Hi ho Hi ho off to War we go?

“no, I think he should have been at the helm when the nation is in crisis though, not running for cover. Taking the advice of security people is not the answer, he is the President and can overrule them.”

“Wasn't Bush reading a story to some children at the time of the first 9/11 attack? And then after Bush was interrupted to be told of the attack, he finished telling his story instead of immediately taking action?

That's what some of the nuts at the democratic underground were saying. I never bothered to see if it was actually true or not.”

“I am fairly certain that Air Force One and whatever "bunker" he "ran off to" has the finest in communication equipment and personnel. But I suppose you would be saying the exact opposite if he had gone back to the whitehouse and was killed by a hijacked airliner.”

“The media would of been crying up a s#*t storm if the President had been killed on 9/11. They would of been saying, "What the hell? Isn't it the job of the Secret Service to protect the President? Now the republicans have they're JFK."

After all JFK was warned not to go to Dallas and went anyway. I suppose this shows leadership on his part, NOT!!”

“no - I'm saying he should have gone to the Whitehouse and spoken to the American people, offered some reassurance. Look at how another Republican, Rudi Guiliani - reacted - admirably, without a thought for his own safety.
I can't even vote here, so I'm not a democrat looking to take shots at him, I think in many ways he's done a great job, in many other ways a very poor job. But when a nation is in crisis you need your leader to put himself on the line for the American people - to show leadership when it's most needed, not stay on his plane in complete safety when the people in the country are not.”

“Bush was in FL on 9/11. He flew from there to an unspecified (at that time) location. Imagine that - not letting the enemy know where the Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces is. Same for #2. Not to worry, tho - they were both in constant communication with those who mattered the most at the time.


Makes sense to me.




On Gore:
Gore, IMO, is cut from a similar cloth as Jimmy Carter, and look at how Jimmy handled the Iran hostage fiasco. The Marine's who guarded the American Embassy in Tehran were doing quite well, thank you, at defending the embassy - they were doing what they are trained to do: giving the enemy the "what fer", and giving it to them in great fashion. But Weenie Carter told them to drop their guns and SURRENDER! The Commander-in-Chief ordering MARINES to surrender?! MARINES! WHATTAFUH?!! Idiot, idiot, idiot...

Then the "rescue" attempt. I could puke just now...

Al Gore, too, is a sniveling weenie.

Al Gore doesn't have the stomach to do what - unfortunately - has to be done during times of war.

Al Gore is not capable of making the tremendously difficult decisions that are required of a C-in-C.


It took Lincoln 2-3 years to finally find a General that had "the right stuff" - Grant. Though it took staying soused 24/7 for Grant to find the nads to kill kill kill, he managed to muster the wherewithall to send his brave and honorable boys into the hail of Confederate lead.

Sometimes, it takes an animal to do a human's job. G. W. Bush is *just* animal enough to do what is REQUIRED of him at this moment. I don't think Gore is.

God's speed, Mr. President.
You are in the thoughts and prayers of the American people during this terrible terrible moment that fate has laid upon you.

Fear not, Mr. President. Your boys understand. Peaceniks may not, but the boys do.

I'm going home now, and praying for peace.

"Hope for the best -
expect the worst.
Life is a play -
and we're unrehearsed."”

“I'm all weepy eyed now. Well said gojo.”

“What gojo said.”

“Gojo, so you're whole argument there consists of specualtion that Gore would have been a weak President, comparing him to another man who just happened to be from the same party (aren't the Republicans on shakey ground there?) - and claiming that the Marines in Tehran could still be holding out.”

“While Gore was in country, Bush was partying with Tricia Nixon.

Yes, I voted for Carter... because one of Your Guys (Ford) pardoned one of the greatest criminals to ever occupy the White House.

Bush thinks he was chosen by GOD to lead the country at this point in history. That is reason enough to institutionalize him on the spot.

He's a nut.”

“I didn't know Ford pardoned Clinton too.”

“Let's face it. People with average or below average IQs do not make good leaders. They make good followers.”

“The thing that really bothers the left is that Bush is a very competent President. You don't hear as much bickering in the halls of congress or from the talking heads on the television news shows. We are not mired down in a protracted ground war in afganistan. Instead of deciding how many more apache attack choppers need to be sent over, we are trying to decide which roads should be rebuilt first. Instead of nightly jokes about moral improprieties in the white house, we get the briefest of hehe'ing at the troubles of his daughters.

Bush is doing a good job. He has the support of a great majority of the American Public. Government is working. There have been no budget impasses where the country is technically bankrupt for a few weeks.

All this most be terribly confusing to the mind numbed robots on the left who were spoon fed the lies that Bush is a stupid oaf. They ate it all up and begged for more. Actually, its kind of sad to see so many deluded people pathetically clinging to there false hopes that bush would fall on his face.”

“I'm for the war, the U.N. passed these resolutions a decade ago. It's time to enforce the decision.


I'm against Bush, he's a deserter who is lucky enough to have good people around him. As for competent President are you kidding? The FBI's focus was taken away from terrorism prevention and pointed at legal porn prior to 9/11. He's growing the government when everybody knows that if the INS followed up on expired visas that 9/11 wouldn't have happened, but since Bush was trying at the time to open the borders with Mexico who wanted to make the INS work at finding illegals??

as for support of the people... you realize bubba had higher approval ratings in the middle of the impeachment proceeding than dubya has now?

the Enron crooks are still running free, a gallon of gas is $2 in parts of the country, and more lay offs are planned by many of the fortune 500... the economy is currently headed into the dumper. I'm thinking the current partisan politics in this country are gonna really mess things up”

“The sand box is soon going to be turned into a parking lot.

8|”

“Wrong again, peckerbreath, LOL”

“if you want to get into questionable Presidential pardons why don't the neo-cons ever mention Weinberger?”

“Everything you mentioned donman didn't not happen overnight. The INS has been a clusterfu..nclub for years and the border has always been porous. I highly doubt that the FBI had a hardon for terrorist hunting, but mean ol bush stopped them. You show your ignorance just by suggesting that. gas has been as high as it is now on several occasions during the last ten years. The economy tanked well before Bush took office, the crimes that were commited by Enron and the like took place on Clinton's watch. If anything the market is showing signs of turning and will probably turn for good after the Iraqis begin surrendering in droves.

And if you think poiltics are more partisan now than when Clinton was at the helm, then there really is no purpose in discussing this with you because you are probably using the computer at head shrinks office where you have been institutionalized.

I will give you one thing though. I don't like making the government bigger than it already is. Some of the existing cabinet level departments need to be terminated to make room for homeland defence.”

“Man, you're good hyway.”

“approval rating doesn't mean jack $&%@#! you could have a 90% approval rating and still be doing a crap job”

“Here's more grist for your mill:

The economy tanked because institutional investors had no confidence in Bush... and still don't.

Homeland defense is DOA as a functioning entity. It's public relations. The non-communication between investigative bodies that let flight-school terrorists slip through the cracks is still operating in the same fashion.

Have you heard about the omnibus bill? Your grandchildren will be paying off Bush's budget.

Sweet Dreams....”

“yeah tilt, the government should just take all our checks and spend the money for us......that'll get the economy cookin again...”

“Check that omnibus bill.

PORK, little darlin'. REPUBLICAN pork, from a Republican controlled government. I guess they can drop the fical conservative act now, <G>

Strat, your boys are going to be paying for that tax cut that went to those folks earning 10 million+ a year, I hate to tell you. The interest rates are going to eat them up. The piper must be paid eventually.

Social Security goes revenue negative in 2017. That's less than 15 years away, now...”

“There are some distinct differences between Kosovo and Iraq, Hyway. You just don't want to acknowledge them, it seems.
Kosovo was a UN sanctioned action. Serbia was in the midst of a ethnic cleansing campaign. The United Nations took action against Serbia. The first Gulf War was also a UN sanctioned action.
I think you see the difference.”

“Oh, sorry, didn't know the UN office in NY was hit by terrorist. We are at war with terrorism and Iraq is a sponsor of terrorism and has the capabilities and the gumption to use those capabilities against us.

But I think I understand your point. It is ok to kill people if the UN says its ok.”

“Yes, instead, let us honor the 3000 dead at the world trade center by taking over Iraq.”

“So what are Bush's achievements? Has Osama been captured? Is the Economy doing well? Is the air less polluted? Are you better off? Has he won the support of the word for a just war in Iraq? Is his foreign policy a success? Are you any safer? I accept that things can take time, but as far as I can tell, the praise heaped upon GW revolves around him not being Al Gore or Bill Clinton - quite frankly I'd like to see more positive achievements - maybe someone can enlighten me?”

“Thats because you aren't looking. You are blinded by your idealogy. I suppose the air doesn't smell the same to you now that Bush is in office. It would be sad to be you. I am so glad that I am me instead.”

“And the theme from Jeopardy plays...”

“Point em out to me Hyway - Give me some evidence.
For example you could argue you are better off because of tax cuts - come on, now you think of one”

“I have already pointed them out. You chose to ignore them. why would I do it again just to have you ignore them again. It really doesn't matter anyway. He could cure cancer and you would complain because he used rats in labratory tests.”

“We are at war with terrorism and Iraq is a sponsor of terrorism and has the capabilities and the gumption to use those capabilities against us

If you're going to support the war at least avoid the specious argument that Saddam is a big supporter of terrorists. He's not. His WMD aren't a big threat.

Occupying Iraq will give America hegemony in the region and major influence over the the true supporters of terrorism. That's probably the best argument in support of war: we're fighting terrorism.”

“no you haven't - you've given a list of reasons why things that have gone wrong weren't Bush's fault, for example - "The economy tanked well before Bush took office, the crimes that were commited by Enron and the like took place on Clinton's watch" - now list some achievements?”

“and the only one you listed earlier is that politics isn't as partisan - I think we can say that's more down to a shambolic democrat party than success by Bush, and budgets should go through on time - it's a failing of other administrations that they don't, not a noteworthy achievement by GW”

“there was a post above that one where i said why the left is so sad”

“List of Klinton's acheivements:

He can no longer practice law.

He is a fantastic liar.

He kept his medical records secret after all the other presidents have made them public. (VD)

He enabled China to steal nuclear secrets for campaign contributions.

He has slept with one more woman than Janet Reno.

He's pardoned more felons than all of America's prison wardens combined.”

“Make that last one state governors.”

“9/12-morning quarterbacking is totally unfair. We're all aware that prior to 9/11 our borders were pourous, the FBI, INS, NFS, NAACP, NCAA, ABC, NBC, BC, B, C, D, E, F, and G were this, or at least that.

Finger pointing is just the kinda behavior that's totally out of line at this most trying time.

9/11 changed everything.

I see the pre-9/11 glass as being half-full, as opposed to half-empty. I say "cudos" to the FBI for their efforts prior to the terror. They were on the trail to *something*, but alas, time - o fleeting time! - was not on our side.

I would imagine that the terrorists were smart enough to scatter the trails with lots of misinformation (terrorism isn't exactly rocket psychology). One only need to study the pre-12/07/41 tactics of the Japanese.

The "Japs" flooded the Pacific airwaves with endless chatter, of which only a small percentage was legitimate. I believe it would be safe to assume the terrorist used a similar tactic.

9/11 was a wake-up call. We're now at a point to where we have to reevaluate our historic boundries of liberty. Our President has the dubious task of leading us through these uncharted waters. IMO, Presidental detractors are way out of line.

I really really really believe that much of the detraction is a carryover from the "sham" election. The same Hollywoodies that were threatening to move to South America, or Zimbabwe, or New Mexico - or wherever - if Bush got elected, are the same ones that are opposing his EVERY move today. George W. Bush can never do good by them. Never.

I find their behavior to be deplorable. They should be ashamed.

Thankfully, President Bush has followed-up on the promises of Governor Bush. As he promised, he has surrounded himself with competent advisors and department heads.

I recently heard an interview on NPR of a British journalist. The Brit was anti-Bush - "was" being the operative word. After spending a day or so with Bush, the guy did a complete about-face. He stated that Bush had an uncanny quality of leadership about him. He acknowledged that the Bush on the podium is not the same Bush you find in the Oval Office or War Room or whatever. He may be weak as water in regards to his public speaking, but at the table, he has fists of iron.

Believe it or not, I would be 100% behind Gore at this moment if the "unthinkable" had occured in November, 2000...”

“Shouldn't GW be judged on his own merits, not compared to hsi predecessor?”

“9/11 was a wake-up call. We're now at a point to where we have to reevaluate our historic boundries of liberty

What a bunch of bs. I'd much, much rather be free than safe. The last thing the U.S. needs is an abridgement of liberty, although Bush and Ashcrack seem intent on grabbing that kind of power.”

“Hyway... of course partisan politics have been going on for years. And it still sucks, neo-cons have created this paradigm that the wacko left have played into. If someone does something illegal or immoral that's always bad. But right now the voting public has been polarized. A certain amount of the public think Bush can do no wrong (but he has in some instances), another part of the public thinks that Clinton did no wrong, I don't think anyone can honestly say he didn't at least lie to his bosses (us).

Of course they aren't 'more' partisan now... let's face it the GOP had us spend millions to get Clinton on illegal loans and ended up proving he liked oral pleasure from other women... something EVERYBODY already knew. Why did they do it? Who can tell... I personally think it was just to embarrass the dp.

And yes, the focus of the FBI was shifted with the Bush administration. After that terrorist was caught trying to cross the Canadian border in 1999 the FBI was focusing on terror. Under Bush's watch the focus shifted to going after the porn industry.

As for the economy... Bush is not responsible for the internet bubble bursting, but his incesant sabre rattling is shaking a lot of psychos out of the wood work and war jitters are killing the stock market, yes you can't blame that on Clinton.

A couple more of the points you spout that mimic the position of Michael Wiener

China stole nuclear secrets... who was the spy, when was he hired?

Enron had shoddy accounting practices when Clinton was President. So did Bush's company... so did Halliburton. When Bush was in office and the energy industry started to gouge California Bush was asked by the people to look into it, he was asked by Ken Lay to not look into it... he didn't look into it. Now it's been proven that Enron did gouge, and on mid-level nobody took the rap and Enron is still in business.

if you really wanna dispute any of this neo-cons don't use your normal fierce emotional attacks, your "Clinton" did it, your they have more information than we do, really bring it, back yourselves up because your stupid chest banging doesn't play here”

“Bush is not responsible for the internet bubble bursting, but his incesant sabre rattling is shaking a lot of psychos out of the wood work and war jitters are killing the stock market, yes you can't blame that on Clinton

Even more troubling is Bush's mishandling of the oil market. By carrying out an extremely protracted build-up to war, he's kept oil prices unnecessarily high, which has played into the Saudi's hand quite nicely, and has kept the economy from growing more strongly. And when Venezuela tanked, Bush did absolutely *nothing* to prevent the collapse (or manage the aftermath) of oil production from the one country that has historically offered a buffer against the ME for U.S. oil imports.

Now, if the Iraq war turns out to be a protracted conflict, we'll have to factor in the loss of Iraqi exports into the price of oil. Bush has done nothing to prepare for such a contingency.

And since high oil prices are a de facto tax, it may cause the economy to slide into another recession.

Bush does not exactly inspire confidence.”

“Give me an example of your lost liberties post-9/11. Please be specific.


Osama bin Laden is entombed in the mountains of Tora Bora. We're publicly acknowledging the "authenticity" of "his" latest audios, but, hey... think about why we would take that stance.”

“The bid to lift restrictions on evesdropping. The imprisonment and denial of access to a lawyer of the guy accused of the dirty bomb plot(Is that his name?) - an American citizen.”

“Osama Bin Laden may be entombed in the mountains... but then again he may not. It's already been disclosed how he escaped by using a decoy with a sat phone (that was furnished by the U.S. Government).

as for liberties... my phone my be tapped, yours may too. I'm not sweating it because I don't do anything too illegal”

“Up against the wall, Donman!”

“j/k”

“LOL! I guess my point is that I'm an Army vet, I've been to Muslim websites and I #&%!$ about the Government... I'm a prime suspect!”

“That's a good point, Don.”

“You're at "liberty" to go to Muslim websites, so there.”