Att: Lawyers; Chillie, Prosecuter, and JMitch.

“and please tell me your leagle advise.”

“They're going to need a credit card number, first, Tea.

:)”

“LOLOL!

Good luck, tea. I meant nothing bad by my questions. Just things to consider. Once my ex hubby helped some other men capture and hold a guy hostage who had broken into a building on a farm. He had a history of stealing stuff.

The "friendly" farmers helping out had at least one basefall bat. I'm not sure if it was really used or not. However, bottom line is this: My ex, just for being there, got sued for being part of a "vigilante force" and we ended up paying something like $500 in damages to Mr. Criminal.

So things don't always go as they seem. You can be a fairly innocent bystander in something and end up in over your head. I say this to all those adults on the trip.”

“ice,

most attys would hesitate to give legal advice over the internet in regards to a specific, individual situation. it's not because attys want money, but due to potentially serious ethical and confidentiality ramifications. even though you wouldn't be paying an atty any money for such advice, an atty-client relationship could still be created. your situation appears more personal than legal and TTers gave you solid advice.”

“Is this the lawyer joke thread?”

“(insert lawyer joke here)

Punchline: A good start!

(now laugh)”

“Liz, your ex-husband should talk to his lawyer before he talks to the police. I would advise a better choice of words to describe your ex-husbands heroic actions, like:

"We came upon this burglar and tried to talk him into terminating his crime, but instead, the burglar attacked us, and we were forced to use necessary and reasonable force to defend".

Doesn't that sound better than, "holding a guy hostage"?

All kidding aside, citizens arrests are not for everyone, and can be risky to your safety and risky because of legal liability. I have made four of them.”

“So, I called Pasquotank County in North Carolina to see if there is a way I can file a motion through the mail, fax, etc. without having to drive all the way down from Ohio. My response was, "We can't give out legal advice." Of course, I already have the motions drawn up and ready to be submitted so I imply they are stupid. They repeat the court motto, "We can't give out legal advice." So, now I am taking one of what I am sure will be many car trips down to Po-Dunk just so I can file some paperwork. I end up in a bind though, because I am doing all the work while my wife, who has no clue, is the person this is all for. My only concern is that she won't be able to hold up in court, and we can't afford an atty for this long drawn out battle we're about to go through. Does anybody know if it's possible for me to act as a mutual party/representative in the case? Maybe if I list myself as a Plaintiff? At the moment we are drawing everything up pro se, but I would like to get myself in their somehow so I can help her. I know this borders on advice but a general point in the right direction, web site, or something would really help.”

“They gave you the standard answer all employees are supposed to give.

The only people allowed to represent a litigant are licensed attorneys. Or parties are allowed to represent themselves pro se (way not advisable). The only way you can do anything is to be a party.

Whatever your legal issue is, in the long run you are going to be better off with an attorney. Pro se people always miss stuff and do stuff incorrectly, and the judge is also not allowed to give legal advice or intervene. So you will be screwed. If you do it wrong, the judge has to rule accordingly. And pro se mistakes are often not fixable later on when they finally break down and get an attorney.


Proceeding pro se is like performing open heart surgery on yourself and thinking you are going to do a good job just because you can't afford it.

And yes, you can file things by mail. But there are procedures to doing it and then there are procedures for proper distribution. If you do something wrong, it will get thrown out. Even if a clerk helped you with something, they don't have a clue what they are talking about generally speaking. Get an attorney. Call a legal aid clinic. Call the county bar association for a referral.”

“I'll go with the legal advice given by non-lawyer Ruby.”

“I respectfully concur with prosecutor.”

“Or, in the words of Lincoln that also apply here, an attorney who represents himself has a fool for a client.”

“First, I've tried all that. This is a small jurisdiction, and all but one attorney said that to take our case is a conflict of interest. I believe that has to do with her ex-husband being a former police officer in the town. The one who did not say that did say she was not able to take a new case at this time. We tried to get attorneys from out of the area but nobody was willing to take on a case so far away. So, we have no choice but to represent ourselves if we want to get our issues resolved.

Second, I disagree about representing yourself pro se. The law is very particular and most cases like mine are generally ruled upon the same in every instance, regardless of how the clients feel. I've been in the room too many times without the clients present for me to believe a lawyer gives a person any sort of advantage. Most of what goes on when your not in the room is 10 minutes of pleasentries and a brief 1 minute bargaining session. What follows, once you enter the room, is simply an elaborate play designed to reach the conclusion that had already been bargained upon, without the clients knowledge. It's also important to note, that anytime somebody is bargaining that means any punishments will be less severe. Nobody ever bargains to get the maximum penalty allowed by law. Just one time I'd like to see a dead beat get the full 30 days in jail with no suspension. Go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200 dollars.

Of course, I do have a unique perspective, given my employer and the fact we have a large impoverished urban community where pro se is encouraged if you cannot afford assistance. Of course, I have seen where people come in to discuss a point, and it wasn't in their motion. In these instances they simply file another motion and get a new court date. The satisfaction comes in the fact the other party has just payed an attorney to sit in a room with them for nothing. Sorry, I'll make sure I file the motion right this time! Cha-ching!

P.S. My issue is simply a change of custody. My wifes ex-husband will not give her legal custody for her daughter who has not lived with him now for over 5 years. We need the papers for school enrollment and this jerk won't sign a consent order. He had his previous attorney draw one up, which we paid for, and then he refused to sign it. Now he has a new attorney and still won't give up custody even though the child lives with us. Like I said, cut and dry. We just need the court to draw up the paperwork since he won't agree to it.
last edited: 6/09/05 4:31:28 PM”

“dude, nothing with regard to custody is cut and dried.

even when it looks like it is.”

“I sit in the court room regularly viewing these domestic issues, and have to disagree. I have had the perspective of seeing these things from the outside for long enough to know that the court follows, for lack of a better way to say it, some very basic guidelines(based upon the law, of course). I've seen people coming into the court room time and time again believing that their situation was unique and that their was some magical argument they could give to convince the courts to see things their way. It's just not true. The courts resolve these petty arguments all day, every day. When custody has changed it is almost always a result of an agreement between the parties. The occassional abuse allegation, incarceration, or drug abuser will also get a change of custody, but these problems do not occur as often as most people would think. The problem in my case is that even though he agreed verbally to the change of custody over 5 years ago, and did, he never wanted to get the court documentation for it. Basically he wants to maintain as much control as possible in the situation. The issue was never pushed until we started to be harassed by the schools. Now we won't be able to get her into school for the coming year until all of this is hammered out. The problem here is that he is one of those guys with the magical arguments. In some corner of his deluded mind he believes he should be able to maintain custody without actually have the child. Of course, he has hired an attorney, who only perpuates that belief in magic so she can line her own pockets. In the end he will have paid her a small fortune for nothing. Personally I believe an attorney should be able to find a better use for their skills and knowledge and be banned from practing family law. It seems like such a waste of talent.”

“If he has an attorney and you do not, you have a snowball's chance in hell of prevailing. Just get an attorney. Get a temporary part-time job to pay for it if you have to. Then ask for fees when you get to court.”

“what are you guys doing giving legal advise? Go ahve some fun!!!”