Mt Rainier

“Considering a return to Rainier next spring/summer. Went last year with RMI on expedition course up to Wilson Glacier/Fuhrer's Finger.Considering going with Cascades Alpine Guides via Emmons. Anybody used these two (or other services)? We don't have alot of glaciers back here in Virginia. Its important to feel comfortable with your hiking partners, especially on a mountain like Rainier. What have other people done out in trail talk land?”

“I hike trails on Mt. Rainier, but not the mountain top itself, but I can tell you most climbers seem to die going up disppointment cleaver.”

“RMI takes 3400 climbers a year on Rainier summit attempts. Most use the Disappointment Cleaver route, hence, I bet, the majority of accidents. I'm not sure which route has most fatalities, I think you need to adjust it to fatalities per climber on that particular route. If memory serves right there were 2 fatalities (one accident) in June on the Willis Wall, 2 fatalities in two accidents on Liberty Ridge, one from a heart attack near Camp Muir, and just this week two guys were climbing a ramp out of a crevasse on the Ingraham? glacier were caught in a slide. Both were buried, one died.”

“Wilson Glacier/Fuhrer Finger, as well as the traditional Disappointment Cleaver routes are graded 1/2. The Emmons and Winthrop Glacier route is also rated a 1/2. Haven't heard of any complaints about guide services except the traditional complaints about RMI. I used RMI last year and had a good experience. If goiing back, however, I think I'd try someone else.

Stay off Liberty Ridge!!! You can't see the bad weather approaching from that side of the mountain.”

“I've been to Rainier a few times over the past 15 years. Signed up for the RMI 5-day expedition course on a trip about 10 years ago and it seemed OK. We went up to Camp Muir and Dissapointment cleaver to the summit on one of the days. Only issue I've ever heard is the two day climb they do is a really rushed, strenuous experience. The newly added guide services were just recently added to the mountain - can't tell you any more than that. Have also done the Emmons Glacier route with friends as a three day trip.

My advice: Unless you're a REALLY strong snow and ice climber with REALLY good partners, stay on the Camp Muir or Emmons glacier routes. My first Rainier trip 15 yrs ago was a recon trip on the Wonderland trail and we were awestruck at the difficulty of the north-side routes; Liberty Ridge and the Willis Wall are very vertical routes that require expert level skill on mixed alpine terrain . Both have occasional ice avalanches, rockfall, and very little sunshine (they're cold!).”

“ppcraft, you are right about casualties vs. % of climbers that use that disappointment cleaver route. I'm making that statement about accidents happening there from my total of 7 years living in WA, not just this one year. I can't recall if they were all climbers with or without guides or a combination of the two.”

“It seems like the fatalities this year have been in 2 person unguided but experienced climbers.”

“If I recall correctly, about 1/3 of those climbing the mountain use guides. However, lots of those unguided have extensive experience on the western glaciated mountains. Without that experience I wouldn't go without a guide. Added bonus, the guides have to carry all the emergency equipment :-) Also remember, most accidents happen coming down, when you're tired and the snow is softer.

There was an accident, not a fatality, the week before I went. It was at the Ingraham headwall, a group led by RMI. Some ice fell and hit one of their clients. He had to be carried off the mountain. The next week when I was there RMI was putting in the Dissapointment Cleaver route to go around the icefall area. I think I was in the last group that went that way last summer. We crossed some BIG crevasses.”

“I would really like to climb Rainier. I think I will climb my first big mountain this year. I think it will be Borah Peak.”

“Never been, hear its rather steep.Check out the Highpointers website. It's in my future.”

“I have a buddy from hs that lives in Portland. One day I'm going out to visit him and he's taking me up Hood. We'll spend a day or so before hand teaching me how to fall and use ropes. He's very experienced. One day needs to get here.
last edited: 11/18/04 8:47:41 AM”

“EarthNshy, Borah would be a great tune up for Rainier. Borah is about 12,200, so it stresses out your lung power as well as your muscles. If you could come out west and do Borah, and wait a week and then do Rainier, you would have a big step up on acclimitizing to the higher elevation. I did Shasta (14,100) two weeks after Borah, and felt pretty good.”

“Eathnsky & Idaho Bob.

Maybe we could set something up?”

“I have a Borah trip in the works”

“I'm free July and August if you can handle another trail whore.”

“ENS,

I'd love to hear about your trip.”

“http://www.kirotv.com/news/4694998/detail.html

RMI to blame”

“http://www.thebackpacker.com/pictures/pic/ymdavvek.php

Ingraham Glacier”

“I just heard about that. At least they did find them all. Hope everyone will be okay.

On another note: wow, awesome pictures!”

“Wow, they are lucky to be alive!!

That is a good use of military assets......saving lives!!”

“I wanna hike around that sucker again.

No summitting for me!

Gemini, how's about a 12 day hike around that sucker?

Group of six......rent a van........take a zillion pictures........August, ha ha!!”

“usa, where in the article is there any evidence that rmi is to blame? im not saying theyre not, but you shouldnt go making such libelous statements without any sort of proof. mountaineering is an extremely dangerous sport. fatalities and serious injuries happen to the best climbers, and rainier is known to be no cake-walk”

“MarkO, sounds great to me. what this august? yeah right!! LOL Wish I could!”

“According to article in Seattle Times today the 2nd climber, Peter Bridgewater (behind the guide) fell and was arrested. Bridgewater then fell againand the guide, John Lucia, was unable to arrest the fall. The rope team of 4 fell down the slope with the front 2 (Bridgewater and Lucia) going over the crevasse and the back 2 climbers (Patrick Clemmons and Matthew Fisher) going into the crevasse. Mountaineering is dangerous; crevasses,seracs, ice/rockfall, etc. There have already been 3 deaths this year.

BTW summitted Rainer via Emmons on June 2. Walked almost 12 hours camp to camp. Forgot about the summit register, though did spend an hour up top. May return next year, may go to Mt Baker.”

“That's tragic. Arresting a fall is not an easy task.

It doesn't sound like they are all real lucky - head trauma and back injuries.
last edited: 7/08/05 10:00:17 AM”

“I went to look at the article and saw another about vandalism on my own street. Broken windows on cars and houses. Boy I must've slept soundly!”

“MarkO...12 days? Pfffft!!!!!
Our group did it in 7 nights 8 days last summer ;-) Of course we all live like 1-2 hours away from Rainier....so we go there all the time..hehheh!!
PS: 3 weeks ago out of sheer boredom wedayhiked the loop from Mowhich Lake down Ispuit Pass, and back up via Seattle Park and Spray Park. 17 miles of sheer fun :-D”

“Wow, they are lucky to be alive!!

That is a good use of military assets......saving lives!!”
MarkO
8:45:22 AM
7/08/05

Wow, What a politically correct response.

Political correctness is a crime.”

“RMI is responsible for their trips up that mountain and making sound decisions. From what I heard conditions were perfect so that only leaves human error. I led 4 successful climbs on Rainier and never had anyone on my teams have problems. For that climber to fall two times shows a lack of judgement by the RMI team leader to allow that individual to make the attempt.The guide failed to arrest the fall which is another point of blame. RMI should pay for the taxpayer costs for the rescue.”

“The latest news story remarked that Peter Bridgewater,the client who fell once, was climbing to the guide when he fell a second time. I suspect the guide was going to evaluate him for AMS. I do not think its fair to compare your climbers to these. Every group is different. I also think its unfair to state it was a lack of judgement to let the climber attempt to summit. We do not know the physical state of the climber at Muir. Many climbers only begin to exhibit signs of AMS over 3000 m. Did our guides exhibit poor judgement in allowing a member, who was having no problems at Schurnman, to attempt the summit; only to be turned around at 12,700 because of early signs of HACE? This particular guide has 120 succesfull summits of Rainier alone.

I'm not defending RMI but from reading newspaper articles it sounds like this was an unfortunate accident. Should all climbers/hikers rescued from the slopes of Rainier (or Zion, Grand Teton, Yellowstone, Grand Canyon, etc, etc) be billed for all rescue costs reguardless of judgement, insight, luck??”

“http://www.kirotv.com/news/4707634/detail.html

This story link of what happened today on Sharkfin Tower in the North Cascades is more in line with "accident." I've been in this area also which is just below and west of Sahale Peak. When the rocks killed these climbers it was an accident. What happened on Rainier is human error which could have been prevented.”

“Whether people have experience or not, they can succumb to the elements or conditions on Mt. Rainier. I think it is guaranteed that about 5 people will die on that mountain from climbing every year.

I think it was two people that recently died in a snow storm and 60 degree winds and they had all the gear they needed.

Someone just fell 1,200 feet on Mt. Hood and died. I don't details.

Experience does not guarantee your safe return from climbing Mt. Rainier. Since it's always considered to have the same difficulties as Everest and used as a training ground for climbing Everest, it can never be underestimated.”

“I meant 60 m.p.h. winds. The two were not found near each other on Mt. Rainier. The snow was probably blinding and who can hear someone call to them in 60 m.p.h. winds?”

“Here is a pic of Rainier taken last week.

”