Why We're in Iraq

“I'm not actually intending this to be a debate about whether we should be there or not, though I'm sure it'll turn into that. The following is an email from a client of mine. His son is over there and sent this home to his dad. It is a first hand account and I've hiked with the guy.

This report is about guard duty with an Iraqi soldier:

I have read many stories as this one attesting to some of this reality, not the negative news that the western press seemingly force feeds us, that for some reason, will not give front page, above the fold (or below) headline credence to any truthful positive stories on the military "boots on the ground" people sharing how greatly successful this war has been so far for the Iraqi people and their families, and out they feel.



Hey dad,
Great. I can't wait to see the pics.
Guard duty with the Iraqi soldier was amazing.
He spoke very good english.
Learned most of it from the 101st last year.
His name is Akemm and he is 25 years old.
He is married and has a 3yr old boy and a 2yr old girl here in town.
His father is a capt. in the police force and his older brother is in the police force too.
He told me he has killed 5 insurgents.
He said that Sadamm was a very evil man.
Witnessed him of killing 500 kurds here in town.
George Bush is good.
I showed him pics of my family.
I brought a small picture album in my bag.
He looked amazed at the pics of XXXXX and XXXXX (I took the namesout).
He also saw pics of you and XXXX (at the wedding).
He also asked me about America.
I told him he needed come.
He said that would be great, but he needed to stay and make Iraq as good as America.
I told him stories about the American Rev. and how our Founding Fathers worked hard and died for our country.
He understood.
I explained to him something like that could not happen overnight.
He told me he wishes his children could live in peace and happiness like my children.
Then it hit me, now I knew why I was here.
Concrete proof was there before me.
Later the night I gave him a micro, red-lens flashlight that I kept on my body armor.
He thanked me, shook my hand, and gave me a hug.
Boy, he needed a bath.
It's not bad being here when you know the purpose.
Some guys in my unit still don't get it.
Hope they see it before they leave.
Semper Fi.”

“That's nice, I'm sure the 2,500 amputees at Walter Reed Army Hospital in Washington would give him a big hand......if they have two.”

“Wow, slammed in under 8 minutes. I'm surprised it took that long.”

“I couldn't help myself...>8^]


I think that is a shocking statistic.....my three sons could end up that way.”

“Well, you know, Monday mornings are a little slow, DH! :)”

“You're right- that is a good reason to be there, dayhiker. Too bad it's not the one we were told back in 2002. Still, a noble cause.”

“I'm not disagreeing with aero or MarkO, I just thought the cynics would at least like the hear another opinion.”

“Like that 'other opinion' doesn't get Plenty of airplay... It's the only one they have left because all the others collapsed like a house of cards.


Maybe people wouldn't be so cynical if they weren't lied to quite as much.”

“I'd be less cynical if people who weren't lied to would stop claiming that they were.”

“If I heard "weapons of mass destruction" come out of W's mouth once during 2002, I've heard it a thousand times.”

“Its a good one though, I like it. We are there in support of Freedom Fighters! Patriots like the Founding Fathers of the Good 'ole USA, like the French resistance Fighters of WWII, Like the Viet Cong, Mujahdeen, Eritrean Liberation Army, Khmer Rouge......PLO.........IRA.............Basque Separatists..........”

“You know what I also heard alot "Our intelligence suggests that..." Just because 3 or 4 analysts didn't agree with the analysis of hundreds of others doesn't make those who made the original analysis liars. Of course I could vote for someone who's afraid to make decisions based on less than perfect intelligence when that's all we've got, and I could wind up dead in a terrorist attack.”

“Hook Bush's ass to a polygraph and see what happens!! LOLOLOL

It'd be simpler to enumerate the few occasions when these people WEREN'T lying.


P.S. Dayhiker's new screenname: 'Flamebait' LOL”

“thats a nice letter. i'm sure that even the most cynical liberal would agree that there are some people who are being helped by our presence in iraq.

as it's been said 10000 times around here, that's NOT the reason we're there.
for every akemm (the guy in the letter), there's a pissed off iraqi who's kid was blown up in a mosque by an errant U.S. bomb, or a syrian sitting at home watching our soldiers force a nekkid piggy-pile with iraqi prisoners on his t.v.

besides, there's at least a dozen countries right now, where we could invade, take over, and really help the people.
but i guess those folks don't matter so much.”

“Ah Yes... the old 'invade Iraq to prevent terrorist attack' line of #&%!$.

Old Hat and demonstrably bankrupt. Completely devoid of reason and unsullied by the merest hint of reality.”

“I'm not sure if it should be that or nighthiker. The last few hikes I've planned with local folks have wound up with us running out of daylight.

I am good at posting a volitale topic and stepping back.

I got to hear Tilt's favorite analyst last week at a conference. It was Tucker Carlson of Crossfire. He was pretty entertaining. My favorite part was where he talked about how Kerry is going out of his way to look tough since Democrats typically lose when the main issue if foreign policy. While interviewing Kerry after a hockey match, Kerry proceeds to strip. Granted, that's what you do after an athletic event and before you shower, but Kerry just kept walking around doing the whole interview in the buff. Carlson said that he'd never looked so deeply into another mans eyes. It wasn't just that but also the fact he was the only one playing without a helment and was so gung-ho.”

“Ah Yes... the old 'invade Iraq to prevent terrorist attack' line of #&%!$.

Old Hat and demonstrably bankrupt. Completely devoid of reason and unsullied by the merest hint of reality."

Too funny. Tilt not understanding geostrategy != demonstrably bankrupt geostrategy.”

“I wish Carlson would quit giving bow ties a bad name, LOL --- Orville Reddenbacher is spinning in his grave.


I don't know about that generalization. Remember... "Where's The Beef?" and "The Wimp Factor"?”

“Thank you for sharing. I wish there was more stories like that comning from thje front, rather than the news of Iraqi Leaders getting smoked, and others loosing there lives.

I grow very tired of this negitive atmosphere that has been created about this war. Everyday, it's something else/new. I would hedge a bet that sez IF we had proper troop strength in there, less of these things would be happening. Arabs in that region mostly know one thing: Strength. If we had went in there "proper", more control could be had just by shear presence alone. Then, the other countries would be shaking, let alonoe the "evil doers".

Look, if we're gonna be the "bad guy", you might as well have pound the phuck outta them, not go in half assed. What's happening now will create situations years from now that we, and our children will have to deal with. My thanks go to GW Bush, for it will be MY sons who will have to pay that price.

I swear, as everyone here as my wittness, if down the road I loose a son to something that was created out of this, it will NOT be pretty for that man. I don't care how phucking old he is, I don't care where the phuck he is.”

“I've been leaning towards the arguments for increased troop strength as put forth by Shinseki, McCain and others, but I heard something this morning that gave me pause.

A 60s era veteran called in to C-SPAN to remind everyone that lots of people thought more troops would help the situation in Southeast Asia, too.”

“I would hedge a bet that sez IF we had proper troop strength in there, less of these things would be happening. Arabs in that region mostly know one thing: Strength. If we had went in there "proper", more control could be had just by shear presence alone. Then, the other countries would be shaking, let alonoe the "evil doers".

So you do agree with the geopolitical leverage invading Iraq has given us. I would say you're mixing up an offensive force with a peace-keeping force. We have (by far) the most powerful offensive force in the region now. But you're right - we should have more troops on the ground to win the peace.”

“lots of people thought more troops would help the situation in Southeast Asia, too."

Of course this is a ridiculous inapt analogy. That tilt brings it up is no surprise, though.”

“More troops now! Draft now!


They start at 18 & stop at age 35, right?”

“Hmmm.

Could be the military analog to "Brook's Law".”

“Mutt, just to play along with your long running argument, can you list the ways in which this has made our lives as American citizens safer, better or whatever you think this has done for us as a people, collectively? By 'this', I mean the strategy of being the strongest force in the region there. Why is the position we are in something that is to be SO desired? What advantages can we, as Americans, benefit from in the near future that would surpass the negatives that have come about as a result of the WOI?”

“Soon we will control the Holy Land as Ordained by God!”

“More troops now! Draft now!


They start at 18 & stop at age 35, right?"
bearmagnet



I AGREE !!!!

except instead of drafting by age, we should draft by opinion polls.


all you chickenhawk bush fans need to get in line. it's real easy to talk about what WE need to do, and it's worth the risk to US, and so far the price paid is not too much, well if you think WE should be over there, get off your asses and join the fight, you friggin chickhawks.

and if you believe we have "just the right amount of troops over there right now" ,

then i'm sure that more than a couple soldiers over there deserve to be relieved so they can come home now to their loved ones.

if you're not raising your hand to go over there, then i think you should shut the hell up.”

“That was cool. Thanks for posting it Dayhiker.”

“It seems to me that the same folks who are jumping up and down saying "LIAR" are the same ones who disagree with Bush's views on religion. Is this a coincidence?”

“I should rephrase that. It seems like the same folks are the ones who disagree with most organized religion.”

“Bunch of Heathens!”

“Why is the position we are in something that is to be SO desired? What advantages can we, as Americans, benefit from in the near future that would surpass the negatives that have come about as a result of the WOI?

Like I've said all along: we lacked meaningful leverage in the region before the WOI. Since then, neighboring terrorist-harboring nations have started to cooperate with the U.S. This can be seen through increasingly accurate intelligence and security alerts. These have helped to save lives already. As far as long-term benefits, perhaps the most important is to ward off Chinese influence in the region. Watch for direct military action in Africa in the next decade as the next highly visible step toward that strategic goal.”

“Has the fact that terrorist harboring nations are SUPPOSEDLY cooperating (remember, I'm a skeptic), do you feel that we are safer from terrorism today as opposed to the last few years, given the climate of hate that has risen to levels unsurpassed previously?”

“"So you do agree with the geopolitical leverage invading Iraq has given us. I would say you're mixing up an offensive force with a peace-keeping force. We have (by far) the most powerful offensive force in the region now......."


I'm not agreeing with the "geopolitical leverage invading Iraq has given us....." line. What I do agree with is a proper amount of troops, proper amount of supplies, proper amount of money to "win the hearts and minds (read bribe)", proper support, proper plan and proper amount of tools, to list just a few. I would have to argue respcetfully that we do not have the most powerful force, although an argument could be made for the "offensive" part. We truly are offending over there. We would not have a proper amount of boots in place should antyhing happen. That, compiled with the fact that the troop rotations are FUBAR, we'd be caught with our pants down if the Arabs ever got on the same page. The only way that wat we are doing is somewhat working (and that's a real streach), is that the Arabs are not on the same page. Yes, I do remember the 6 day war, but my arguement would be that if the "rabs" ever went full force, we'd be pushed into the Gulf, unless of course we'd Nuke, but let's cross that bridge if/when we ever get to it.


A peace keeping force right now would get ripped to shreds. Our boots on the ground, as far as numbers go, resemble a pease keeping force; maybe it's Bush that's got that one mixed up. Gulf War One, we had close to one million troops ready to kick out the Iraqis out of a country that's one eighth of Iraq. Now, we go in with 250,000 to rid and occupy? This does not make any sence.

The Pentagon has phucked this thing up. I don't care to believe the propaganda of "this will be good for us in the region" line, sorry. Myabe it's just my ignorance and you have better info than I; however, being the face value knd of guy I am, this chit stinks and reeks of bullchit revenge.

Terror attacks are only down a few worldwide. Is the US counting the "terrorist" attacks that have been happening in Iraq since we've been there in this count? The attacks being down does not signal a positive situation to me; it sez that they are preping for a "big one" and want to focus those resourses for that.”

“I can't even imagine the feeling if one of mine were to lose a limb or become paralyzed.

Those periods of torment when the son lambasts the parents for even having conceived him are typical with such injuries.

Nick Berg's old man is in a place I don't want to be.

I don't believe the level of geopolitical leverage will ever overcome the level of anger generated by this unnecessary war and its rising casualties which in turn raise the anger and beget more casualties.”

“I like Blue Bunny ice cream.”

“The "climate of hate" concept is constantly being mishandled in this debate. It's not like there's now suddenly a huge monolith of Arab Hate toward the West that wasn't there previously. That hatred has been there - running feverishly high - for many years now. Remember, Arab governments have used hatred toward the U.S. for supporting Israel as a brainwashing technique for decades.

What is important is to observe not whether hatred as intensified (it hardly seems likely), but rather whether it has coalesced into a meaninful military threat (including terrorist threat). So far, there is little evidence that terrorist networks (that prove to be a strategic threat to America) have gained much from the WOI. Yes, there are jihadists and terrorists of opportunity, but they hardly represent a threat to our security.

We are making progress, but whether that progress has yet translated into a safer world - I don't think anyone knows. But to suggest that the WOI has proven counterproductive to the WOT is not an accurate reflection of the reality on the ground.”

“You say we are making progress. In what ways?”

“Shouldn't we be dealing with the hate?”

“if the "rabs" ever went full force, we'd be pushed into the Gulf

Uh, no. We could decimate Iran in an offensive war if we wanted. What other power is in the region? Furthermore, fighting a defensive war would be less costly (in terms of casualties) than an offensive war.

I don't care to believe the propaganda of "this will be good for us in the region" line, sorry

Okay, now you've contradicted yourself. How do you reconcile that statement with: If we had went in there "proper", more control could be had just by shear presence alone. Then, the other countries would be shaking, let alonoe the "evil doers".

Of course, that's exactly what we did, and cooperation - that wasn't there before - has been the result, unless you choose to ignore that in an intellectually dishonest manner.”

“In the interest of balance:

I killed innocent people for our government. For what? What did I do? Where is the good coming out of it? I feel like I've had a hand in some sort of evil lie at the hands of our government.”

“You say we are making progress. In what ways?

In my opinion, the best thing we've done is to increase our military contacts with other nations. For example, we've been "using" indigenous African forces to go after terrorist targets through arrangements like this. And this kind of linking-up has been happening around the globe. But, since that doesn't have anything to do with WMD, Iraq, or Bush lies, the people who get their news from TV and the newspapers don't hear about it.”

“"I don't believe the level of geopolitical leverage will ever overcome the level of anger generated by this unnecessary war and its rising casualties which in turn raise the anger and beget more casualties........."


It took us, what....almost 25 years to "heal" over 'Nam; some would argue that we still are not over that one. We should not worry so much about our geopolitical situation. What needs to happen is that we need to "win the hearts and minds" of the AMERICAN people. Who gives a chit about our geopolitical anything, if our own people don't want it.

The people are against this; the people who started this and supported this are growing few nowadays. Blame the liberial media, blame the Dems, blame everyone else; whatever you do - don't take responsiblity.

THAT'S the AMERICAN way!”

“We're there because Iraq sucks and we're going to make it unsucked.

The president told me in a dream last night. His eyeballs were shooting lazers and he had green light snining out of his mouth.

I should stop eating mushrooms before bedtime.”

“"Watch for direct military action in Africa in the next decade as the next highly visible step toward that strategic goal."
Mutt
10:22:31 AM

Atrocities in a war in Africa would be spectacular.

To put our sons and daughters into a situation THERE would be real foolish.

Mutt, what was that "strategic goal" again?”

“I love trolling in plain sight. I'm just a Violin wannabee!”

“Well, this is what I have been ultimately trying to extract out of Mutt. Why this concept of his is so damned important to our lives. Is this reducing our vulnerability to terrorism? I don't see it. Sorry. Being in Ameerica's #1 target city, this concerns me greatly. As far as where the average person gets their news from, people are limited as to what's presented. You have to read and view different sources and sort out what you hear as either opinion or fact, while keeping things in context. There is no single source that will give you un biased views. Doing it this way does not make you unintelligent and misinformed, Mutt. Unless the information being given is strictly propaganda. But, as for my original post that questions what is being done for our lives as Americans here in the U.S., I don't think you have totally addressed that beyond the Chinese influence theory and your predictions for the U.S. to start marching through Africa in what seems like some world domination quest...”

“"To put our sons and daughters into a situation THERE would be real foolish......"

Gawd help them if ever the Tuties ever got ahold of them, let alone the Somalies.......!”

“Mutt, what was that "strategic goal" again?

Action on the WOT with the dual purpose of securing strategic oil reserves.”

“Actually we’re in Iraq because something like 40% of the American public is suffering from a dangerous mass psychosis. They sincerely believe that they a duty to bring about Armageddon in the Middle East so that the messiah can return in Rambo form and mop up the remnants of the human race under a sky filled with naked, floating Christians. If it takes perpetual war, so be it, Sermon on the Mount be damned.”