Scouts lost and later found in Sipsey

“Arky can attest to just how many trees are down in this area.

From the Tuscaloosa (AL) News

TUSCALOOSA | Chalk another crisis up to Hurricane Ivan. Storm-damaged trail markers left four Boy Scouts and their leader lost in the Sipsey Wilderness area of Bankhead Forest on Sunday, forcing them to camp there one more night and worry some parents silly.

But about 9 a.m. Monday they came walking out unharmed, just a little worse for wear.

“Sometime, things are going to happen to get you off course,” said Jerry Moore, scout executive for the Boy Scouts of America’s Black Warrior Council. “You just have to stay calm and stop and figure out what you need to do.”

Which is what Scoutmaster Mike Bailey, an Eagle Scout, did.

The Scouts, all from Tuscaloosa County, drove the 80 miles north to Bankhead Forest on Saturday morning. They planned to hike, camp out and drive home Sunday afternoon.

But they “got a little off track,” Moore said, when tree markers for their trail were knocked over by Hurricane Ivan. On the Sunday hike out, Bailey realized they were off the trail and that getting out before sundown was impossibility.

“We’re very fortunate that Mr. Bailey has had such extensive training,” Moore said. “He basically followed what the teaching teaches you to do, and it worked out great.”

Tommy Sexton, the assistant Scoutmaster for Troop 100, didn’t make the trip but said he’s been on numerous hikes through the Sipsey Wilderness area.

“You don’t move around out there in the dark,” he said.

The troop had cell phones, but Sexton said they are pointless in the wilderness because there is no cellular service, so no one could call home to give the parents an update.

Once the Scouts were well overdue, alarmed family members and Scout officials contacted the Bankhead Ranger District office and the Lawrence County Sheriff’s Department to report them missing.

Lawrence County Chief Deputy Wayne Huguley said there was some concern, but not enough to try and mount a nighttime search.

“There’s not a whole lot you can do at night,” Huguley said. “The most you can do is holler for them and maybe try to get a response.”

He said the number of Scouts and the presence of an experience Scoutmaster made officials believe they’d likely make it out just fine.

“When you got that many, they can make it,” Huguley said. “They can help one another.”

Huguley said the sheriff’s department performs a handful of searches each year for lost hikers, most of which are out-of-towners.

“It’s easy to get turned around if you don’t know what you’re doing out there,” Huguley said. “There are just so many trails.”

As the sheriff’s department was beginning to form a search party Monday morning, the Scouts came marching out of the woods.

Moore said they arrived back home by noon on Monday, some of which were driven home by worried parents who drove up to the campground Monday morning.

He added that it was a lesson in how important it is to “be prepared,” to borrow a phrase, when things go wrong.

But mainly, it was just one of life’s little unexpected happenings.

“The boys got one more day out of school, which they were happy about,” Moore said, “and they’ve got a story to tell their grandkids.””

“I'm glad they're okay.”

“bump”

“I'm glad the guy kept his head and all but...

Backpacking with only one adult? Not good and illegal in the BSA.

Someone is going to get a severe talking to by his Council for turning in a false tour permit form.”

“I'd love to know where they got lost. There aren't that many actual trails there and most of them follow the water. I'm guessing they took the 224 ridge trail or white oak hollow to the Big Tree and got turned around with all the pine beetle damaged trees laying around.”

“I don't remember seeing that many blazes, either, just the posts that mark the trail intersections. Did they assume that the trails would be blazed, and then assume that every tree with a blaze on it was blown down?”

“I wondered that too bit. The only signs I've seen are where 201, 202, and 204 leave 209 and where 206 starts at Thompson Ck. There is also a sign where 204 leaves 224, but it's well off 224. If you don't know to look for it, you're screwed. It's been about 2 years since I've been there though.”

“When I was on the 204 a few years back, we got a little turned around because of blowdowns, and that was before the pine beetle and Ivan. I imagine it's even worse now.”

“It was awful last time I was through there. Yet another reason to hike canyons in Sipsey.”

“Ya know, you gotta wonder if it would save the rescue services down there time and money if someone would just go ahead and mark the trails with blazes. People get lost in the Sipsey all the time.

Hell, if they would just put a sign on the White Oak Hollow trail that says "Wrong Way!" they would probably get fewer lost people there, lol...”

“The person I talked to with the State hinted that these are the types of reasons that they aren't seeking formal Wilderness protection for Jericho.”

“Is blazing of trails prohibited in Wilderness Areas? The AT is blazed in the WA's it passes through. Or is the problem just that no one will do it?”

“I think that's probably unique to the AT. There is no upkeep of blazing along the Pinhoti where it passes through the Cheaha Wilderness. Not sure what's done inside the Dugger Wilderness.”

“I wonder what they would do if some evil person surreptitiously did some blazing in the Sipsey...lol...hmmmmmmmmm”

“Not Unique to AT, New York State uses blazes in most parks. I know both Adirondack and Catskill state parks use blazes to mark trails.
Kinda neat in that they nail little colored discs to the trees, different colors for different trails, paint marks of trail color on rocks where trees not available. Discs are either metal or plastic and about 2 inches in diameter.”

“Yah, but is that done in Federal Wilderness Areas in New York?”

“bit nailed it. The distinction is what they do in designated Wilderness areas. Big distinction.”

“I wonder what they would do if some evil person surreptitiously did some blazing in the Sipsey...lol...hmmmmmmmmm”
bitpusher
10:42:22 AM
12/14/04

Some Sierra Club type would come along and remove them.
Wilderness must be 'pure'!”

“They haven't pulled the posts and signs out of there yet...”

“This first time I went to Sipsey was on about a 12 mile dayhike loop and alone. I must have checked my map 1000x to make sure I wasn't lost.”

“Some Sierra Club type would come along and remove them.
Wilderness must be 'pure'!”
StoveStomper
11:11:13 AM

Would not such purity also ban the creation or maintenance of trails ?”

“Sorry folks, i read this and wasn't going to say anything. But I thought about it and....First, I'm glad all are okay. Second, I dont' care what man does in nature to make things easier. Nature will destroy eventually what man does. In this case trees marked fell down. As to marking trees etc. so ppl won't get lost does not cut it. Nothing is a substitute for a map and compass and the skills to use them. Punch line for me in the scout story was experienced leader taking in a group to an area "he was familiar with" because it was marked. Not so familiar when the marks disappear. Kinda wish the rescue agencies summed up the cost to amass the effort and handed them a bill. Probably get nailed for this response....Ah well think about it. Also and personally, Don't mind if you do but if you ain't ready to venture out don't. Shouldn't have to scar the remaining woods areas just so you won't get lost.”

“There are plenty of blazes in federal wilderness areas.”

“2socks, what those of us who have been to the Sipsey are saying is that it's not marked. There aren't any marks. The subtext is, if the guy says he was familiar with the Sipsey and got lost because he couldn't see any blazes, he's full of #&%!$. There aren't any trail blazes in the Sipsey.

I do agree with most of your statement, however.”

“No harm with ya. I agree, particularly about this area. If you're counting on markings over there then you're SOL.

manuka - very little new trails are created in designated wilderness. As far as maintenance goes it's pretty rough. No chain saws or motorized equipment is allowed, period. This is a Fed law.”

“Would not such purity also ban the creation or maintenance of trails ?”
manuka
11:17:12 AM
12/14/04

Yep! Give em' time.”

“just wait, it won't be long before it will be logged.

I have only been to Sipsey twice and I see where you could eaily get lost. The only trail post I have seen was the one where you cross the Borden creek and I missed it the first time I was there.”

“wrt blazes in wilderness areas (big W areas) - it all depends on the the local FS or NPS region that is controlling the area - some regions will permit blazes and some won't - there is no rule wrt blazes that applies for every Big W area.

wrt trail maintenance in Sipsey - well in my somewhat biased view it gets done in spite of the FS by people who care about the Sipsey. Strictly speaking what I do for blowdown removal is against regs because I don't clear it with the FS before I do it - I just do it. Other than that issue I do try to stick as close as possible to my understanding of the regs including getting certified for using a crosscut saw in FS areas. I will admit I am a bit of a slacker wrt PPE - its rare that I wear my hardhat and I don't even own a pair of 8 inch leather boots but anyways ... the blowdowns get cut and no one has dropped a dime on me yet - as far as I can tell everyone appreciates the work I do.”

“HOI - I want to get a good saw like the one you had at the Sipsey during the Photo hike. What type was it and where might I get one?”

“http://community.webshots.com/photo/94921197/94922330kMNqsA
REAL easy to get lost in stuff like this on top of the canyons.”

“Hey SS, I think he posted a link on the "Sven or Sawvivor" thread...”

“SS - here is what I said on the other thread:
“my favorite saw : http://www.benmeadows.com/store/product_group.asp?dept_id=1825&cat_prefix=4WB

I have heard good things about but have never used : http://www.benmeadows.com/store/product_group.asp?dept_id=1826&cat_prefix=4WB”
Hog On Ice
3:39:49 PM
12/06/04”

“Hey HOI, the product description for that Corona saw says it "planes through the wood on the pull stroke". Forgive a newbie question, but does that mean it only cuts on the pull stroke?”

“basically yes it cuts on the pull stroke and the push stroke does not do much cutting - in other words put all your power into the pull stroke and very little in the push stroke”

“Hmmm, like a Japanese saw...I guess you get used to that, right?”

“Thanks HOL, I mean HOI!”

“LOL”

“Hey Hog....yep that is exactly like the one i use (ref saw) and i carry a larger one in addition. Both can be carried with a seperate purchase sheath and easily attached to your ruck. For those interested I have tried the sven and sawvivor and they were really to flimsy for me....but they will work for campfire stuff.”

“a larger one than the 21 inch ??? how big is the large one you have?”

“Someone may have touched on this already but here (Arkansas) if the trails were built before (Hurricane Creek) they can be blazed & maintained. If someone want to build new trails (Richland Creek) no blazes are allowed. Don't know if this applies anywhere else but both of these areas are maintained by the USFS.”

“It'd be great if they'd do that at Sipsey.”

“I guess I should say before the area became a wilderness area.”

“When I first started going to Sipsey there were signs at some of the trails....now they are few and far between...the one at the Sipsey/Borden crossing is gone...The ONLY reason I hiked in the dark at the Photo hike was because I had hiked the trail before...and knew my way somewhat....but there are some areas that if you don't know where you are going it can be dangerous.....like the lower 200 trail....ya know...the area where the trail has been washed almost completely away???....I guess I am just a chicken...boy...I wonder where they were hiking at????”

“div, that trail sign is still there. At least it was that morning before you came in that night. Maybe the boy scouts tore it down for firewood during the day ;)”

“IMHO I think the Sipsey trails should be completely re-cut and official campsites (not where bubba and his 50 gallon cooler buddies like to camp) added by folks that know how to get the most from the area. Many pockets of the Sipsey have too many trails, others have none. Also, most of the trail is the effect of visitors making a trail as the path of least resistance or where there was none. That place has much potential as being a true jewel.”

“That leaves Dayhiker out. He's for sure a Bubba & I've seen him carry a cooler WITH ICE a couple of miles to camp.”

“BUT.......why not keep the Bubba's on those trails....and leave the other areas for those who REALLY backpack????If ya start cutting new trails then all of Sipsey will be like say for instance trail 200....most of the day hikers take that trail...and I'll bet it is the most used....”

“I agree to some degree and that is the difference between Joe Bob the trailblazer (ok enough with the names) and someone who knows how to get the most from an area. So many sights and sounds exist off trail in Sipsey. However, I've never been on a trail where bubba campers walked more than a quarter of a mile past the trailhead. My complaint is the trails have not been built with any stragic design which would both keep those special wild places wild and offer the backpacker a nice getaway. Hopefully this makes sense.
last edited: 12/14/04 4:14:32 PM”

“Arky - Crap, I did bring ice didn't I?

TH - I sort of agree, but won't Wilderness regs prevent all of that? The Pinhoti takes up too much of local resources. These folks want to be the AT. If I want that sort of hiking, I'll go to the AT and not the Pinhoti. It's a smaller, easier, less intense version of the AT, imo.”