Winter Camping for Newbies?

“as a good starting point for winter camping for newbies? Would you suggest trying it out at home in your backyard?

How did some of you more seasoned backpackers learn to go winter backpacking?”

“trying out stuff in your backyard is a great idea IMO.

especially things like tents, sleeping bags, stoves”

“yeah, test your gear. If it hold out, the next most impartant thing is to keep everything as dry as possible.”

“oh... and what types of supplies do you carry--how much of it differs from what you carry in the summertime?

We have snowshoes for up to 200 lbs. but I'm not sure that they would support us with our full packs on.... (the bigger shoes seemed too heavy, so we opted for the smaller ones.)”

“I agree with what everyone has said about testing your gear out at home

nothing like setting up your tent at night in 2 feet of snow and then sleeping at the wrong end (not that I would know anything about that)

a few hints to keep warm.
boil water and put it in your nalgan bottle and bring it to bed with you.
layers and layers
hand and tow warmers. you can get these at almost any super market.

drink something warm before bed
eat a candy bar. something about the sugar that keeps you warm”

“y2... I learned a lot about keeping dry when we went on the MRT/NCT hike this past October... LOL!”

“forget carring a lot of water with you if there is snow on the ground. you can boil snow to cook with.”

“i think snowshoes depend more on snow conditions than weight rating.

if it's light fluffy stuff, then you're sinking in no matter what.

harder packed snow and you'll be fine.”

“would you still suggest filtering the snow (after melting it, of course?)

And, what about the platypus bags? are they a good idea--do the tube insulators really work?”

“good ref. for winter backpacking: http://www.backpacking.net/winter.html”

“my platypus bag froze.
it was like 12 degrees (i think)
i did not worry about filtering the snow after i melted it.
of course I was not to bothered about the little floating things in it :)
if you get a good layer of snow, dig a little bit and take from there”

“Hmm, test your gear at home (as has already been said), then test your ideas in a car-camping situation. Last winter I started leaving tents at home in favor of tarps. I was using just a 6x8 tarp, and one night the winds were blowing snow under it. Had I been deep in the woods, I'd have been in trouble. Since the Jeep wasn't even 50 yards away, I called it a night.

The main gear differences for me are more stove fuel, more insulation & a warmer sleeping pad. I don't know if you use a water filter, but I leave that at home in the winter - don't want any freezing water to crack the fitler element.”

“i usually don't get the snow to boiling - just melted.

The chemical warmers are really nice.

Setting the tent up on snow is a little diff than on ground - think snow anchors, long limbs with snow packed around them work great, so do plastic sacks filled with snow and buried - tie a short rope to the handles and to the stake loop.

Water bottles freeze and are hard to drink from - sleep with it in your bag, if you make it full of hot water, it'll keep you warm to.

Layers, layers, layers - dress in layers so you can adjust as you hike and get hot then stop and cool down.

Your snowshoes are probably fine - you'll always sink 4 or 5 inches in loose powder and it'll depnd on the snow consistency anyway. IF the trail is packed, you won't sink at all.

Have fun!

oh yeah, what mapes said about eating - calories make heat in your body. Also, don't put off going to pee - your body has to work to maintain temps in a full bladder more than it does in an empty one.
last edited: 1/21/05 11:32:56 AM”

“good thing about the platypus bag is that you can stuff it in your coat to keep from freezing.
i don't bother with the tubes - too easy to freeze - i just drink from the bag.

if it's mid twenties or warmer you can get buy with nalgenes on the outside of pack - the sloshing around from walking keeps them from freezing too fast. just remember to keep them upsidedown so they don't freeze on top.”

“IMO the tube insulators are a waste of money. I love using a platypus bag, but I switch over to a water bottle in winter. Many people like to use the hydration bags in winter and everyone says to make sure you blow the water back into the bag or the hose will freeze up regardless if you use the tube insulator or not.
last edited: 1/21/05 11:34:13 AM”

“Going with experienced people is a plus. My first winter backpacking trip was a TT trip in the Adirondacks (FYAO II). I learned a lot simply by watching and listening.

Here's a great thread started by AmyG 2 years ago:

Pssst...winter bp secrets”

“I'll remember that trick. I have the insulator and I use it year round. It has a cover to keep out the dirt. I have found out that once I set my pack down the first thing to touch the ground is my drinking tube.”

“This is important; put your beer in the snow so it won't freeze.

http://community.webshots.com/photo/34023149/34023728hOmYap

Here are some other winter camping pics...
http://community.webshots.com/album/34023149dTdhtp”

“my first winter backpacking trip I did solo. but I made sure that I have an escape route. grant it, I was only 1 1/2 miles from my car, but I wanted to be able to get out if need be,

also do not take your self inflating bed mattress if you have one. I used my and the condinsation in the morning made me think I had peed the bed.
yes it was one of those trips that you are glad you were by yourself.”

“That's good to know about the platys... I was wondering if the insulators would even be worth the money...

How do you keep your water from freezing overnight? Just keep it in the tent?

We have this kind of stove, would it work well in winter?

http://www.rei.com/product/9610818.htm?vcat=REI_SSHP_CAMPING_TOC

”

“If the snow's deep enough, bury your water bags about a foot deep--they won't freeze over night.”

“same thing for your fuel. keep it close to you or it will not work.
i took my pepsi can stove and had no problems using it in that cold.

ok my winter pics
http://community.webshots.com/album/62069115yIVgJx”

“If you trust your water container not to leak, you can put it inside your sleeping bag at your feet.

I use a white gas stove in the winter - a MSR Simmerlite. I didn't get good performance from canister stoves like that one, but a lot of people here have tricks for making them work.”

“also do not take your self inflating bed mattress if you have one. I used my and the condinsation in the morning made me think I had peed the bed.

Mapleleaf--do you mean condensation inside or outside of the mattress? (are you talking about a thermarest?)”

“um yes to all?
LOL
i had a cheapy air matterss and when i woke up in the morning I thought i peed the bed.
LOL @ me”

“My advice: Go with someone who knows what they're doing. Ask them a lot of stuff before you go, then pay attention during the trip.

My winter camping photos:

http://community.webshots.com/album/120658690nSXHuo

http://community.webshots.com/album/113814236RzbcGC

http://community.webshots.com/album/67371043nkAajy

http://community.webshots.com/album/63947810YQdMMQ

http://community.webshots.com/album/55011640EPFuwq”

“Keep your butt warm. Trust me on this.

Seriously though, lots of clothing layers, a hot water bottle at night, add oil to everything you cook, an extra layer of insulation under your bedding at night (extra foam pad, reflective blanket, whatever), and sleep in a hat + neck gaitor or balaclava if you're a cold sleeper. Toe warmers in down booties are heaven-sent. That's what I can think of, off hand.

Definitely "practice" in the back yard a few times in different conditions before going out for real.

I've got an MSR bite valve and it'll freeze up even if I blow the water back into the bladder. Too many moving parts, I'd say. G00SE doesn't have that trouble with his, it's a Camelback. Simpler really is better.”

“oops... I posted the wrong stove.
this is the one we have:

http://www.rei.com/product/9610818.htm?vcat=REI_SSHP_CAMPING_TOC

”

“My son also has a cheapy air mattress and he has problems with condensation too. I've never had that problem with a thermarest.

I don't like the cannister stove performance at all in cold weather either. You can put it in a saucer of water (I use a pan lid) and it helps increase flame output tremendously, but the fuel efficiency sucks monkey butt. G00SE and I went through 2 cannisters in one weekend when the temps dropped below 25. We usually take 2 cannisters and have them last 2 or three weekends.
last edited: 1/21/05 12:03:35 PM”

“i did this and it worked great
at night put toe warmers in your boots and put them in plastic bags. tie it up.
in the morning when you slip your boots on they will not be frozen :)”

“Forget about using that stove in winter. I have that one and had it out in November when it was barely at 32F and the thing would barely work after warming it in my jacket for 2 hours. Get a white gas stove. And always carry an extra base layer of insulation. Next to your skin will get wet.”

“Never had a problem with my thermarest in the winter either.”

“so what are you trying to say dub?



I did pee?”

“Well....you do tend to consume quite a few recreational beverages before you go to bed :-P

One too many that night? ;-)”

“White gas is best in winter, though Trangia makes a good winter kit for Alcohol stoves.

The freezing bladder tube is a pain. Camelback does a winter kit for it, but even that's not foolproof. It's a real pain if all your water freezes. So you can wrap it in an item of spare clothing, that helps insulate it from the cold somewhat. One of my winter coats has a big pocket that a nalgene withh fit in, which is a good place to have it when you're walking.”

“haha no i did not
i was to afraid to get really buzzed.”

“Has anyone tried those thermal pads for sore muscles? It seems one of the larger kind stuck on the lower back would keep you nice and warm all night long. I guess they last 8 hours. I've been meaning to try them for the pinched nerve in my neck. But it seems it would be nice for backpacking.”

“Yeah, I learned my lesson with the freezing bladder on last years Blair Witch Hike. I was all for taking a bladder, "you just have to blow air back through the tube." Well, that was fine and dandy until the platy froze. Then I had to drink after ScorchFire, ewww! ;-)”

“You do need some water to use when melting snow. If you just fill your pot with snow and try to melt it, the pot will melt before the snow does. You have to add the snow to some water and monitor the melting. I found this out the hard way also! What hot water you take in your nalgene to sleep with you should be plenty to start with. Just don't let what little water you have freeze. Then you are screwed!”

“Dub, oh the horror! Girl cooties! LOL!

Hey guys, what's the story with down booties? Are you walking around the camp in snow in them? I don't think they'd work so well in the PNW. It's so darn wet here.”

“I don't have any trouble staying warm at night. I do have trouble prying my butt out of that nice warm bag in the morning, though. It's just too warm in there and too cold outside.”

“Anyone figure out how to poop in the freezing cold without freezing your butt? I think that's the worst thing about winter camping....exposing those nekid buns and family jewels to the blistering cold for an extended period of time. I almost didn't go last time cause it was so cold!”

“Dub try wearing your long underwear backwards.
;-)”

“What about this stove?
Would you recommend it?

http://www.rei.com/outlet/product/47882062.htm?vcat=OUTLET_SSHP_CAMPING_

”

“I never had problems melting snow. made the pot turn wacky colors, but it worked.”

“Has anyone tried those thermal pads for sore muscles? It seems one of the larger kind stuck on the lower back would keep you nice and warm all night long. I guess they last 8 hours. I've been meaning to try them for the pinched nerve in my neck. But it seems it would be nice for backpacking.”
pixie
1:13:24 PM
1/21/05

I've tried them-- they work wonders on sore muscles or cramps... :-)

And, yes, they are very warm! In fact, if you wear it during the day and it's a little warm, it can make you get over heated! They are quite pricey, though, and I think a lot heavier than the small foot and hand warmers-- the problem is that once it is exposed to air, you have to use it or lose it. they can actually almost cause burns sometimes because they get so hot. I'm not sure how well they work in really cold weather though...”

“i did this and it worked great
at night put toe warmers in your boots and put them in plastic bags. tie it up.
in the morning when you slip your boots on they will not be frozen :)”
mapleleaf
12:57:05 PM
1/21/05

Wouldn't there be moisture or condensation in the bag if you do this?”

“Make up two custom webbing straps to hold the snowshoes on your pack. I use 1 inch webbing and the waist belt snaps scavenged from dead fanny packs. Makes taking the snowshoes off and on the pack very easy. Do not want to be mucking around with string using frozen fingers. Easy on and off makes you more likely to put the snowshoes on when you should, and take them off and put them back on the pack when you should.

When melting snow, heat some water in the bottom of the pot first, then gradually add snow otherwise you will burn a hole in the bottom of your pot. I boil as I do not filter in winter.

A bandana is a great leaf and debris filter for water from melted snow. Alternative is one of those tea strainers with wire mesh to fish the floaters out.


Wide mouth water bottles greatly reduce the chance of pouring boiling water over your fingers when re-filling the water bottles from the pot. Hence the popularity of Nalgene bottles. Boiled fingers hurt.

I prefer the car camping or v/short hike as I have never been enthused at the frozen back yard with my nice warm inside bed too close.

Pockets on your shell. The number, size, placement of the pockets on your shell make a big difference. Where you store snacks so you can eat while hiking. I have a big inside mesh pocket which holds my ski goggles. The placement part is so you still have access with your pack on. A hip belt will make waist pockets inaccessible. Vertical chest pockets work for me.
Check out venting with your pack on also.
Check out hood adjustments so you can still see when you have everything cinched down for freezing rain (Yecht, it does happen sometimes).

Mitts are much warmer than gloves, too warm sometimes. I use fleece liner mitts under waterproof shells. When hiking the shell mitts only are normally enough, use the liners when I stop.

My son uses a 1/2 nalgene inside a shell pocket for water on the move. I have a mesh bag on a strap tied to my pack. It keeps the water weight (quart) on the pack, but the strap is long enough to go over my shoulder and hang at chest height inside the shell so it does not freeze.”

“Glove liners are godsend. Get a cheap synthetic set from Galyans. Then when it's really cold you can use your fingers covered, but without the bulk of your normal gloves.”

“I put on double socks on my feet and then put a hand warmer between the socks, right on the artery that goes by the ankle "hump". You don't want the thing against your skin or you will get burned, so that's why the extra sock. With the heat right on that artery it will heat your blood and so warm your whole body.”