Why gun control is necessary

“BRISBANE, Australia (CNN) -- Imagine a gun that fires a million rounds a minute -- enough to shred a target in a blink of an eye, or throw up a defensive wall against an incoming missile.

This is Metal Storm, a weapons system that forsakes old-style mechanics for the speed of electronics.

Its inventor is Mike O'Dwyer, a one-time grocer in the Australian city of Brisbane. He's spent 30 years and much of his own money to develop the technology.

Now, finally, the doors are opening for him at the Pentagon, the U.S. Defense Department's headquarters.

O'Dwyer says that the real value comes from Metal Storm's electronic capability to deliver rates of fire and different types of projectiles very precisely.

The weapons range from a handgun that can only be operated by an authorized user to a grenade launcher that can fire either lethal or non-lethal ammunition.

While much of the technology is a closely guarded secret, the firing mechanism has no moving parts. Instead, it uses electronic ballistics technology. Unlike other guns, the only parts which move are the bullets.

The Metal Storm handgun employs electronic locking, which can limit firing access and stop unauthorized use. It can even be programmed not to fire within, say, the grounds of a school.

Its grenade launcher can give the same defensive security as a minefield, but without physically putting any explosives in the area being guarded. Instead, sensors can alert an operator to any intrusion. The operator can then decide whether to use lethal or non-lethal grenades to warn off -- or destroy -- the intruder.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/BUSINESS/06/26/australia.metalstorm/index.html”

“I signed up as a gear tester for Metal Storm.”

“Everyone should have one of those.”

“I can't comment im a second ammendments rights' sister.lol”

“Of course gun control is necessary. It is imperative that you hit what you're aiming at...now if we could only do something about these damned, annoying trolls...hmmmmmmmmm, maybe something on the order of a cyber-.416 Rigby...”

“ electronic ballistics technology

What the hell is that? What provides the motive force?”

“I can see something akin to an ignition spark started electronically. Don't worry, gangbangers will be the first to have them.”

“and we thought ganbangers would never evolve into a thinking species. lol”

“liberals either!”

“July 1st...deadline for all gun owners in Canada to re-register their firearms. Anyone with a non-register firearm is automatically a criminal....last count, there's still 1.6 million gun owners who haven't registered.”

“"This year will go down in history. For the first time a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future."

Although not really a quote by Hitler, (see here) it still conveys a strong message. The Nazi's *did* use gun registration lists to disarm the populace in countries they invaded. Here's what happened then: Registration: The Nazi Paradigm

Not sure the source, but the quote remains true: Those who ignore the past are doomed to repeat it.”

“Who would miss Canada anyway?”

“" 'If you keep a gun in your home,' a University of Pennsylvania
press release said last week, 'you dramatically increase
the odds that you will die of a gunshot wound, according to
research published in the June issue of the Annals of Emergency
Medicine.' 'Keeping guns at home is dangerous,' the researcher
was quoted as saying. A New York Times story likewise reported:
'People with guns in their homes are almost twice as likely
to be killed by guns as people who do not keep them at home.'
Frightening results for people who own guns, or who are thinking
of buying them. Frightening but, it turns out, meaningless --
another example of how unsound social science is being used in
public-policy debates. What the University of Pennsylvania
study found was a statistical correlation: Gun ownership is
correlated with gun deaths. But that two things are correlated
doesn't prove that one causes the other. The sex-crime rate
is correlated over time with the use of air conditioning,
but not because air conditioning causes sex crime; rather,
both rise during the summer months. Likewise, whether someone
in your home has been to the hospital recently is correlated
with death in your home, but not because hospital care tends to
kill people (though sometimes it does). Rather, both hospital
stays and deaths often have a common cause: serious illness.
It turns out that a hugely disproportionate fraction of homicide
victims are themselves criminals -- criminals do dangerous things,
and deal with dangerous people. In a recent San Francisco study,
two-thirds of all gun-homicide victims (and one-third of all gun
suicides) were found to have had arrest records, and other studies
of gun-homicide victims yield similar results. And criminals,
especially drug dealers and gang members, are particularly likely
to own guns; most gun owners aren't criminals, but many criminals
are gun owners. So even if gun ownership and gun homicide are
correlated, both may be caused by a common factor: Hardcore
criminals are especially likely to own guns -- and to be killed
by guns." --UCLA law school professor Eugene Volokh”

“"Those who believe that mankind is essentially good always find
themselves having to account for the real evil of the world. And
so, as the historian Herbert Butterfield observed, they generally
wind up blaming a few monsters -- Hitlers and Stalins, in whom
badness is inexplicably concentrated. It's far more realistic
to suppose that these 'monsters' are simply the culminations of
the sins of countless lesser men who have enabled them to rise to
positions of power. Blaming monsters for everything, especially if
those monsters are our enemies, allows the rest of us to become
morally complacent, even fanatical, believing ourselves virtuous
merely for opposing them. We may then fail to see real evil in
our own leaders -- and in ourselves." --Joseph Sobran”

“If you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns.

If you outlaw homosexuality, only outlaws will be homosexuals.

If you outlaw in-laws, only outlaws will have in-laws.

If you outlaw taxes, only outlaws will have taxes.”

“Can we outlaw trolls??? ;-)”

“if we outlaw trolls, violin and bacpac wont have any fun”

“Blaming monsters for everything, especially if
those monsters are our enemies, allows the rest of us to become
morally complacent, even fanatical, believing ourselves virtuous
merely for opposing them. We may then fail to see real evil in
our own leaders -- and in ourselves." --Joseph Sobran"
stratdewd

Amen, brother!
I'm thinkin'........Dubya!

Living in an armed environment does increase risk.
Some of our soldiers in Iraq have been killed and injured by accidents involving arms.
Infantry training involves mind-numbingly repetitive safety checks, even when no live ammunition is present.”

“People who shoot themselves in their homes get Darwin Awards. Weed 'em out.”

“I practice control every couple of weeks out at the range or the farm. Currently I'm working with a new repeater. My 1895 in a 45/70 Gov't. Experimenting with some reloads and fast follow up shots. ouch! Next on the list a SA revolver in .44 to match the 1894.”

“Nice guy!

Got any family?”

“My comment was in answer to PackMan.

Be careful!”

“When liberals outlaw guns only liberals will have guns. 8)”

“I didn't just say that because I was a 98J and 96B while in the Army. Zen_hiker may accuse me of never existing or something. He'll tell his intelligence friends of my phony remarks regarding gun control and they'll all laugh at me. 8(”

“Fear the "liberals"........oooooooooo!”

“Six-Year-Old Boy Suspected in Grandfather's Death

JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. — A 6-year-old boy suspected of shooting his grandfather to death with a .22-caliber rifle has a history of mental illness and attacking family members, authorities said.

James Zbinden, 59, was found dead at his home Friday after his grandson ran into the street and flagged down a neighbor, Cole County Sheriff John Hemeyer said.

The boy, who has not been identified, is being evaluated at a mental-health facility.

"We believe, at this time, that he killed his grandfather intentionally," Hemeyer said. An autopsy Saturday showed Zbinden bled to death from a single gunshot wound near his armpit.

Hemeyer said Zbinden and the boy were alone together Friday when the boy apparently found a gun that family members thought was no longer in the house. Hemeyer said it was unclear what led up to the attack. "This is a kid who has attacked family members before with no provocation," Hemeyer said.

The boy had been released last Monday from a central Missouri mental-health facility where he was admitted after attacking another family member, Hemeyer said.

More from FOX News”

“Sounds more like a mental health issue to me.”

“This is why I lock up my ammo.”

“Gun control begins at home.

It looks like lumberzac gets the idea.”

“These types of situations always make me angry because they are always preventable with a little common sense and care.”

“Sounds like the kid was out of control, not the gun.

The problem was the gun being in the control of a kid that wasn't.

But I will agree with ViOLIN that no firearm should be left where a kid can get hold of it.

Trigger locks are BS, as any kid with access to a hammer can smash it off, and most kids (6+) have access to a hammer.

If you want to keep a gun in the house, buy a safe.”

“Why is there a loaded gun in the house in the first place?!? Throw the parents in jail for accessories to murder. Doesn't anyone practice gun safety anymore?”

“Treat all guns as if loaded - first rule of firearms safety.

Reptiles,

who said it was the parents gun ? how do you know they were aware of it ? The article states that "family members thought was no longer in the house" without specifying who or what family members entailed.
Maybe it was grandfathers gun.

"Ready, shoot, aim" lets not hang before the fair trial.”

“There already are gun control laws for people who have histories of mental illness.”

“Ran hard up against that one huh, Geo?”

“Yeah Violin, you have a point. A law against six-year-olds having guns should have done it.”

“manuka,
It's a sad story and it's not the parents fault but when it's all said and done, they are the ones who are responsible.

They knew it was in the house at one time and at that time they obviously knew it was loaded and they obviously knew at the time it wasn't locked up anywhere. Guns don't load themselves and any time you handle a gun the first thing you should do is check to see if it's loaded. Is their life so hectic that they forgot that they had a loaded gun in their home?

My point is the gun never should have been loaded and in the house in the first place. I don't care if it was loaded 8 years ago before the kid was even a thought, it shouldn't have been left loaded.”

“I agree with reptiles. The average person is just too stupid to be trusted with gun ownership.”

“I have 4 kids, oldest is almost 7. I have 4 guns (incl. handgun) + ammo in the house. This would never happen in my home. Why? BECAUSE I BOUGHT A FRIGGIN' SAFE! Duh! And I am the only one with the combo. THAT'S RIGHT! A COMBO! Not lame ass key locker where any kid with half a brain "just knows that key is around here somewhere".

Those that believe that it will never happen with their "good kids" and thus take no percautions should face the music.

Those that truly believe that taking the guns away from the citizens is the answer, get a clue.”

“No violin, I disagree.

It is people who don't give a damn that should not be allowed to own guns.

People who don't think about the consequences and who don't care about safety until an accident happens. People let kids swim unsupervised every day. And don't worry until one drowns. People start nice roaring campfires in dry conditions and don't care until the woods catch on fire (then they merely go home).

I think carelessness happens every day by people who just don't want to pay attention to what they do.

But, because it is a gun, we always see that at the top of the list. Drunk drivers who don't care are just as dangerous.

Don't get me wrong. I believe in forms of gun control but believe it is a delicate balance. What we have in place seems to be a good start. Background checks, limitations on transfer, limitations on the types of weapons allowed; all are good methods of protecting public interest without unduly violating our liberties.

No, this is not about gun control. It about people who just don't care.

IMHO.”

“So viOLIN, your criteria for gun ownership is an IQ test?


"The average person is just too stupid to be trusted with gun ownership."
vIOLIN
01:34:23 PM
11/11/03"

How about we apply that criteria to other dangerous activities like automobiles only for the intelligent.

I think a major problem with both firearms and automobiles is inability to control anger, or are you implying that only stupid people get angry.

Well you do live in New Jersey where the legislature think that everone in the State (except them of course) is too stupid to propose a law (Referendum).”

“http://www.fraserinstitute.ca/shared/readmore.asp?sNav=nr&id=570


Gun Laws do Not Reduce Criminal Violence According to New Study

Contact(s):
Gary Mauser, Professor
Simon Fraser University, Tel (604) 291-3652
Email: Gary_Mauser@sfu.ca

Release Date: November 27, 2003

Vancouver, BC - Restrictive firearm legislation has failed to reduce gun violence in Australia, Canada, or Great Britain. The policy of confiscating guns has been an expensive failure, according to a new paper The Failed Experiment: Gun Control and Public Safety in Canada, Australia, England and Wales, released today by The Fraser Institute.

“What makes gun control so compelling for many is the belief that violent crime is driven by the availability of guns, and more importantly, that criminal violence in general may be reduced by limiting access to firearms,” says Gary Mauser, author of the paper and professor of business at Simon Fraser University.

This new study examines crime trends in Commonwealth countries that have recently introduced firearm regulations. Mauser notes that the widely ignored key to evaluating firearm regulations is to examine trends in total violent crime, not just firearm crime.

The United States provides a valuable point of comparison for assessing crime rates as that country has witnessed a dramatic drop in criminal violence over the past decade – for example, the homicide rate in the US has fallen 42 percent since 1991. This is particularly significant when compared with the rest of the world – in 18 of the 25 countries surveyed by the British Home Office, violent crime increased during the 1990s.

The justice system in the U.S. differs in many ways from those in the Commonwealth but perhaps the most striking difference is that qualified citizens in the United States can carry concealed handguns for self-defence. During the past few decades, more than 25 states in the U.S. have passed laws allowing responsible citizens to carry concealed handguns. In 2003, there are 35 states where citizens can get such a permit.

Disarming the public has not reduced criminal violence in any country examined in this study. In all these cases, disarming the public has been ineffective, expensive, and often counter productive. In all cases, the effort meant setting up expensive bureaucracies that produce no noticeable improvement to public safety or have made the situation worse. Mauser points to these trends in the countries he examined:

England and Wales

Both Conservative and Labour governments have introduced restrictive firearms laws over the past 20 years; all handguns were banned in 1997.

Yet in the 1990s alone, the homicide rate jumped 50 percent, going from 10 per million in 1990 to 15 per million in 2000. While not yet as high as the US, in 2002 gun crime in England and Wales increased by 35 percent. This is the fourth consecutive year that gun crime has increased.

Police statistics show that violent crime in general has increased since the late 1980s and since 1996 has been more serious than in the United States.

Australia

The Australian government made sweeping changes to the firearms legislation in 1997. However, the total homicide rate, after having remained basically flat from 1995 to 2001, has now begun climbing again. While violent crime is decreasing in the United States, it is increasing in Australia. Over the past six years, the overall rate of violent crime in Australia has been on the rise – for example, armed robberies have jumped 166 percent nationwide.

The confiscation and destruction of legally owned firearms has cost Australian taxpayers at least $500 million. The cost of the police services bureaucracy, including the costly infrastructure of the gun registration system, has increased by $200 million since 1997.

“And for what?” asks Mauser. “There has been no visible impact on violent crime. It is impossible to justify such a massive amount of the taxpayers’ money for no decrease in crime. For that kind of tax money, the police could have had more patrol cars, shorter shifts, or better equipment.”

Canada

The contrast between the criminal violence rates in the United States and in Canada is dramatic. Over the past decade, the rate of violent crime in Canada has increased while in the United States the violent crime rate has plummeted. The homicide rate is dropping faster in the US than in Canada.

The Canadian experiment with firearm registration is becoming a farce says Mauser. The effort to register all firearms, which was originally claimed to cost only $2 million, has now been estimated by the Auditor General to top $1 billion. The final costs are unknown but, if the costs of enforcement are included, the total could easily reach $3 billion.

“It is an illusion that gun bans protect the public. No law, no matter how restrictive, can protect us from people who decide to commit violent crimes. Maybe we should crack down on criminals rather than hunters and target shooters?” says Mauser.


Established in 1974, The Fraser Institute is an independent public policy organization based in Vancouver, with offices in Calgary and Toronto. ”

“For every report, there is a counter report.

I am beginning to think mandatory firearm education for all Americans makes more sense than increased gun control.

How much more control can we levy? Where does it stop. Those crying for a complete ban can forget it. (A) It won't happen and (B) there is no way to accomplish it.

So, accepting the fact that society is going to have firearms, what we need is increased education.

How many times do we read about a kid killing his sibling? Who is at fault there....(A) the parent for not being safe and (B) the child doesn't usually have a clue what kind of damage occurs until after the fact.

The first time I took my kids out and showed the the force and blast of a shotgun, I was about assured they wouldn't play with guns.


I think the most productive thing the NRA has done has been with their educational commercials....

"If you find a real gun, put it down, call an adult"

My kids had it memorized.”

“makes sense to me chili.”

“Mutt - there is so much wrong with that piece - it makes so many simplistic assumptions - that it's difficult to know where to start.”

“All gun confiscation does is take guns away from responsible citizens, and denies them the ability to defend themselves. Most criminals aren't getting their gats from the gun store. you take away the guns, the only people left with guns are outlaws and the government. How does that sound? I agree with chili, the key is education. That and locking the damn things up in a safe.”

“Mutt - there is so much wrong with that piece - it makes so many simplistic assumptions - that it's difficult to know where to start

Yeah, sure it's simplistic, ynamiynami. But I suppose you have replicated research that supports your anti-American gun-control perspective? Research that controls for all relevant variables? Research that utilizes unassailable methods and data collection techniques? Get back with me on that and then we'll talk.”

“Chili hit it pretty much on the head. Education is the key! I am not a gun owner. Not interested in keeping them around. But, that's my biz and I don't foist it on anyone else. I also don't believe that banning them is possible or practical. As far as defending yourself, that's fine if you feel that way. But, you better damned well be knowledgeable and accept accountability for that weapon. One concession gun proponents should make is that background checks, safety features and the like are not being administered as a measure towards taking your firearms away, no matter what you think. A lot of people have died as a result of these things. Therefore , these measures are not without merit. What rights are you giving up if you succumb to a background check (unless , of course, you have something to hide). And if you can't have that pretty shaft in your hands for another five days, well, sorry. Live with it. It ain't gonna kill ya. Who knows, maybe it won't kill someone else either...”

“Well mutt - maybe you should go look at some of the other "reports" by the Frasier Institute to see where they are coming from. Also why is a professor of business conducting a report into gun crime?

"anti-American gun-control perspective" - ooh - if you're gonna provoke you can do better than that - at least you called it "gun control" and didn't scream about banning guns, which is the usual line.

Mutt - I don't need to quote a report to know that there's more to a crime rate than gun control. Hopefully you know know that too - or do you really need a report to tell you that? Get back to me huh?”