LNT Ethics for Witches

“This is an interesting story and I hope the person concerned is not offended by my inquiries and for sharing this. I know this type of stuff freaks her out.

The background story:

This passed weekend on a trip one of us found two small mirrors in a small hollowed spot in a tree. The mirrors were the size of nickels and they were stacked on top of each other, one down one up. There was a small black velvet bag at the base of the tree. Now being the good little hiker she is she removed them. She asked me what they were and being near the town they were I said they were probably some type of Wiccan fetish. She concurred. She later did as her faith would instruct her to do, she destroyed (threw it in the fire).

I was curious as to what exactly this might have been so I registered onto a Wiccan web board (great! Now I’m going to get witch spam forever!) and asked what it might be. The fullest explanation I got was this one…


“Well, given what limited info you have, one can only speculate.
The landscape you describe could be associated with the womb
of the goddess; the main physical elements present, water and
earth, being ruled by the feminine aspects of the divine and
living earth. The gorge, an earth passage, and the river,
active water, seems tied to the primal blood of creation.
The timing suggests a hope of fertility, as this past weekend
marks the first full moon of the dawning spring, and thus a
rebirth of life. Mirrors are often regarded as a portal or
a gateway, and seeing as these two were faceing outward I
would have to guess the crafter was hoping to bridge the spirit
with the material, perhaps to accumulate the energies of the
time and place. It's significant that the mirrors were circular,
being the form of completion and of perfection. This is also
the cipher of the earth, and this brings us to the feminine
duality again- as mirrors are often regarded as symbolic of
water. Without knowing the type of tree, I can't even guess
what part it may play, but I suspect it's important. Trees
are often seen as being bridges, reaching towards the heavens,
yet rooted in the soil- another portal symbol. I suspect
that the item was intended to be retrieved by the crafter,
and either used as a charm, or incorporated into spellwork.
Being found,in situ, within the cauldron of the forest, it could
also be a relic from a rite performed nearby, an offering.
The circumstances are simply too fuzzy to be more specific.
My guess? Just a couple of mirrors someone stuck on a tree.
Any further conjecture is pointless without knowing what energies
may have been associated with them by the crafter, if any.”

What followed was lively discussion about LNT ethics among witches. It is a very interesting discussion. Of course some just wanted to harp on the fact that some messed with a spiritual item left there by some for a purpose…near a trail on public lands of course where it was sure to be found. It does bring up an interesting point about what the bounds are concerning religious rights and public lands as well as LNT ethics.

Please just read and don’t troll them. They are for the most part peaceful people and they are doing nothing but trying to help me out. Trolling would only reflect badly on hikers.

”

“Sorry, click the little dash to go to Mystic Wick's thread. And forgive the typoes. Sheesh!”

“She concurred. She later did as her faith would instruct her to do, she destroyed (threw it in the fire).


interesting subject. I also would like to know at what point does her faith tell her to do something like this? if i throw a cross into a fire, all hell would break lose. not sure if it was in her right to do something like this.

this is a form of white magic, its not evil. its a very cool religion.
sorry to say this, but your friend had no right to mess with someone else religious artifacs.”

“i concur with the leaf of maple for once”

“So, then you would agree it's okay for bacpac to erect crosses in the wilderness?”

“why would that be wronge?


im not offened by it. now if he put up a bloody J Christ on it, then that would offend me. not sure why.

where in the bible does it say to destroy anothers religion?
she had no clue why it was there,
it could have been evil, but it could have been for good.”

“The timing suggests a hope of fertility, as this past weekend
marks the first full moon of the dawning spring, and thus a
rebirth of life.

evil, i tell you! jk”

““I also would like to know at what point does her faith tell her to do something like this?”

This was MY speculation, not hers. She just didn’t want anything to do with it but my background in Judaism (the root of Christianity) I know the mitzvah concerning idolatrous items and idols and how to deal with them. Let’s not focus on the right/wrong of her actions as you were not there but the ethics of trashing public lands. One man’s holy relic is another man’s mundane object. Let’s remain mature.”

“Someone once destroyed my sacrifical rock slab in the woods and defaced the pentagram on it. I thought everyone new a pentagram was used to ward off evil spirits. Oh, and the animal we used was already dying before it volunteered.”

“One man’s holy relic is another man’s mundane object. Let’s remain mature."

she was only stating her opinion on the issue.. if u want to remain mature why'd u post on TT, lol”

“"but the ethics of trashing public lands"

ok try to find out if the land was at one time owned by someone else. then there is the question, can a man own the land?


look at the native Ameriacans, they "owned" land and it was takin away from them. now if they go back and place religious items on the "land". is that wronge?

there is no right or wronge answer.”

“"if u want to remain mature why'd u post on TT, lol"

I'm beginning to wonder that myself.”

“WTF?


no no its a very good question.”

“look at the native Ameriacans, they "owned" land and it was takin away from them. now if they go back and place religious items on the "land". is that wronge?

i agree... there's really no right or wrong answer,.. just a matter of beliefs and opinions. personally, i believe that the wiccan culture can do as they please with their objects/icons. as far as the LNT morale goes, maybe they should come back for their objects once their rituals are done?”

“remeber when gemini yelled at us when we tried to enter the "circle"

that was funny!

Nigal, ok please re-explaine your orig question please.”

“The fact is WE own the land. Indians do have religious rights in the manner in which you suggested I believe. This was not Indian religion. So just to flip the script, is it ok to hang crosses on the trees too then?”

“is it just crosses or is it anything to do with religion?”

“maple, that was me! then during the day i wasn't skeered anymore, so i entered... no wonder why i've been having bad luck since then!”

“your just evil!

we found this cross on private (dont ask) and we left it there. but then again it was right next to a dead fox.

cross”

“"is it just crosses or is it anything to do with religion?"

OK, let's say an actual crucifix. Or as someone on the thread brought up, what if a Buddhist came along and tied a bunch of prayer flags to the tree? Still OK?”

“that's why they call me Evil Meliz”

“but nigal, dont they say that being in nature is just like being in a church?”

“if someone was getting into nature, then why not.”

“i like to get into nature”

“"but nigal, dont they say that being in nature is just like being in a church?"

"if someone was getting into nature, then why not."

So what you are saying is that if a christian goes to Yellowstone and hangs a crucifix at every campsite they stay and pray at, and LEAVES them there, that’s OK? Or if a Buddhist goes to say Baxter park and starts hanging and tying prayer flags on the trees that’s OK?”

“maybe whoever put the ritual in this tree was coming back for it... sometimes wiccan rituals take longer than just saying a prayer at a cross. they can take days.”

“maybe i just feel that this is where I connect with God.


i think i would be more upset if i stumbled upon a dead animal that was used.”

“either way, what she did is done and over with. maybe she effed a ritual up, maybe not. one can only speculate and it'll never be known.”

“good point Nigal and Scorch.

your both right :)”

“You should go back with leave a note there with the link this this thread.”

“Sorry bearmagnet, that was me. I took a leak on it too.

Chalk it up to 'youthful indiscretion'.”

“my daughters pet hamster died (not by my doing) and we buried him in the local park. now we put a make shift memorial there, it made my daughter feel much better. do you think i offened anyone?”

“you offended me. i hate hamsters.”

“Could be, I don't know. Is there a specific reason you buried it in a public park? Would it make her feel better if you returned to find a dog had dug it up and torn it to shreds?”

“Thanks Nigal.”

“GEEZ NIG...


lol we put it in the park cause we lived in a apartment at the time. heck we have one upstate and one in NJ. we dont have a lot of wild dogs running around.”

“Then again New Yorkers are pretty hard to offend! LOL! Some homless guy might have even apreciated it. Hey, no dumpster divin' tonight!”

“wow, i thought i was morbid at times”

“nigal go put your pants on and go sit in the corner.

have you ever heard about the hamster in the tree story?



your as evil as scorch

bales is just an idoit”

“evil is as evil does, sir”

“Howsabout I take them OFF and go to the corner?”

“going to amuse yourself again?

take bales with you!”

“pictures?”

“do you really want pics?”

“of nigal sitting in the corner with his pants down? hell yea... blackmail.”

“As if there's anyone doesn't know about THAT practice?”

“apparently not maple!”

“ok take a pic. then i can go camping and post your pic everywhere and pray to it.



see how i brought it back on topic :D”

“1 leftover hamster
3 cans chicken broth
1 can water
1 small onion, halved quartered
1 1/2 cups baby carrot
1 teaspoon curry
1 tablespoon honey
1/2 teaspoon salt
1/2 teaspoon pepper
1/2 teaspoon paprika
1 (28.00 ounces) can new potatoes, chopped
1 can cream of mushroom soup


1. In your crockpot combined together the hamster, onion, carrots, curry, honey, salt, pepper, and paprika.
2. Turn to high and let cook for 6 hours.
3. Remove the hamster and discard.
4. Add new potatoes and cream of mushroom, stir to combine.
5. Let cook for at least 30 more minutes.
6. Serve over rice, egg noodles, or just by itself with a nice country salad and a big knot of bread.
7. **You can add 2 cans of cream of mushroom if you like it more like chowder than soup.”