Divorce Sucks

“In these instances, I don't think that there is or would be anything wrong with expecting the ex husband to help contribute towards the raising of the kids and other expenses
pinkbubelz
10:42:35 AM
11/19/04

Pink, if you noticed I posted earlier that I think the ex husband should pay child support. I don't believe he should pay so much that he can't afford to live either.

I don't believe in alimony. Most women now days work outside the home unless the husband is filthy rich and they don't have to. Yes some women decide to quit their jobs and stay home after the birth of a child. But they can go back out in the work force and get another job.

What other expenses are you referring to? If he pays child support he shouldn't have to pay for any of her expenses.

I believe joint credit cards should be split between the 2 people. If you have your own credit card/bills (in your name)it is your responsibility to pay them not your ex's (man or woman).

If the couple owns a house and both put money towards it either do one or two things: sell it and split the profit or buy the other one out.
If one party owned the house before the marriage the other person has no claim to it IMO.”

“I also think that the parent who has the children should only be responsible for 50% of all health costs of the children, after insurance. The other parent should be responsible for the other 50%. Child support is an iffy subject on how much is too much or too little if the children are small as their needs change constantly and so does their health at a young age.”

“Ewker - You are fighting a losing battle here.

I ONCE had a woman admit to me she might have contributed to the problems that led up to her divorce.
I always thought very highly of her after that, a honest woman.

It's all part of the 'woman as victim' that is ingrained into our legal system.”

“It's all part of the 'woman as victim' that is ingrained into our legal system.”
StoveStomper
12:33:04 PM
11/19/04

you got that right.




I also think that the parent who has the children should only be responsible for 50% of all health costs of the children, after insurance. The other parent should be responsible for the other 50%. Child support is an iffy subject on how much is too much or too little if the children are small as their needs change constantly and so does their health at a young age.”
Wolfeyes
12:26:20 PM
11/19/04

I agree that it should change as the child gets older.
What if the ex's insurance is better than the one who has custody of the child. If he/she carries the child on their insurance and pays the extra cost why should he/she have to pay extra on the Dr visits. Lots of if's there.
last edited: 11/19/04 12:41:17 PM”

“I bet I get a lot of 'hate' posts from that, but it's true.”

“don't fatter yourself stovestomper.”

“I'm too dang fat as it is, LOL.”

“don't fatter yourself stovestomper.”
ProwIer
12:39:57 PM
11/19/04
ignore this user

"click"”

“To be honest I think that often people coming out of a divorce think they've been shafted, and in some cases it's true. I think Ruby is right in that you have to see all the circumstances involved to be able to see what the true picture is.
Pink - it's easy to say these things from the outside, as you're likely getting only one side of the story, which in most cases is less than half the picture.
I run into some friends of my ex that we knew as a couple, and talking to some of the guys in the couples, I know I've been portrayed, in a very subtle way, as the villain of the piece. She comes across as caring and understanding, and her friends wonder why she is so accomodating to me, telling her they would be far tougher on me. But this represents about 20% of the story. I don't bother correcting them, as they are mainly her friends that I know these people from, and there's nothing to be gained in putting across what actually happened (in my view). But anyone giving my divorce as an example would say xxxx did this and that and Y2 was an idiot - any yet they couldn't be further from the truth.”

“Very true y2.
My ex spread so many lies that even a few of her women friends started doubting her after it was all over.”

“I'm not applying my example as one of women lying - it could be from either side. In the telling of the story few people are willing to admit the extent of their own mistakes.”

“Sass-

I gotta say (and Birch, you're welcome to listen) .. .I am tempted to look up that book.


Over the last few weeks I don't think you have let a single scrap of inneundo or sexually related observation get by you. (not that I am stalking you or anything . . .)


Its like you on one of them there hormone kicks .. .but haven't come down yet!
SO anyhooo .. . .if the book is at the root cause of your newfound . ..uh .. . .elevated levels of perceived interest. . . .it could be a good read.

Just my $.02 observation.”

“BTW, about the book. I think the author is Laura Corn. Highly recommend it. Get it.”

“"Corn"? Maybe that's where newgirl got her expression from...”

“to a review:

http://www.allsexreviews.com/nights_of_great_sex.htm”

“Damn, afraid to follow that link at work. But I'll check it out at home, thanks Lee.”

“Amazon.com sells it too. Nothing to be afraid of, trust me. ;)

You are correct Ruby.”

“Bit --

The link isn't as bad as it looks. Just look it up on Amazon, as suggested


Sass ---


That's it??????”

“I looked up on B&N. Thanks though!”

“What else do you want?!”

“Oh, I see what you want, didn't see your post for me before, sorry.
Yes, well, I am thirty one. I suppose I am on an hormone kick. =D (You stalker, you)

And btw, it's not so much a book that you read, but a book that you use, page by page, over the 101 nights, or days or whatever. You don't know what's in the pages until you choose one and unseal it.
last edited: 11/19/04 3:18:35 PM”

“Pink, if you noticed I posted earlier that I think the ex husband should pay child support. I don't believe he should pay so much that he can't afford to live either.

****
Well, none of these ex-husbands ever put up their 50% worth of childcare expenses before the divorces. (In my uncle's case, it's a moot point. Both cousins are grown, and out of college now.)

In all 3 examples, the wife was the PRIMARY child-rearing parent AND they worked from day 1 outside of the house AND they made the most money to begin with. None of the 3 ex husbands were pulling in their share of the expenses BEFORE the divorce. I don't see why they should crab about being RESPONSIBLE for 50% of the childcare expenses--it should only make them realize the amount of weight their ex wives had in terms of finances. If they can't afford to pay child care, that's unfortunate, but they shouldn't be mad, since they helped to bring these kids into the world! If they have a problem with not being able to continue to live the style of living they are used to, then they really should consider finding a 2nd job or getting a better-paying job.... I don't think it's really THAT hard-- lots of people do it, and many are even married! It all depends upon how you look at things.... In all 3 cases, the women basically were "single moms" who happened to have a live-in spouse (for the amount of work the husbands did towards the upbringing of the children.) It's not like any of these men were incapable of a higher earning potential-- they just didn't seem to have the drive to change their circumstances.




I don't believe in alimony. Most women now days work outside the home unless the husband is filthy rich and they don't have to. Yes some women decide to quit their jobs and stay home after the birth of a child. But they can go back out in the work force and get another job.

What other expenses are you referring to? If he pays child support he shouldn't have to pay for any of her expenses.

****
I agree--he should not have to pay for HER expenses... Just pay for his child support expenses and quit the whining and moaning! I just don't get the crabbing about how much they have to pay. My friend's ex (the last of the 3 examples) is only now getting the reality of how expensive it is to raise children.... Unfortunately, he didn't appreciate it when the were married....so now, all of a sudden, he wants to be a "super dad" so that he can get custody and "stick it to her"!




I believe joint credit cards should be split between the 2 people. If you have your own credit card/bills (in your name)it is your responsibility to pay them not your ex's (man or woman).

******
The problem is that my friend's EX husband incurred most of the debt. For example, buying the cottage WITHOUT her permission--she never even set foot or eyes on it until AFTER he spent the money. There is no way she would have approved it if she HAD seen the cottage before he paid for it. (Trust me--there was a whole room that was mildewed, the bathroom was BLACK with mildew and I think I've seen pictures of houses in 3rd world countries that didn't have as much grime in them. It was deplorable-- and he wanted to have his 3 kids sleep in the Mildewy room!)

The debt incurred over the building of the (un-finished) addition was joint, I agree-- that should be split down the middle. But for him to have 1/2 of the money from the house seems a bit excessive....


If the couple owns a house and both put money towards it either do one or two things: sell it and split the profit or buy the other one out.
If one party owned the house before the marriage the other person has no claim to it IMO.


****
Exactly-- She OWNED the house BEFORE the marriage! (he was only 20 at the time they got married--and never lived a day outside of his parents' house.) He now wants 1/2 ownership, since they re-financed and his name got put on the deed (Yes, in hindsight, she agrees that was foolish--but then again, she didn't anticipate getting divorced.) Yes, they added an addition, but it is still un-finished and he is trying to get it appraised as though it was a finished room! (AND, it still has building code violations as well as safety issues!)



Y2-- Yes, I'm seeing some of the things from the outside, but on the otherhand, I'm seeing some from the inside as well, because I've had to testify on my friend's behalf that she isn't a raving lunatic....

I tried to be neutral in the issue at first-- told him that we would be supportive, no matter what, however, he soon started getting so nasty that wasn't worth it any more. He even had his attorney try to get me to say that her house is a filthy pigsty--to which I responded that it didn't look any dirtier than for the 9 years he lived in it...

She kept trying to tell him that if they could come to an agreement on an amiable basis, they wouldn't have to deal with the horrendous court costs and actually SAVE some of their hard-earned cash, vs. lining the pockets of their attorneys. He decided that he'd rather pay his attorney than to actually sit down and reason things out rationally. He won't even talk to her civilly (and I've witnessed this at least 3 or 4 times in the last 9 months.)to the point that when the 4 of us (Thinkbubelz and me and my friend and her ex) went to their church, he refused to even sit in the same row-- (even if he was on the other end of the row!) It's too bad, really. I truly think he had a major Napolean complex throughout their marriage and its ugly head has reared itself now. (She's 5-10" and he was about 5-8".) He's in denial and angry that he has to pay so much child support....

On the other hand, 2 other friends who are in the midst of a recent divorce with her husband (no children, just 2 dogs) are handling it with minimal fuss and muss. They are doing what you said--one buying out the other on the house, it's sad to see them split, but at least they are both approaching things like adults and not revengeful children.....
last edited: 11/19/04 3:56:41 PM”

“gosh...I see so much unhappiness here......I have been married twice.....and I know SOME of both marriages not lasting, was my fault....I look around and don't see very many happily married folks....so I wonder if there is such a thing...I grew up in a fatherless home with an alcoholic mom.....I guess that may be why I am not good at relationships....so sometimes I am clueless how to deal with things.....not a good excuse... I know.....but it takes two to tango and most of all....the kids suffer ...that is one reason I stayed this time so long...I figured two unhappy parents was better than one.....Both my ex's are nice guys most the time ...... just too much happened to go back.....anyway.....I like being single....but would like to be married.......and share everything with someone......LOL...aren't I pathetic???”

“Divinity, I will speak up loud and proud as an extremely happily married man. Been great friends for almost 17 years, been a couple for 11 years and been married for a touch over 8. It just keeps gettin better.”

“I am SOOOO...happy for you...I would LOVE to have that!!!!......”

“Do you have an older brother...or a single dad??


LOL..hahahha”

“Been with my gf then wife since I was 17. We've been together almost 16 years, married 10 this past August.

I'll have to check out the book.

There is one out that teaches guys how to be multi - orgasmic. Very cool.”

“Dayhiker....THAT is great!!!


and....NO sex talk.....

:(
last edited: 11/19/04 5:16:43 PM”

“Divinity-- some day you'll find the right person...

Thinkbubelz and I met 3 days after we started college. Knew each other almost 7 years (20 days short!) when when we got married. We've been married 12 years, 2 months and 2 weeks.... :-) We've known each other and been together now for more than 1/2 of our lives!

We definitely have had our ups and downs at times, (our worst year was when we turned 30 and lost 6 relatives between the 2 of us within 6 months of each other--the grief put a tremendous strain...but we both committed ourselves to working on our relationship and keeping our communication lines open and it saved our marriage. I think that the breakdown in communication is a great factor in many marriages and if both partners don't feel the same amount of commitment towards keeping those lines open, it can kill their relationship.


Dayhiker--

Funny thing-- 2 couples we know in "troubled relationships" would tell us about how great their sex lives were... however, the problem was the great lack of communication outside of the bedroom..... and one of my friends told me her ex read that book-- that it WAS very helpful for them in bed (but unfortunately, it did not help their marriage.)
last edited: 11/19/04 5:18:53 PM”

“Div, no brothers and my dad is 64 and married.

Dayhiker, me and Sass met in High School too. Such a touching story. As many whove seen me know I wear my hair short, very very very short. Her first words to me were "what are you some kind of skinhead". I responded "what are you some kind of B I T C H?" Love at first sight, we were 15.


oh yeah, buy the book. seriously, you not regret it..ever.
last edited: 11/19/04 6:20:47 PM”

“wow, I feel for you guys/girls that got screwed in your divorces. Really I do....

However, you all seem so bitter in general. Haven't you figured it out yet?

YOU CHOSE THE WRONG ONE TO MARRY!

Why would you think that someone worth divorcing would be gentle, kind and giving through that process?? Learn the lesson, move on. It will be cleansing, I guarantee.”

“Sorry....don't mean to whine... and TMI....”

“TMI divinity? I wasn't commenting on your post at all.

Nor was I claiming to be great in the relationship category. Believe me you can read about the breakup queen on the dating sucks thread. And I've been divorced for quite some time, so I didn't get it right that time either.

I just meant that individuals get all caught up in whose fault and who gets more. How can anyone heal with the kind of feelings I'm reading here? It just makes me sad.”

“I'm still happy.”

“One of the most wonderful things about marriage can be watching each other grow. We never stop growing and learning. And DHutch is right. When we complain about our spouses or significant others, we tend to forget that we did choose them. Pink is right too, about communication. I read here all the posts from men and it's quite touching, really, to really see that men are just as affected by all this as women are.

My philosophy about relationships with people is simple: I try very hard to maintain a positive relationship with everyone who I "choose" to have one with, including friends and family. If ever I end up in a hospital bed, where I may take my last breath, it is people that were in my life that I would hope would come to see me. It sure is not going to be furniture, half of a house or a whole house, a boat, an SUV, my 401K, my savings, my debt, or my gear, that is going to sit at my side and comfort me at that time.

So, get whatever you can out of a divorce or a bad relationship. But, make sure that one of those things is your ability to see the beauty through all the ugliness. In the end, it will matter...trust me. Being bitter gets you no where fast.”

“If the TMI's were directed at me, I was just passing book info along too. The book actually takes 1 month of so to follow through with, which I haven't done. So there, I wasn't making any bold claims.

I left out that my wife and I met when I was in the 4th grade. We each still remember the meeting!”

“And now that the realization of what she's done is setting in, the inevitable I #&%!$ed up and now I want my life back is starting.
As much anger and hurt as I have it's still hard to see someone that I've loved for 9 years hurting.
These will be some of the hardest days for me because I am still very vulnerable myself. But I have to stay strong and not lose sight of the choices that I've made and that I know are right.
This was so much easier when the anger and hurt were still fresh.
I feel like I've come to peace with the decisions I've made and I'm ready to get on with my life. I hope that I can maintain the strength and clarity to continue to make the right decisions for myself and for my daughter without entirely turning my back on someone who I love and care for, and who I know has a long and painful road ahead of her; as I do.”

“Indiana John, who filed for the divorce? You or her? And why is the realization setting in on her part? Did her "new life" fall apart and she is now looking at a mess that she created, trying to fall back into the comfort zone she had with you, or did she have a healthy realization by stepping back from the mess and looking at it from a perspective by herself? In other words, if she is going through this realization, then fine. But, the truth is that her actions created consequences and how her actions affected you and your marriage, are one of those consequences. You can't just go out and have a good ole time, make a rash decision that creates change, and expect that change to not occur in some way, shape or form. A tangled web has been weaved in her life. Let her live in it for awhile.”

“Indiana,
one of my friends made the same comment-- that it was very hard to see someone whom they thought had been their best friend and whom they had loved at one time, now turn their back on her.... She was willing to accept that the marriage was over (and that they were both unhappy and at fault).

The harder thing to accept was that she no longer could trust someone who at one time was her best friend....”

“Wolfeyes, I really don't know what has brought on this recent change because right now I don't have much contact with her except for what concerns our child.
I know that you are right and as of now that is where things stand. When she tries to get mushy when I pick up my daughter, i just tell her I don't have time to talk. But that doesn't make it any easier to see someone you love hurt even if they did bring it on themselves. It's a nasty business”

“pink - she cheated on him while he was sick.
She trusting him isn't an issue.

wolfie - You are a wise woman for one so young.”

“Hang tight, IJ.
I still loved the 'good' parts of my ex for several years after we parted, but you can't overlook the 'bad' parts.”

“Uh, how many of her "good parts" did you keep, Stovey?”

“I hope all he kept were memories. If not then they'd better have been refrigerated.”

“he pickled her good parts, no refrigeration needed”

“lol, you guys are killing me”

“Hee hee hee....
I'll never tell..... ;-)”

“Stovie-- Oops.
No sympathy for her then.
That's hitting a guy when he's at his lowest.

Indiana--Maybe she "found God" and now is seeking your forgiveness to make herself feel better? Some people don't know what they have until it is gone... (speaking on general terms, of course, because I don't know you personally)”

“It comes back to that ol saying, "Be careful what you ask for. You just might get it."

I love that saying. I have also had to remember it myself a few times.”

“All done and dusted. Yay!!!!”