Republican Idealism Steal American Jobs

“Most of the idiots that grace his show are republicans, so by appointing him, we are tricking thier feeble minds to vote democrat. :)”

“Why do I hear the sounds of the flood gates starting to open!?!


LOL!”

“I could go for a Cusenich/Springer ticket in 2008. Steve the bouncer could be secretary of defense.”

“"Steve the bouncer could be secretary of defense....."

It would be about time a bald, white guy got that job.

The world needs more people "sans folicals"......!”

“full transcript April 24, 2003

President Bush: Thanks for the warm welcome. I appreciate you letting me come by to say hello. I'm honored to be in Canton, and I'm honored to be here at the Timkin company. Tim was telling me that you all have been in business since 1899.
[...]
I know you're optimistic about the future of this company. I'm optimistic about the future of our country.

It's important that Washington, however, respond to some of the problems we face. One of the problems we face is, not enough of our fellow Americans can find work; there's too much economic uncertainty today. And so three months ago, I sent Congress a package that would promote job growth and economic vitality. For the sake of our country, for the sake of the workers of America, Congress needs to pass this jobs growth package soon.

And that's why I thank you for letting me come and talk to you about some of the problems that we face here in America. I appreciate the Timpkin family for their leadership, their concern about their fellow associations. They're working hard to make sure the future of this company is bright, and therefore the future of employment is bright for the families that work here, that work to put food on the table for their children.
[...]
We will work for a vigorous and healthy and growing economy so that every American who wants to work can find a job.
[...]
But the greatest strength of the American economy is found right here, right in this room. It's found in the pride and skill of the American work force.

Last year, productivity growth in America was 4.8 percent. That is the best annual increase since 1980. Here at Timpkin (ph), last year productivity rose 10 percent. Which means that America can compete with any nation in the world, because we've got the finest workers in the world.

The high productivity that comes from steady innovation and skilled workers gives our economy a tremendous edge. In the mid- 1980s, it took Timpkin an average of 14 worker hours to produce a ton of alloy steel. Today, it takes less than four hours.

Over the long run, this kind of productivity makes American products more competitive, and it raises the standard of living for the American people.

The true strength of the country is the fact that we're a productive nation. And as a result of the strengths, we're growing. But this economy has got unmet potential. We know this economy can grow faster. And as it grows faster, it will create more jobs.

And we also know that the right policies coming out of Washington can unleash the great strengths of the economy and create the right conditions for growth and prosperity.
[...]
The role of government is to create an environment in which capital move freely, in which the entrepreneurial spirit is strong, create the conditions so that people will feel comfortable about investing, and therefore create the conditions for job growth.
[...]”

“You guys know way too much about this Springer dude. Why is that?”

“May 14, 2004

Timken To Close Canton Bearing Manufacturing Plants

CANTON, Ohio -- The Timken Co. announced Friday that it will close its Canton bearing manufacturing operations, affecting 1,300 jobs.
[...]
Timken employs 4,800 in Stark County and approximately 26,000 worldwide. The Canton-based steel operations are unaffected by the decision.

"We have been meeting with the union for more than eight months to discuss how to make our bearing operations competitive in our changing global marketplace," said James W. Griffith, president and CEO. "We are disappointed that our talks with the union did not lead to the changes necessary to make these facilities viable. Therefore, we will begin moving the products to plants where they can be manufactured competitively."

The company will now meet with the union about this decision.
[...]

www.newsnet5.com”

“It's pretty damned pathetic, isn't it?”

“Violin, why'd post that last one? That is a prime example of how unions often shoot themselves in the foot. I'm surprised.”

“Who do you blame the Timken move on Republicans or Unions? Or maybe even Timken management? Or TT.”

“That's easy. It's Tony Randall's fault!”

“I don't know the details of the negotiations, however, I will say that the climate that the Republicans have forced on this country, combined with Timkin's greed, greatly contributed to the move. As long as you got your dividend, I guess it's OK that all those people lost thier jobs. Very nice!”

“"...and therefore create the conditions for job growth."

... in China and the Third World.”

“Can't conservatives read? No wonder they complain about public schools all the time.

The first is a speech Bush gave at the Timpkin Co. in Canton last year pushing his tax cut and saying how it will strengthen small businesses like Timkin.

The second is a story about how Timpkin is closing less than a year after receiving their tax cut.”

“Bush in '03: "Here at Timpkin, last year productivity rose 10 percent."

Timpkin in '04: We have to slash 1,300 jobs because the workers who put food on their families tables won't take pay cuts.”

“Please note Timin's profits, and share earnings.... taken from Timkin's website.”

“Timpkin.... gotta love Oxycontin :)”

“A visit by Bush really is the kiss of death to factories and programs. If you hear that he's coming to your area, better fire up the network and send out the updated resumes.”

“Maybe Timpkin took their tax windfall and invested it in new plant and equipment in a cheap labor country.

If we should give tax breaks to executives so they can create jobs, should we tax those who eliminate them more?”

“So the poor, poor union has nothing to do with it? It's all Bush's fault? Come on! Really now! 8)”

“The union only wanted to share in the profits. I guess they should just be content with whatever they have, and let the fruits of thier labor go to the CEO.”

“They could always start a co-op and assume all of the risk themselves.”

“I'm sure Timpkin will try that..... in Mexico. You co-operate, or you'll lose your $1.00 per hour job!”

“I have yet to see a union that was fair or equitable to a manufacturer.”

“This is one of the few good CEO's

I'll bet productivity increases, and the company attracts better quality workers.”

“That's probably because
a) You haven't had any experiences with unions.
b) You have no idea what you are talking about.”

“"You guys know way too much about this Springer dude. Why is that?......"


Ah.....I like to keep informed!?!

Geez...”

“I've seen both sides of it and I tend to generally think neither side treats the other fairly. There are always exceptions though.

If workers feel they need to unionize in order to get a fair shake and employers need to hire lawyers and negotiators to get a fair shake then there is a fundamental problem in the employer employee relationship. If both sides go into it knowing they are going to get screwed then they will never treat each other equitably.”

“"That's probably because
a) You haven't had any experiences with unions.
b) You have no idea what you are talking about."


Thanks for the insult. Forgive me if I don't take offense though. 8)

Believe it or not I have had some experience with unions. I have a lot of friends who have been or are in unions. Here’s a little taste…

*My one friend worked for GM at the Delphi plant in Dayton. The last time they threatened to go out on strike was due to the fact the union wasn’t getting what they wanted. What did they want? They wanted their members to be able to not show up for work for up to three days with no repercussions. They could just not go in, not even call in and show up three days later and the company wasn’t even allowed to ask about their absence. And this plant is the absolute worsted plant for attendance in the entire GM corp. Every single day 20% of the work force doesn’t show up for work. 20%! Their signing bonus was always a big sticking point too. They got from $2,000-$5,000 for doing nothing. Just because the contract got signed.

*The father of the above friend had worked at GM for some 20 years. He was a machine oiler. He got paid $20 an hour. What did his day entail? He would show up at work, go to an office, sleep a couple hours and then get up grab some coffee and then mingle amongst the works chatting. This is HIS description of his job, not second hand.

*Another one of my friends works for Copeland Corp. in Sidney Ohio. He has been there for 5 years now and makes a poultry $9 an hour. The union gets $30 of his pay check every month. $360 a year might not sound like a lot for a high paid union rep such as yourself but when you only get $9 an hour it makes a difference. He has been nothing but screwed by his union. He has never had them stand behind him on anything. They do nothing but rake in the cash to pay the reps.

*Another friend of mine used to work at a manufacturing plant that made freezers. Their union held out on some minor issues and to flex their muscle they went on strike. They spent two years standing around the entrance to the plant while they watched people who were actually willing to work took their jobs. The union never did get back into the plant.

*My own brother is a union that represent the city workers. It too is a joke. They are different. They actually do something. They do whatever the city wants them to do. All the dues coming in and no representation.

Here’s the list of good unions I’ve been told about:

___________________

Unions are nothing more than a blackmail organization that has because as big a machine as the corporations they hate. It’s about money and power. As long as the unions keep falsely showing they are needed they keep raking in the cash and as long as they can use their numbers they remain politically powerful. Look at the rise in food costs. Do you think that when the checkout clerks and bag boys down at Krogers unionized the costs weren’t passed along to us? For what? So unskilled labor can get $9 for bagging groceries?

Yes, back when there were no labor laws the union did a lot of good but they have become obsolete. They are redundant.”

“So in your case, it would be a & b. Your sources are all secondary, even tertiary, meaning you have no viable experiences with unions, just people's hearsay based on exxageration and facts. You obviously have no comprehesion of the history of unions, how they work, or the laws and the history of the laws that govern unions and the labor market.

And, your welcome for the insult.”

“"So in your case, it would be a & b. Your sources are all secondary, even tertiary, meaning you have no viable experiences with unions, just people's hearsay based on exxageration and facts."

So in your view actual union members are not a reliable source for how unions work? This proves another point, union reps normally have no idea when it comes to the actual workers. Reps work for the union, not the workers. Unions are like environmental groups. If all there issues were corrected they’d be out on the street. They MUST continue to find new causes and issues or they destroy themselves. Concurrently unions too must try and stay “relevant” in order to survive.

No I don’t have any professional schooling in the area like you, only my personal experiences. If unions were so great why haven’t anyone I know in unions told me about it? Even the guys in the GM union who make tons of money and have it so dang easy it’s not funny say the unions are bull chit.

BTW- ya forgot to insult me in your last post. Please give me a double shot in the next one so I may stay current. 8)”

“You dirtbaggin' phallic beast (I think that made up for lack of insult in second post),

Nigal, many of the politics that you speak of come from the local leadership that run most of the day to day operations of the union. The way unions function are like this:

Local members elect president, VP, etc. These people run the day to day operations and interaction with management. Furthermore, these are the folks that initially represent you during the first few phases of grievances. In addition, these are the people who essentially negotiate the contracts.

The Union (as in business), provides services to the members. For example, the union rep., will work with the negotiating team to decipher what the members want in thier contract, and write the legal contract language for the contract. The Union Rep. also is the cheif spokesman during negotiations, but really has no vote as to what is being negotiated. The rep can give advice, and offer strategy, but does not make the decisions as to what goes into the contract.

The Union rep also represents grievants at the arbitration level, coordinates strikes, acts as the PR person for the local, and mediates internal disputes, among other things.

When negotiations are over, the local's negotiating team takes the proposed contract back to the local members, who VOTE on weather or not to accept the contract. Essentially, the power is in the people.

The locals dues go toward running the organization, and yes, pays my salary. However, it is worth the price. If unions had to hire attorneys for every local, there is no way they could afford them. Instead, they get a pseudo lawyer that wears a variety of hats, making the members get more bang for thier buck.

As for your circumstances:

1. GM and the UAW have a very strong union. Very rarely will you find a contract that is fair to both employee and employer. In the case you speak of, I can't verify the numbers you give because the come from a tertiary source. In unions, tertairy sources are as reliable as a plastic grocery bag is for holding water.... not very reliable. Rumors among a large working body become highly exxagerated, and can't be trusted. But lets assume that there is some truth to the attendance rate being at, say 10%. That is still very high, but maybe the company exxagerated the numbers, or maybe they were holding out on that issue because they wanted something important from the employer in return. That is how negotiations work.... give & take.

2. $20 per hour for someone working at a plant for 20 years sounds like a decent wage. However, people like your buddies dad are what hurt unions, just like managers that f with employee hurt employers. Unfortunately, it's the LAW that protects non working folks like that, and Unions are only the vehicle by which they are protected. If your buddies dad got fired for his lack of work, I would be legally obligated to defend him to the best of my ability, not because I wanted to.

3. Your buddy at Copeland seems to be getting a raw deal, but like I explained above, that is not nessisarily the result of the paid union rep. I have negotiated many contracts where the local's leadership try padding thier pockets at the expense of the majority of the workers. I always object, but I have no vote as to what the local asks for. Many times, management is more than happy to appease the folks on the team because it settles the matter quicker, and it also divides the union. If I were your buddy, I'd try finding honest and fair leaders in the local, and elect them president. Furthermore, if your buddy in Copeland feels like management is violating the contract by bringing him some harm, he can file a grievance. Once he files, he alone can decide wheater to pursue the grievance until arbitration, not management or the union leadership.

4. The freezer company buddy. You can thank Ronald Reagan for your buddy's dilemma. Prior to the infamous "Air Traffic Controller Strike" in the 80's, the Taft-Harley Act allowed for people to go on strike without being permenantly replaced. Once Reagan broke this law by sending scab to permenantly replace striking workers, strikes have become much less effective. They may have had a good reason to go out on strike, but because management could take advantage by bringing in permemnat scabs, you buddy loses.

5. Your brother is part of AFSCME, of which my Union is a part of as well. Because he is a public employee, the Reagan taft Hartly thing doesn't apply. His union can go on strike without the threat of being permenantly replaced. Your union is what you make of it. if they elect good leaders, who want to do what is best for everybody, they will get a good contract, I guarantee it, and have witnessed it.

I often hear from the people I represent...."the union doesn't do shiznit for me". Once I explain what I've explained above, they understand better. Unions are what the local makes of them. If you have strong leadership, the union will be strong. If you have a corporate union that will sink money and training into the locals, you'll have an even better union.

As for your summation, I disagree Nigal. I see the way the union I work for operates, and know how the union of some of our freinds in Michigan operates. The place I work for does the right thing, which is why we were the fastes growing union in the country for the past few years. Unions, overall, are undergoing a change. They are shedding the old "Jackie Presser" image, and handling things much more professionally than in the past. This is benefiting both the members, employers and overall country.”

“BTW - I'm telling you unions are great, depending on thier local leadership. I also must say that personally, I work for the members. I could take a higher paying job, but do this because I believe in it, and I find that attitude with many of my co-workers. My job will be there as long as people need representation, and they do. I'll always have a contract to negotiate, and there is always some dolt manager making somebody's life hell, and that is why union folks need the service they pay for.”

“Go to google, type in "compassionate conservatism" and hit 'I'm Feeling Lucky'.”

“I was a union member.

The dues killed me.”

“Why doesn't that surprise me, V?”

“you must be on crack”

“* Company Chairman W.R. Timkin raised over $600,000 for Bush's campaign, making him a "Ranger" among the president's fundraisers.

* Last year, Mr. Timkin made 2.62 million, placing him in the top 1% of wealthiest Americans.

* With GWB's tax cut, he'll save $662,000 over ten years.


Timkin is laying off 1,300 employees. Let's assume the average employee makes $15.00 p/h, and works 40 hr. weeks for 52 weeks, or 2080 hours. That puts the payroll at $40,560,000. A 3% increase in wages is $1,216,800.

Remember, the company made $36.5 million last year.

Here is a quote. from Timkin's website, as to why the plant is closing....
"We have been meeting with the union for more than eight months to discuss how to make our bearing operations competitive in our changing global marketplace," said James W. Griffith, president and CEO. "We are disappointed that our talks with the union did not lead to the changes necessary to make these facilities viable. Therefore, we will begin moving the products to plants where they can be manufactured competitively."

In other words, somebody making $2 per hour in a foriegn land will get the job due to Bush's lack of enforcing labor standards in NAFTA.

So, to sum up.

1. Bush doesn't enforce Labor Standards in NAFTA, allowing good paying jobs to leave the US so big business can make even more money.

2. The Owner of Timkin raises a bunch of jack for Bush's campaign.

3. The company, shareholders and owner made money last year.

4. A 3% wage increase (cost of living) would have cost the company $1.2 million for 1,300 employees.

Result: Tricle Down Economics - 1,300 middle class workers are out of a job, CEO and company makes more money, Republicans get more money raised for thier campaigns, some 12 year old gets a nice job in Sri Lanka for .50 cents and hour, Tinkin does well in the market due to wage savings, Bush gets to say economy is recovering.

This model exemplifies how trickle down economics works, and who benefits from it.”

“Kerry Calls on Bush to Urge Federal Mediation to Prevent Shutdown of Timken Plant in Ohio

1,300 Ohio jobs on the line



Washington, DC – Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry today called on the Bush administration to urge leaders of the Timken Company and the United Steelworkers of America (USWA) to accept a federal mediator to help bring about a contract settlement and prevent 1,300 jobs from being lost if the company follows through on its plan to shut down its Canton, Ohio plant.



“In Ohio, where 170,000 manufacturing jobs have already been lost,” Kerry said, “urging the parties to accept a federal mediator to help reach a contract settlement is the very least that should be done to save 1,300 jobs and prevent the economic and personal devastation that their loss will have on thousands of families in that community.”



Kerry said he is aware that the Steelworkers union has made a proposal to the company that calls on Timken to make commitments to invest in the Canton facility in return for productivity improvements that could result from changes to work rules, which he said can at least serve as a framework for continuing negotiations.



“The administration should exhaust every potential solution to prevent these jobs from being lost,” Kerry said. “Federal mediation was created to help resolve situations exactly like the impending crisis in Canton.”



The President does not have the authority under law to order federal mediation except in the case of a national emergency, but nothing prevents him from encouraging the parties in a negotiation to accept involvement by the Federal Mediation and Conciliation Service.

---email from Kerry Campaign”

“Timkin Co. made the Countdown with Keith Oberman last night.”

“The local paper had an article about city tax revenues being up 6% over the first quarter last year.

Damn Tax cuts!”

“trickle down economics;

you can't make somebody run a business. timken got rich by being smart. he is in business to make moo, not to employ your neighbors. it is idiotic for you to twist this into bush;s fault. my pseudotrophius moorei has more economic scense than you....”

“I'd be willing to bet it spells better than you do.”

“Aquarium fish suck.”

“We need Michael Moore to make a movie about this. Don't they make like ball bearings or something? He could call it, "Jobs on the Line and Balls on my Chin".”

“As long as Wal-mart continues to buy the foreign made Heinz products it is all good.”

“So Long, And Thanks For All The Fish”

“Fish monger!”

“wanna buy a synodontus angelica?”