Winter Camping for Newbies?

“On the inside of the ankle (above the arch) or outside? I didn't know that one. I usually put one on the bottom of my feet between socks at night. I will have to try on my ankle.”

“no moisture at all in the boots. i think the warmers have something to do with that.”

“I put the toe warmers literally at my toes (with a sock liner inside my "bedtime socks" Seemed to work well. I will have to try the ankle thing sometime...”

“I just thought the bag would have kept the moisture from escaping.”

“I can't believe no one has posted the single most important tip about winter camping.........







Do not eat the yellow snow!”

“oh and speaking of yellow snow. make sure you make some as soon as you feel the need to. it sucks to keep waking up at night and have to go
just go
last edited: 1/21/05 12:50:32 PM”

“I think those Thermacare thermal pads will be for me though. I sleep so cold. Even in the summer. That's why I haven't backpacked/camped since September!”

“If that's the case, pixie, you might really like them-- you can tape them right to your skin, but if you're sleeping, you might get burned by that--so maybe sticking/wrapping it in a bandana might help--although I think it needs air to properly heat up... ;-) I've had mine last me an entire day before!”

“pink, I'm surprised they are so hot. They are meant to be stuck to the skin, yes? Maybe you should write to them about how the pads burned you...

I wonder if I couldn't stick it right to the outside of my thermal shirt at the lower back region.”

“karo - slip your middle finger down your sock to your ankle, just behind the hump. You'll feel a good pulse there. The artery is very close to the surface there, which is why its a good place for the hand warmer (and a good place to check for a pulse if doing CPR).

Don't use your index finger (the one next to your thumb) because it has a decent pulse all by itself, so you may feel a pulse when you are really feeling the one in your finger. Good to know for this test and for CPR.”

“here you go Dub:

http://www.haeadventure.com/bathroom.htm”

“KEEP YOUR TOES FROM FREEZING BY USING GAITERS AND HAVE MANY EXTRA SOCKS :)


Winter Items I Love

gaiters

handwarmers

down booties

hot water in nalgene bottle in sleeping bag before bed

hot chocolate w/h powdered milk and kahlua (for that matter, I usually crave high fat foods when bp'ing and double that desire in the winter...like cheese, beef, potatoes, snickers...)

bungie cords or something akin to strap on the extra winter items (snowshoes, outer jacket if really warm from hiking, etc)

AmyG had a rockin candle lantern - I've not used one yet but it seems like a great idea (anti-frost)

loads of extra garbag bags (to put your stuff down without it getting wet on the snow, weighting a bag with snow for tent stakes, to put your boots in (put a handwarmer in each, push the tongue down to block the opening, and your boots won't freeze over night...might even dry out)

okay - I've got some stuff to pick up for my trip next weekend...HANDWARMERS!!!

have fun - stay local - take a cell phone”

“I teach Red Cross CPR, but we don't teach to use the ankle pulse. I think I found it on the outside of my ankle (opposite the arch). I would guess that you have one on each side. One side may be stronger tho. I know about using the index finger and midle finger to check pulse, cause you have one in your thumb. We teach that in Red Cross First Aid. BTW,I used to be an EMT in TN. But that was a LOOOOng time ago!”

“The courses I have had also said to avoid the index finger - but it has been years since the last one so maybe they teach differently now. The pulse I'm talking about is the one between the ankle hump and your achilles tendon (same side as the foot arch). They mentioned using that as a backup if you can't find one at the neck and can't immediately get to the inner thigh to check there (person is wearing thick clothing, easier to take off a shoe or boot). They mention this pulse point (and all others) here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse”

“Can't take a cell phone, we don't own one.. :-) just walkie-talkies... we can't be bothered with the extra expense and I don't like being available 24/7”

“LMAO at the link Hog provided. The diagram with the snowshoes and the "blast zone" was hysterical!!!
It's funny, cause a guy wrote it and he mentioned several times "sorry for the ladies." Sorry?! We are used to having our bare tooshies exposed to the cold air and squatting. We've had a lot of practice with that!!!”

“Two words:

Pee bottle.”

“Bowlder, I don't know... I'm not sure having to deal with ruining a bottle by peeing in it and then having to deal with emptying it would be worth it. Besides us ladies have "drip" issues. It's not a neat affair.

Although I hate leaving me tent at night, even when it's relatively warm out...”

“Oh and no one has answered my booty question.

Don't the down booties get wet, slogging around camp in them? And why not just be wearing your boots with fresh socks or something?”

“Oh, that kind of booty...”

“Hog. That's really funny!

Hmmm... might be another reason NOT to go camping in the wintertime...”

“1. have a really high loft bag, preferably down, with a waterproof outer cover

2. use a gear sled to haul your gear

3. use a white gas stove. Abotu any will work, but my MSR Dragonfly is superb.

4. use a platform under the stove

5. take a small foam pad to sit on, like 18" x 18"

6. test your thermarest for leaks before the trip. more than one foam pad is allowed.”

“What exactly is a "gear sled"?”

“Use the ankle pulse for guys but I would always go for the inner thigh on the ladies LOL.”

“I have worn my booties in the snow. other then sliding on ice patches I had no problem. they will help keep the toosie warm.
they have rubber bottoms on the soles.
last year scorch and myslef wore our booties in MD and it was so slippery that we needed help to walk. funny”

“Here's some gear sled pics...

http://community.webshots.com/photo/65383384/65386793bUepdu

http://community.webshots.com/photo/65383384/65387055lpJjBl”

“You can make them out of a regular sled with some kind of bars attached. It's nice to have the weight off you back...

http://community.webshots.com/photo/65383384/65391578WmYgXl”

“One thing to note about gear sleds is that they aren't very effective on steep terrain.”

“do they have to be bars, or will rope be okay?”

“You'll want the bars other wise the sled will nail the back of your legs when you go down hill.”

“I don't like the down booties because the bottoms tend to be slippery, which makes them useless if you're actually on snow.

Love the chemical heaters! Though last year a friend of mine had really thick new mittens - those and the heaters made her hands sweat, and put the heaters out.
But, they are so much easier than the heaters where you bent a disc in the middle, but couldn't use the heaters again until they were boiled. Or something like that. They were a pain.”

“Lately, I've been using vapor barrier gloves underneath liner gloves for doing chores when you can't wear bulky gloves. They keep my hands significantly warmer and they don't get all sweaty either, just slighly damp inside. The non latex gloves called Nyplex work well and are very durable.”

“Okay, that makes sense (about the bars needing to be rigid!)

I'm thinking of stocking my bar with Vodka and beer and mixers... hee hee”

“We've used PVC pipe or plastic irrigation pipe. The pipes can be hooked on with a carbiner or hinges to the sled and then hooked to a pack belt. It works well to run a rope through them to hook on to the belt somehow. We have gone up some pretty steep slopes in Yellowstone with them too. Having the rigid bars keeps the sled behind you on the downhills and keeps them fairly stable on sidehills.”

“Pixie - the down booties are a wonderful treat for tired, cold, wet feet after a day of backpacking....especially in the winter when you've been attached to snowshoes for 6 hours and you're sick at the very sight of your sopping wet boots

they are super light weight and I've never had a problem with mine getting soaked...and if they've gotten a bit wet they have always dried out after a night in the sleeping bag

oh!!! if you put those handwarmer do-dads in the booties - with thick down bootie only sleeping in toe heaven socks....my god....it's almost better than chocolate

trust me...the Toes knows ;)”

“My secret trip for winter camping is to camp near a hot springs. Too bad you don't live in Idaho. My class is going on our overnight in a week, and we are going to build snow shelters, eat food, then hit the hot springs. We have 6 class sessions, then the overnight. Most people use snow shoes on our trip, I definitely use a sled about like aero's. Its so nice to not have the weight on your shoulders, plus you can take a lot more gear. Our route is on a road for 2 miles, so there is no problem with steep terrain.”

“G00SE used Shoe Goo to put treads on the bottom of his booties. I'm thinking of doing the same, he never seems to slip.

Just a tip: If you eat a small pinch of salt just before going to bed you won't have to get up to pee during the night. I use Lite Salt because it has Potassium and Calcium salts in it--electrolytes good.”

“how do you clear a spot for the tent in the snow? is a shovel required or can you pack the snow down some other way?”

“Pack the snow down with your snowshoes.”

“Those WONDERFUL hand warmers!!!!well worth their weight in GOLD!!!!”

“I've learned alot...thanks.”

“Lot's of good info here. I'd add two things:

1) Winter hike as prep for winter backpacking. Day hike through whatever conditions you are going to experience backpacking.

2) Put your water bottle (assuming it does not leak) upside down. That way if it freezes, you will still be able to get water out - as the top freezes first. A flavored electrolyte mix will also help lower the freezing point (you can make this yourself).”

“there are a couple of great books on the subject.

Cold Comfort, another on winter camping/ski camping I'll find the name of.

also check out
http://www.princeton.edu/~oa/winter/wintcamp.shtml”

“Here's a great book:

The Winter Wilderness Companion:
Traditional and Native American Skills for the Undiscovered Season

Garrett Conover and Alexandra Conover
(Ragged Mountain Press, A Division of the McGraw-Hill Companies, © 2001)

It this remarkably compact how-to volume, the authors celebrate the often overlooked splendor of winter and invite readers to embrace the season—not just endure it—by making use of traditional skills and equipment and drawing on traditional philosophies. With detailed instructions for making clothing, tents, toboggans, and snowshoes, among others, this is the complete guide to enjoying the winter wilderness.

“The Conovers propose a spiritual kinship with winter, this most extreme, yet mystical, season. . . . This is in all respects a well-written, entertaining, and enthralling work.”..—Bushwacker



It's probably going to be hard to find this book right now. I was at a winter camping symposium in October and had a chance to meet the Conovers and hear them speak. I also met their book distributor, who is my brother's friend. I bought one of his last copies of their book, but he said more are forthcoming soon.

This couple has had tens of articles written about them. They are as extreme as you can get. And they live in their tent year round. They utilize traditional methods for surviving winter camping. It's not uncommon for them to have 80 - 100 pounds or more each on their sleds. You can probably learn a lot by just googling their name.”

“Found this interesting web site today. It covers winter camping and lots more.

http://therucksack.tripod.com/wintercampresources.htm”

“Has anyone tried to put one of the chemical handwarmers on the cancave bottom of a cannister to warm it before using it in the cold weather??? Would this get too hot for the cannister? I wouldn't think it would get too hot for an explosion, but not sure. Also is the cold air at the burner the problem with the cannister stove's performance??? I dunno, anyone have any experience or theories?”

“I just returned today from my first winter solo trip in the Sierra.

This was only my second winter trip, the last one being Winterfest at Mt. Shasta.

This trip was successful (except for falling on a rock and nearly fracturing my patella). I was toasty all night. Some of the pointers I've seen and implemented include:
1. layers, layers...
2. use water bottles and avoid the hydration packs. Carry only enough water to get to camp, then melt snow for the reaminder of your needs. I just bought a JetBoil - I highly recommend it. I didn't boil my water, but did sleep with it in my bag.
3. Change socks before going to bed - and wear two pairs. My feet were freezing my first trip out - I had no problems this time.
4. A good sleeping bag of course - I bought a REI syncat 0 degree for only 80 bucks. It's not the lightest, but I dont plan on doing 5 day trips in the winter, so a couple pounds for 1-2 nights is fine.
5. use two sleeping mats - a foam layer under your thermarest. I didn't have any problems with nocturesis. (LOL)

Rob”

“Another great book is "Mike and Allens Excelent Backcountry Skiing Book". It is about $13, had great drawings and great adavice on every aspect of winter camping.”

“Karo, it's actually a temp problem with the cannister. I've thought of doing that with the handwarmer but I'm not going to be the one to try it, LOL. You can't use a windscreen with the under-burner cannister stoves because the reflected heat from the burner might cause the cannister to explode. Also, you can't use the Outback Oven with an under-burner cannister for the same reason. I don't know how much temp increase it would take to make the cannister blow and I'm not particularly interested in finding out by trial and error, know what I mean?”

“http://www.princeton.edu/~oa/winter/index.shtml

another site on winter camping, this one includes building snow shelters
last edited: 1/24/05 3:19:58 PM”