Job interview, but no salary talk

“I interviewed late last week for a city editor job at a daily in a town of of around 25,000 in my area.

Spent from 12:30 until around 4:30 p.m. there (on a day I was cutting work to do this). Ate lunch with the editor. Talked to staffers. (I asked them questions. They asked me questions. Etc.)

Witnessed the call to their "sister" paper down the road at 4 p.m. as to what goes on which pages, etc.

So as the interview ends, I ask Mr. Editor about benefits. He said, oh we have great benefits, insurance including vision and dental, retirement including a great match from the company (which is a fairly large corporation owning quite a few mid-size dailies), blah blah, I'll have more details for you down the line.

I said, what about salary? He said something to blow it off, then said, well, what do you make now? I said, I'd prefer not to say. He said, I have two other candidates to interview yet next week. If we choose to work with you, we'll talk about it then.

WTF??!?!? Is this some new trend in job interviews?? Only the final candidate is given any kind of salary info??

I was very disappointed. If there was one thing I wanted out of the interview -- save for the job itself -- it was to find out what that company paid for that job, or a salary range for it.

I felt robbed. Isn't an interview a sharing of information?

The guy seemed nice enough, etc. He had just been given more management duties and this new job would take some lesser management coordination jobs off his shoulders. So perhaps with the recent job switches within the organization, he just hadn't had time to figure it out. Or maybe this is just how this corporation operates.

I am contemplating writing a thank you -- which I need to get to them soon -- and liken leaving that job without salary and benefit information to coming back to the paper with a story with a huge hole in it that needs to be filled. At this point, I would either think they'd figure I was very good, for standing up for my rights and giving a perfect parallel -- or they'd hate me, and at this point I'm not sure I care.

Or maybe they just thought I sucked from the first words I uttered... and they figured I was essentially a non-candidate.

Anyhoo, has anyone else run into this????”

“(It must be because I make errors in my opening sentences. LMAO!!)”

“Most professional jobs only discuss the salary after they have decided they want you.
The salary is negotiated between y'all later.
Usually an offer is made, I make a counter offer, we settle somewhere in between.”

“hmmmmmmmm, OK, that's why I'm asking. I perhaps have not interviewed for such a "professional" job before.

Although, I've interviewed for jobs that pay more than I anticipate this will... and salary came up in the initial interview.”

“I think you may have hit it with "they don't really know yet" and he didn't want to get pinned down - he may not have gotten full approval for the position, which would be a little sloppy on his part.

But normally they'll give you a range at least, but not always.

Go ahead and send the thank you, thats very appropriate and maybe indicate you look forward to finding out more when you talk again.”

“Too early to talk money.

A suggestion for when it's time to talk: They offered, I counter offered.




Are you ready?




The next person to speak loses!”

“i was just wondering if $$ was the reason you're looking for another job....

if so, perhaps giving him your current payrate would be in order. i mean, you could highball it a little, no?

i think it's prolly common to do what he did. but i have a pretty stable job history so i don't get out much.

i'll ask buffalobabe, she's more of a white collar type than i.

best of luck to ya lizzy!”

“Liz -- It's been my experience that pay, benefits, etc.. are never discussed in the initial interview.”

“I thought salary negotiations were to occur in a second interview.

The folks I interviewed with last week seem eager to get the project going and yesterday said they'll be sending me an *offer package* in the mail very soon to be signed and returned asap. But we never really discussed what the terms of my job will be. So I faxed them a letter yesterday stating how soon I can be avaliable to work and questions like...
-Where are the sites that Matrix employees will be working at (ie. nearest town(s) in PA)?
-What are the expected weekly hours for this Technician position (ie. 40-50, 60-80, etc.)?
-Is weekend work anticipated/expected?
-Will sick days and/or personal leave with pay be provided?
-Which holidays will we be given off? Are they paid holidays?
Amount of paid vacation?
-Will health benefits be available in the near future?

It's like they (may) want me to sign on the dottted line without even knowing what all to expect from them. I even had to mention my vacation plans for this summerbecause, well, they have a right to know.

I have a feeling these guys bid on a job, got the bid and are now quickly forming a legit company to make it official. No benefits package, no retirement plan, etc., but the pay is twice what I make now.”

“You shouldn't have let them know how much time you take off from work for backpacking during the year. And what were you thinking when you mentioned TT under computer experience? With the date and time under all your posts, they can see your devotion to TT during your working hours. LOL.”

“My take is that he felt like you closed the door on money discussion and that was that. Writing a letter and using that analogy would be the worst thing to do. That analogy doesn't apply. Your rights haven't been trampled on and they aren't asking you to leave a job without knowing the money. They just aren't willing to divulge right now. That's not the same thing.

If this was a good job to have before the interview, then it's a good job now (that's assuming this was the only issue). Hang tight and see what happens.”

“I would definitely followup as a courtesy and express your interest in the position. As far as the salary, that has often been my experience. One piece of advice, it is a bad negotiation move to be the first to give a number. Try and get the other party to do so, then you can adjust accordingly. The danger is asking for too little. He may have been trying to pin you down, with the plan to drop you if you wanted too much money.

I may also be in time to check out

Ask The Headhunter”

“I usually expect my prospective employees to tell me how much they want to make. This tells me what they think they are worth and, from my evaluation of their interview, whether they are out of line in their demands. When the editor asked you your present salary, you should have told him/her how much you were expecting to make.
Good luck, Lizzy.”

“How do you get a city editor job for a daily that's in a "town"? 25,000 is a heck of a big city over here. Probly have stop and go lights too. Indoor toilets.”

“Hey, probably, Snake Eyes. LOL!

Interesting stuff getting posted here. Maybe it's because I've been in journalism, but I have just never been to an initial interview where salary didn't come up. And I've interviewed for a number of jobs over the years, looking for that elusive combination of good pay AND a fair amount of freedom of schedule and time off. I have the latter now -- and it's probably more important to me than the money and is certainly more important to me than climbing any career ladder.

Anyway, the interview process had been pretty informal. It just really surprised me that A) salary and benefits didn't come up, and B) the guy seemed taken aback when I asked.

I know enough not to mention what I "make" right away, which is why I said "I'd prefer not to say." Quite frankly, I was taken back by his answer. So, if I screwed up by not playing the game and saying, "Oh, I will be happy to talk about that when you have a salary range to discuss," so be it.

In the meantime, I celebrated my third anniversary at my current job and await a raise in tomorrow's paycheck. Will see how that pans out.”

“Be sure to mention you know how to spell 'whao'.....”

“Is that "wahoo??"

:-)”

“In initial interviews I'm trying to figure out if the candidate is worth having. Were are their skills, what are their weaknesses and where is their head at.

I want to know for sure if the candidate is genuinely interested in what we do and what we are all about. Many times someone will persue a job that they have no real interest in simply because it pays more. I don't want those people here.

They gotta tell me they want the job and I have to narrow the field before I'll talk money.”

“Do you expect sex on the first date too? When I got out of college 20 odd years ago they gave us a seminar on how job interviews are conducted. In polite circles, money is never discussed on the first interview. That doesn't mean you weren't supposed to know what the average starting salary for your occupation was, you just didn't bring it up. Now if the employer brought it up that was fine.

Dear I'm afraid you've committed the cardinal prospective employee gaffe. Forget about that job. Run away and join the circus.”

“Hell, that's a whole 'nother career field.”

“Woha!”

“waitaminute... You were there for four hours? They know you are already working? They should have at least given you an idea as to range. I just don't talk specifics.

It seems kinds rude to me to make someone miss half a day of work without giving them an idea if the position might be worth their time.”

“...Do you expect sex on the first date too?...
solitary hiker

Most of the single guys on TT will think "God I hope so!". ;-)”

“Spoken as one who's been there, done that, SS?

>>hugs Stovey<<”

“HPM says what I meant, you should have gotten a clue as to their budget range at least.”

“Well, that's what I thought. :-) Hence, I thought I would throw the dilemma to the wolves here and see what a good cross-section of people say.”

“Well, damn, I've always put my salary expectations in my cover letter. Hasn't hurt me yet, I've gotten an offer from every job I've ever applied for...”

“from EVERY job you've ever applied for?? good grief, that's crazy!”

“Lets see... when I put my salary expectations out there, seems I get shot down. :-)

I interviewed at the local private college around 2000. Was in essence hired. BUT the college wouldn't match my newspaper salary, which was just frickin' ridiculous (OK, so you can send your kids there free... lotta good that's gonna do ME!! lol). They wouldn't match. I didn't go to work there.

I think places around the Upper Midwest are used to paying low wages... and especially used to paying women low wages.

So anyhoo.... I was thinking about you folks saying that wages often don't come up until they've decided on you. LOL! Did I mention the salary has normally been talked about in initial interviews I've attended. LOL!! ;-P”

“Well, let's see, I'm only on my fourth job in my career...I have had three other MW jobs, but I don't really count them. I've applied at a couple of MW places that weren't interested, maybe because they thought I was a troublemaker, lol...”

“I had a nice talk with the V.P. today about some concerns within my group at work. He listened and let me know he'd follow up with a few things, since he shared the same concerns I had. Even offered me another job within the company if I got too frustrated.

An hour later, a recruiter called me with a job at a competitor. Pay raise would be 20-30K more than what I make now.

Hmmm.....”

“quit your cry baby belly aching moaning sissy crap...

pony up and suck it up and quit whining.

whaaaa whaaaa whaaaa”

“Maybe they don't want you in their cult anymore?

Or perhaps it's just another test?”

“almost every job I have applied for, they ask for salary req.

so i guess they know how much im looking to make. so if they call me and want an interview, i already have a clue what the $$ might be.
your a very smart person and I wish you nothing but good luck :D”

“The timing is too suspicious.
Sounds like the VP knew someone was about to offer you another job.
Just about all my big pay increases have come about due to changing jobs. It's the nature of Engineering. Consider that new offer!”

“20 to 30K more?

Unless I really love where I'm at then......Bye.”

“Liz -- It's been my experience that pay, benefits, etc.. are never discussed in the initial interview."
TownDawg
03:56:02 AM
03/30/04

Dear I'm afraid you've committed the cardinal prospective employee gaffe.
solitary hiker
11:58:50 AM
03/30/04

Same here. I always thought salary was usually discussed on the follow up interview, if they like you enough for the follow-up.”

“Smiley, I told you the PE wasn't too big a deal in some situations. Do the words, strike while the iron is hot ring a bell? OTOH, do you know the flavor of that other firm. Does the work atmosphere work for your personality?”

“You know what, Stickman Walking? Go by the "rules." Oh yeah, who makes the rules? Just exactly who abides by them?

Good question. One never knows. Should you strike out on your own and make an impression by walking to your own drummer? Or stick with the masses and the "rules?"

The jobs I've interviewed for salary always came up right away. Maybe they just want me sooooo bad. ;-P”

“Let's see:
Recently -- Second Place Personal Column Award, Minnesota Free Paper Association
Last year -- General Excellence Award for the newspaper where I currently work. That means the paper was tops in our circulation category in the state, Minnesota Newspaper Association.

We're not talking chopped liver here! lol”

“All of my first interviews have been like this, Lizs.

I've only discussed salary when offered the job.”

“Ok ..... we've beat up on Lizs enough. It's not like she did something really bad. At least she trusts us enough to ask our advice.
And who else works in the newpaper industry? Maybe it's standard operating procedure to ask for the money right up front. If they hold it against her then to hell with that them.”

“Someone's a little touchy.”

“Liz:: :).. sorry liz.. if we sounded harsh. We know we NEVER are rude to one another here on TT.

:)

Hey.. good luck!!.. Trust in your skills, it will all work out.

Mapleleaf: Ya.. but in NYC? You are just trying to figure out if you can afford the parking!!”

“Liz, for real, check out the Ask the Head Hunter site. Find the job you deserve, get it and get paid what you deserve!”

“talked to the recruiter again last night. i kinda knew when he first called that i wasn't the gal for the job, but when he threw out that salary, i couldn't help but be intrigued. he's looking for someone with a strong hydraulics/hydrology background, which I don't have. he did ask me what i was currently making, and more or less let me know i'm about 10-15K behind the benchmark. whether that's just a recruiter talking and buttering me up if another job comes his way, i'm not sure. but i'll be doing some investigation on my own in the next few days.

based on the fact that it wasn't even a job i am qualified for, i believe the call was totally random. i used to date a recruiter, and know that they cold-call all the time. i had actually talked to this recruiter before, so he knew me and my background a bit. i don't think it was any kind of "test".

the company he was recruiting for is somewhat known for hiring when they're busy and not thinking too hard about laying people off when it slows down. i actually had an offer from them when i got the offer for my current job. they offered me more money and a signing bonus, but this is a better work environment (cult and all!) but for 20-30K more and knowing that i'll only be in this business a few more years, i just may strike at another opportunity.”

“LOL! Yup, NEVER rude. hehehehehee

I was just reading Pamster's thread about her promotion. It's all what you want. Am I happy where I'm at? Yeah, probably 95% of the time. Real happy.

I'm covering some hot stories right now... I probably should be contacting some big mags to freelance a story on the area environmental group that has, in a little over one year, managed to delay a controversial plant and get a decision by the Minnesota Pollution Control Agency sent back to them by a judge for further review. It's not dull here, at least not currently.

I can walk into work at 7 a.m or 10 a.m. or not even till 2 p.m. .... work until midnight if I like... and I have no one to report to or breathing down my neck. (How many of you can say that??)

The pay could be better, but that's the way it is. The "trade-off."

Anyhoo, like I said, you all can say "no money talk till the second interview," but obviously in probably 20 job interviews throughout my career money HAS ALWAYS come up in the first interview. So I guess that would mean it's not a "rule," wouldn't it now? Perhaps it has to do with the type of job or location of job. But your blanket rule does not apply, because I can give you 20 instances just myself where it didn't.

It's interesting to hear others' experience. I surely had never come across the experience of not talking money on an intitial interview. And do I feel for a 4-hour interview that money should come up? YES.

As I said, I went into this interview with one expectation --and that was to find out how much a job like this pays. Ask a couple of my co-workers about my pre-interview discussions with them, they can tell you I said that.

So... on my end the interview is a failure. Oh, don't worry, yes I tried to give my "bestest" interview. But in the end that was the one thing I wanted out of it, to know how much that job pays. I know how much it pays at a smaller daily owned by another corp. (and that pay was crap). I have an idea how much I think it will be. But how close am I? I'm thinking it will not be enough more to even tempt me.

Bottom line: I expected to find out how much it paid on my initial, four-hour interview. I didn't. That sucks.”

“well well, the recruiter called me back today and says the guy looking for someone is interested in me, wants to interview me. i said i'd call the recruiter back.

i'm checking into salary ranges with a few key folks here. if i can get more money here, all the better for me. not sure i'd leave my current job right now. but for 20-30K more, its certainly an interesting proposition.”

“Head for the light, SG, head for the light...


lol, j/k...I'm sure you'll make the right decision...”

“smiley - Now's the time to carefully try and get a little more money from your present job!

When this happened to me, I had pretty much decided to accept the new job. I let my big boss know I was offered another job and gave them the chance to match or do better. Sometimes this works, sometimes not.
They offered a pretty good raise and I decided to stay put for the time being.”