face the same kinda thing.

How about cattle prodders?? LOLOL”

“WRONG, Chile36:

"One of the biggest misconceptions about defense spray is that the higher the percentage, the hotter and better it works. In most cases this could not be further from the truth. Most of the best, fastest incapacitating sprays in the world are from 2%-10%. The lighter the fluid, the faster is penetrates the membranes. The percentage has nothing to do with the actual SHU or "hot" in the spray."

From securityplanet.com

Fox Labs spray is 5.3 million SHU for anyone who wants the best.”

“Could be mutt, but having been exposed to 150,000 HU in handling peppers, I can assure you it did not compare to having one single drop of pure capsaicin put on the back of my hand. It raised a blister.”

“I would tend to think, mutt that the percentage of Oleoresin Capsicum is irrelevant. The percentage of capsaicin to the capsaincoids in the OC would be the relevant figure however. This the higher the percentage of capsaicin, the "hotter" the spray.

I think this is what you were saying, just a different way.”

“ This explains my position fairly well.”

“I subscribe to the logic of they will turn and use the "weapon" on me. When hubby goes out of town he is always asking if I want him to load the gun just in case and my normal reply is "hell no...if they are gonna kill me I don't want it to be with my own gun!!!"”

“Good link, chile36, thanks.”

“My Gawd Gem!!! The only predator out there that can do ya some harm is a person. You're location is the SE, so animals are not a factor. Bears are only a prollem in the Smokies, but if you can keep your nose clean (ie-don't eat in your tent, crap next to your tent, or be stupid near cubs), then even the mighty blackbear ain't no prollem. If you're worried about not being bearproofed, carry spray for the just-in-case. And if you're fidgety about possible ppl encounters, arm your confidence with a snubnose or .380 or something like that. Do be sure you can handle one tho, fo sho!!”

“Violin, no tape, othewise I could be a rich guy selling that one.

Also, statistically, weapons are vary rarely taken away by the assailant and subsequently used on the victim by the offender. If one is not mentally prepared to use deadly force in self defense, carrying a concealed weapon is a bad idea for the same reason.”

“But there is that rare TT'er who is very willing and able to use a gun and blow away his/her attacker with deadly force.

Shoot twice in the chest and once in the head for good measure. 8)”

“I have seen the 50,000 volt one and the 110,000 volt one they are way cool.

I think if I look around I can find the catalog that I had with all the diffrents ones in it.

8)”

“"Found some other link about bear spray (mace???). What do you think about that? (for bears of course)"

-- Gemini

Speaking on behalf of myself and Jerbear, we prefer you bring the "dog" spray.

What does everyone have against bears anyway?!”

“50,000 or 150,000 Volts? Ha, check this one out: 750,000 Volt

Just like I said, I am not that worried, not as much as hubby. But I don't always hike in the Carolinas. If I get the change I'll hike in the smokeys. (which could happen every other month), so bears are an issue. I guess they worry me more then a human. A wheirdo is not worring me at all. Okay, I am repeating myself. You all know what I mean.

I decided on the mace. Those bear sprays are huge, so we'll see.I may get it and then decide if I take it on a specific hike or not.”

“I carry a little 2 shot derringer now in .410ga shotgun/45 long colt. I see nothing wrong with carrying a chemical agent other than I've been told it isn't much good for black bear or wacko's. Same for the stun guns.I think using your head is your best defense in any situation.”

“yea...my stun gun uses .45 acp hydrashoks...the stun lasts a really really really really long time....:p j/k (not really)”

“Catskhiker, whut the crap does all that mean??? Splain yourself! I'm curious to know exactly what that thang is, and can do. What size is it, weight? Thanx.”

“He should be grounded.”

“Bravo security guard! If you break the law you get punished. I bet it was really funny to watch though.”

“greased himself down with grape seed oil... i nearly died laughing when i read that.”

“If you decide to get pepper spray, you can usually get a pretty good deal on it at most gun shows.

Wherever you get it, be sure to check the expiration date, and test the unit outdoors to make sure it works properly & to get an idea of its range before you start carrying it.”

“I LIKE stun Guns....they make those lone female hikers I meet MUCH more compliant...and if you apply them at CLIMACTIC moments, they can enhance that special moment.....


hell a REAL man will just ZAP a Grizzly, teach him a lesson.....SAY has anyone ever tested a TASER on a BEAR?

Talk about a YouTube Fave...LMAO”

“This too much like that skit on SNL a couple of weeks ago ---”