Exit Strategy=Surrender

“But, to say that everyone should have known the real reasons for invading is not what they were told, is a stretch, at best.

As this forum demonstrated, few people actually have the capacity or motivation to dig into these things.”

“The U.S. spent more on things military in the middle east oil region than the oil itself is worth.

And that was before the recent War On Iraq.

That's one hell of a subsidy for an industry that is going to shrink in the near future anyway.”

“As this forum demonstrated, few people actually have the capacity or motivation to dig into these things.”
Mutt
2:28:27 PM

Then, either you agree that the American people have to have this spelled out for them, OR.....

The administration is so blatantly arrogant and obsessed with their vision for the world, that the people's views mean squat or they simply don't care about the people's views.

Sooooooooo, which is it?
last edited: 11/23/05 2:12:20 PM”

“It's not the administrations job to take action based on biased polls which are influenced by biased reporting.”

“http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/11/23/crawfordwarprotest.ap/index.html

War protestors honoring the fallen soldiers? Yeah, right!”

“You poor peeps must be really bored.”

“What are you doing Stove?”

“Partly correct, Sarge.

It's the administration's job to do what is in the public interest.

The polls merely reflect how the public feels about how well they are being served.

Many more of the public now see that this administration serves the narrow interests of the administration's paying patrons.”

“Putting off doing work. LOL”

“The polls merely reflect how the public feels about how well they are being served.

The public does not necessarily have all the facts. That's one reason why we have a Republic, and not a Democracy.”

“MarkO - Do you think the President should make decisions based on public opinion polls?”

““MarkO - Do you think the President should make decisions based on public opinion polls?”
Sarge
2:21:25 PM
11/23/05

NO!!!!!

The President does however "make decisions based on public opinion polls", as evidenced by his frequent and expensive trips he takes to try to sell his warped policies to the American public.

He has repeatedly and at taxpayer expense travelled about the U.S. to sell the war and Social Security Reform, etc. when his ratings take a dive.”

“US mulls troop cuts in Iraq By Will Dunham
1 hour, 17 minutes ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Pentagon plans to shrink the U.S. troop presence in Iraq, currently 155,000, to about 138,000 after the December 15 Iraqi elections and is considering dropping the number to about 100,000 next summer if conditions allow, defense officials said on Wednesday.

But officials said a variety of planning scenarios, including the possibility of no cut in troop levels, are being reviewed based on political and security conditions in Iraq and progress in developing U.S.-trained Iraqi security forces.

The officials stressed no decisions had been made. This comes amid intensifying debate in the U.S. Congress over whether U.S. troops should be withdrawn after 2-1/2 years of war in Iraq.

"The United States military looks at the full range of things that could occur in Iraq and makes plans accordingly, and makes plans for conditions that would lead to a smaller coalition force as well as conditions that would lead to a larger coalition force," said Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman.

Whitman said the plan was to drop back to 138,000 troops, considered the recent baseline level for the U.S. force, following the December 15 elections in which Iraqis will select a new permanent government.

The Pentagon increased U.S. troop levels in Iraq ahead of the October 15 referendum in which Iraqis approved a constitution, and the U.S. force peaked in October at about 161,000, the highest level of the war. After temporarily dropping by several thousand troops, the size of the U.S. force again is rising to help provide security for the December 15 elections.

In March and again in July, Army Gen. George Casey, the top U.S. commander in Iraq, predicted a "fairly substantial" reduction in American forces next spring and summer if Iraq's political process goes positively and progress is made in developing Iraqi security forces. Pentagon officials said in August that meant a reduction of perhaps 20,000 to 30,000 troops from the level of 138,000 then in Iraq.

PHASED REDUCTION

A defense official, who asked not to be named, said such a cut remains under consideration, but options for a smaller cut or no reduction remain on the table.

"There is the potential over the course of next summer to get to 100,000. Nothing is going to happen fast. It will all be phased," said the official.

"If you start going down below that, you might be sending a message that we're cutting and running," the official added.

The No. 2 U.S. commander in Iraq, Army Lt. Gen. John Vines, said on Tuesday a "precipitous pullout" of U.S. forces would be destabilizing to Iraq.

The considerations come amid debate in Congress over the future of U.S. involvement in Iraq. Rep. John Murtha (news, bio, voting record) of Pennsylvania, an influential Democrat on military affairs who fought as a Marine in Vietnam and voted for the Iraq war, called last week for U.S. forces to be withdrawn within six months.

Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said on Tuesday she suspected American forces "are not going to be needed in the numbers that they're there for all that much longer" due to progress being made by the Iraqis.

Defense officials said the political debate will not drive decisions on troop levels.

U.S. forces are engaged in a fierce fight with insurgents. There have been 2,108 U.S. military deaths in a war that began in March 2003, the Pentagon said on Wednesday, with another 15,804 troops wounded in action. Thousands of Iraqis have also been killed.

Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is forecasting an improving security situation. Last week he said, "In terms of Iraq, the insurgency is going to diminish, I think, after these elections."

"So I think we'll see the coalition forces being able to pare down," Rumsfeld said”

“NO!!!!!

The President does however "make decisions based on public opinion polls", as evidenced by his frequent and expensive trips he takes to try to sell his warped policies to the American public.

He has repeatedly and at taxpayer expense travelled about the U.S. to sell the war and Social Security Reform, etc. when his ratings take a dive.”
MarkO
3:27:35 PM
11/23/05

What?

How is trying to rally the American public around his idea the same as making decisions bassed on public opinion polls?

If anything, they're the opposite.”

““I do wonder if the Bush administration is planning on the newly elected regime to ask them to leave - then declaring victory and leaving according to the will of the people."
- pedxing
12:45:14 PM
1/11/05


Two points to ped.




I wonder if Jean Schmidt will now call the Pentagon cowards.
last edited: 11/23/05 3:26:39 PM”

“What? Bumbleya going to cut and run like a coward? NEVER! Bumbleya's big Dick will never let them do that. Heresy! HERESY I tells ya!

We have to stay in Iraq to maintain Muttonhead's bases and keep those Iraqis democratic. Why if we leave they might vote for something else. We can't have that. What kind of democracy is it if people vote for something we don't approve of?”

“You're just mumbling on now.”

“Yeah Geo - That's the reason we installed a Republic... not a Democracy.”

“You guys are making stuff up, then you're mocking the made up stuff on top of that. It's no wonder you guys get so confused with reality.”

“sarge, even you have got to admit there should be some type of exit plan in place for when Iraq takes over control of their country. We shouldn't have to be there forever esp. when the Iraqi's want us out also.

Just think we could bring those troops home and put them on the borders. That would give the Border Patrol some much needed support”

“Forever? As Bush and Rumsfeld and Cheney said from the beginning, it could take months, it could take years, but regardless we have to be patient. This is nothing new.

As far as "exit strategy", what exactly are you talking about? What makes you think we don't have an exit strategy. I assure you we do. The Army practices that stuff on a regular basis. ... so you must be talking about a timeframe. Again, nobody in their right mined thinks we should get out right now. On the other hand, it's obvious things are getting better and in a short time we can begin pulling out. I think you're just using silly talking points now. If not, what specifically are you having a problem with? Not doing a 100% pullout immediately? Come on Ewker, you know better than that.”

“we could be totally out within 6 months to a yr. I know a 100% withdrawal right now won't work right now

Even Rep. John Murtha who caused the uproar in Washington said we could be out in 6 months. He never said a thing about a total withdrawal.

IMO I don't think Bush or his adminstration has a plan. Lets hopes there are some bright people in the right places who do.”

“What makes you think he doesn't have an exit plan. (I'm sure moveon.org and such are saying it, but what evidence is there?) This (the cry from the left about the exit plan) to me sounds like typical Bush backing w/o substance.
last edited: 11/23/05 5:13:38 PM”

“what makes you think he has a plan? what is moveon.org?”

“Because, like I mentioned before, the military practices that all the time. You are saying he doesn't have one, but it makes more since that he would since that's standard procedure. Again, I'm not sure what about an exit plan you don't think he has. The timetable? The reinforcements of Iraqi troops? What?

If you're looking for them to publish it on the whitehouse.gov website, it's not going to happen. As anybody knows, a specific timetable/plan is just what the insurgency wants.”

“I am not saying he has to say we will be out on so and so date. The troops can be brought back slowly and be out within 6 months to a yr. Based on predictions from his adminstration (the one who talks but doesn't want to be identified) the withdrawal will take 2-3 more yrs.

Again Iraq wants us out. I do find it odd how we want them to be on their own but we won't listen or do what they ask. So pull our troops out and let them handle it. let them blow themselves up instead of our soldiers”

“And if we did that the left would complain that we failed b/c they got blown up. Let's just do it right and not be impatient. I'm sure FULL (>95%) withdrawal will take 2-3 years, but most of the troops will be out in 1-2.”

“actually some of both parties would complain. People complained about us leaving Vietnam. They never fought that war to win it and the same is being done in Iraq. It is a drag on war, milk it for what you can then cut your losses and leave”

“Exactly, people would complain b/c it isn't right. I agree with the rest of your post. Let's cut to the chase ... we seem to agree about what should be done re: the withdrawal. The only disagreement seems to be that you think Bush doesn't have a plan, and I think he does. Since neither of us can prove our side at this point (time may tell), then we'll have to wait and see.

I'll be around painting this thanksgiving. Have a good one yourself.”

“yep your right, time will tell. Have a Happy Thanksgiving and a good weekend. I will be out of here come Friday morning”

“I think that people have to remember that the American people gave President Bush a mandate last November.

There should be no pullout. This Iraq plan was always going to take ten or twenty years. That's what Bush and America signed up for. Leaving after just a few is lunacy.

BTW, the worst of the bunch are the Republicans looking for a way out. Take your medicine, boys. You made the decision. Now stare it straight in the eye every day and make it better.”