Buying an SUV

“i'm going to look this coming saturday for a small to mid-size SUV. i'm sick of having an unreliable smaller than small car, especially in the snow, or when going hiking and having to drive on those mountain roads.

anyone have any suggestions?

i'm looking for my monthly payment to be around 300 or less. no higher.

currently i'm researching the Honda CRV, Nissan Xterra, and Toyota Rav 4.”

“So am I

Right now, I think I've got it down to Ford Escape. Here's my reasoning:

CRV and RAV4 are too small -- out.

Mid-size SUV's are all out because they're too expensive and their v6 engines are gas guzzlers.

Nissan screwed me over with their Xterra for 2005 by eliminating the 4-cyllinder models.

GM does not offer any baby suv's with 5 speed manual trans.

Jeeps are out just because they're Chryslers.

So that leaves me with Ford Escape. I've got several quotes already, and pending I get enough for a trade-in and a satisfactory deal on a car that has the features I want, I could have it as early as next week.

Oh yeah, the $2000 rebate that Ford is running thru the end of March kinda had some influence on that...”

“scorchy, 2 years ago i was in the same place. i did a lot of research and test drove nearly every SUV out there less than 30,000. some vehicles i test drove 2 or even 3 times.

i thought the rav4 and crv were were ok.

the xterra i thought looked the coolest, and had some nice features - but the couple i test drove handled like crap. don't know if it's the suspension they have or what, but they felt stiff and akward.

i was most impressed w/ how the sante fe drove but they would not make a deal w/ me so i went for my next choice, the ford escape.

when i went to buy it they had an explorer that was a show room model that had 5,000 miles on it. i bought the explorer in the end b/c they cut me a really good deal on it.

anyway, my advice is to test drive the hell out of those SUVs! don't limit yourself to those 3 initial choices. take a couple days and test drive everything you can get your [little white] butt in to.
last edited: 1/22/05 6:54:51 PM”

“And I know that Fords have been known to have, how you say...QA issues in the past, but I'm kinda riding the fact that the Escape is actually a Mazda Tribute from the Pre-Ford days, that's just dressed up as a Ford. Besides, it looks kinda cool.

Also, they have very affordable extended warranties for these cars, which helps to offset the somwhat skimpy 36/36 factory warranty.”

“yea i was thinking the ford escape as well but i heard from a few people that they have a lot of problems. i guess i'll test drive as many as i can.. thanks sacco!”

“Here's my number one recommendation, It's going to be my wife's replacement for her worn out Toyota 4Runner.

”

“We had an Escape.
My wife crashed it while I was busy Freezing My Ass Off last year.

It is roomy enough to take four six-foot-plus guys and rucksacks and boots to West Virginia and back in relative comfort.

And it would get 27-28 mpg.

The rear seat is comfortable for tall people.

I slept in the front passenger seat, reclined, a few times......not bad at all.....enough room to stretch my legs out....I'm 6' 4".

Mine was front-drive with 2.0 four cylinder 130 hp engine and five-speed.

It is a feisty little engine that will cruise at 75-80 easily.

The car is 365 pounds lighter without the four-wheel drive stuff.

To my mind a five-speed is a must for mountain driving.

With snow chains I took that buggy in and out of most anywhere in eight inches of snow.

It has good clearance for forest service roads.

My brother-in-law bought one with a 3.0 V-6 and auto-trans(five-speed is only available with the 2.0 four-cylinder).

He says he is lucky to get 20 mpg, usually less.....and that is without four-wheel-drive.

The radio/CD player was very nice.

The base model is what I had.
last edited: 1/22/05 7:16:26 PM”

“Honda CR-Vs are awesomely built. Look at almost anyone's vehicle ratings and they shine.

Subaru has some AWD vehicles (Forester and Outback) that are sort of sedan/SUV hybrids.

Popular Mechanics had an article comparing Hybrids to Diesels and included a couple SUVs. I'll try to remember to look for it at home.”

“hey it's a great time to be in the market, too.

this is when (2 years ago) i got the deal on my explorer. some places will still have show room 2004 models they'll want to get rid of bad. so if you go to as many places as possible you might get lucky too.”

“I've never had a Toyota that didn't run forever with little to no repair costs.”

“Hondas and Toyotas are usually excellent cars.”

“I'm semi-looking right now too. It'll be awhile before I actually make a purchase (probably May). I have a 98 4-runner. I'm looking at the new ones and also the Subraru Outback. I really like the Toyota Tundra, but am pretty sure that's out of my price range. I love my 4-runner but it's time to update.”

“yea i'm seriously leaning towards the CRV or toyota rav4.

i don't need anything big and the gas mileage on the xterra is really bad (some reviews say as low as 15mpg... ugh.) although i really like the style of the xterra, the gas mileage is a lot more reasonable with the other 2.”

“My wife's 1995 Toyota 4Runner has 275,000 miles on it, and we're still waiting for it to give up the ghose so we can justify sending it to Toyota heaven.”

“I don't trust the Subaru "boxer" engines.

I've heard too many of them suckin' wind with semi-blown head gaskets.”

“just don't ever get a mitsubishi. ALL mitsubishi's suck.”

“The Mitsubishi A6M Zero was pretty good.”

“

that's why you still see them everywhere too.
LMAO I really dislike Mitsubishi”

“I have a 2003 RAV4 and love it. The other day I just calculated the mileage I was getting...27 highway. Not too shabby. The only thing I regret is that I didn't get 4WD. My girlfriend bought a CRV around the same time as I bought the RAV. They are pretty comparable except that there seems to be more leg room in the rear seat of the CRV and I like the way the CRV's dash is set up better. It has better storage compartment designs, at least when you compare 2003 models. Don't know what they are like now.”

“Dang Gemmie, I would love to test drive one of these!!
http://www.flugwerk.com/new/diary/bild14.shtm

Some dudes in Germany are building twelve of these, brand new!

It has a 42 liter, 1900 horsepower engine!

Top speed is about 400mph/635kmph!!

How TF do you post a photo?
last edited: 1/22/05 8:00:39 PM”

“What timing. I have been thinking about getting rid of the truck and going with a small SUV.

I drove a CRV. Not enough power, but it had more room than Escape. Lots of cool ergonomic features. The Escape 6 cylinder had plenty of power. Drove a Subaru Forester. It was quicker than the CRV, but not as good top end as the Escape. I heard the Exterra was a bad handling vehicle, but I have not driven one yet. The Escape seems to be the favorite right now.”

“gas mileage? hahahahahahahahha

we're talking a 4x4 suv. First off I would recomend the V6 in almost any model. The 4 banger is nice but in many cases eats marginally more gas then the 4cyl but has a much larger gain in power. In a 4x4 you want to have low end torque. That's what gets you out of the ditch when you get stuck.

My mom has an explorer, similar to an escape. It rides nice on pavment and grips good in the slick. I've had it sideways a few times through the turns and it handled like a champ. I probably wouldn't take it off road tho. Low ground clearence and IRS say no trail use.

I would actually recomend the X-terra for a few reasons. First is the optional V6 (4L only option in 05). Also it's the only one mentioned with a solid rear axle. They are much stronger and less prone to roll over then the IRS. X-terras are also of the old school breed of suv's. They are truck frames with a suv shell. They are not unibody like many of the StreetUtilityVehicals (ahem HONDA ahem). They are made to take off road and will survive it well. They also offer manual locking front hubs as a factory option (warn hubs i believe), which any off roader will tell you is a must. If you plan on any off roading, even driving light trails, I'd stick with the X-terra. It might be slightly more truck then you need, but I would always rather have more then I need when I need it, then not have enough.

basicly the honda SUV and even the escape are not meant to take off road. Hence the switch to the push button AWD systems and the swing away from such features as manual T-cases and manual hubs.

and stop worryin about gas milage. I'm down to 15 highway...on 93 octane....and i'm surviving.”

“The 2005 Escape is 4X4 all the time. The suspension is the toughest I have looked at, but I have not looked under the X-terra yet. The Escape has an extended skid plate.”

“I have no interest in going "off-road".
Have fun if you do.

4.0 liter in a small SUV is overkill and when the price of gas goes up, and it will, look out.

15 mpg is way too much gas to be burning.”

“If you never go off road, how can you say that 4.0 is overkill?”

“yea...and she said that she plans on using it to get to trail heads and the like. One of the big reasons's she's getting rid of her current car is lack of power. Why replace it with something that's going to be just as bad, but be heavier.

I've never considered a 4-cyl in a 4x4 a good idea. They don't have the torque to make 4wd usefull.”

“After driving 4X4's all day I have to agree with deathmarch, but then my current vehicle is 5.4L”

“bacpac, you come on the thread and look what you do.. start an suv war. jk.


anyway,.. i'm very indecisive right now. will probably test drive all of the above mentioned (rav4, xterra, escape, and crv) and hold off on making a decision right away... think it over and do a little more research after test driving it.

gas mileage is a big deal to me as i'm poor : )”

“Scorch, before you buy any SUV compare insurance rates since that may have some impact on your decision.
RAV4's cost a little more to insure because body damage is expensive to fix and low speed rear end collisions do extensive damage. That can probably be said for many other SUV's too since many have spare tires hanging off the back.
If I did it over again I would have taken my time and taken more vehicles out for test drives. In the end, I choose between a CRV and the RAV4. I have mixed feelings about the RAV4, while it does some things well, it has a few things I don't like and has had some initial quality issues that I was disappointed with. It has settled down now, but I'm still not sure I want to keep it long term. I bought the RAV over the CRV because I thought Toyota quality was better and the RAV4 is supposed to have a better 4WD system. The CRV is bigger, but back seats in the RAV can be removed for more room, so I just leave them out since I usually don't have passengers. The CRV has some issues with engine fires, due mainly from a stuck gasket on the oil filter. I think they have the fix for the problem, but the insurance may have gone up because of it or worse resale value may go down. I didn't see evidence of that yet, but I watch some Honda forums just to get the latest news. I'm trying to get as much info myself because if I decide not to keep my RAV I may trade for a CRV, Element or something else. I wish I took my time when I was buying the last time.”

“The best gas mileage I calculated on the RAV4 was 28.3 MPG on the highway. For short trips in the city with cold weather expect as low as 20 MPG.”

“Sorry scorchie. I really liked the Honda, but it was not available with a 6 cylinder. That was the deal breaker. A 4 cylinder is peppy off the lot, but in two or three years they have been wound too tight too many times to keep up the pace. An 8 cylinder is just two extra spark plugs to change.

My heart has always been for the six.”

“so your talking about buying a CUV right? smaller then an SUV”

“Rich, that is so on target. As I was waiting for a price for my trade in, another salesman was discussing Quick Lube leaving/stacking oil gaskets and loosing oil pressure. And that it would be worth the extra effort/cost to have Honda change the oil. I thought the dude was talking crap, but there apparently is a liability issue.

I have had gaskets stick to the engine, but even I could tell there was a problem when I tried to put in the new filter.”

“A 4.0 liter engine would be overkill for ME, bbw.

If you guys want to play in the mud, knock yourself out.

I am not interested in going off-road with my family car and I cannot afford such a toy.

When I go off-road it is with two-foot-drive.......vrooom...... vrooom......meep-meep!!”

“Many CRV's have caught fire and there's an ongoing investigation to find out why. The oil filter is supposedly located above the exhaust pipe so when a leak occurs the vehicle can catch fire. Some people barely escaped when the vehicle burned. That's why I mentioned the insurance because I would think the insurance companies would start raising rates for CRV's. I still like the CRV and wish they would fix whatever it is. It's scheduled for a total redesign in 2006 from what I've been reading.
last edited: 1/22/05 10:33:32 PM”

“rich, thanks for your input. i have to look into insurance rates for sure. my best friend actually just bought a CRV recently and her insurance went down 33 dollars.... maybe due to the 4WD? the alarm system she got with it? i don't know too much about car insurance, so i couldn't really guess.

28mpg is pretty good for an SUV. currently i have a little toy car called the toyota echo. it gets 35/41 so i'm pretty much spoiled in that respect.

bbw, you're right. i still don't think the CRV has the option of 6 cyl. and that was/is a downfall to me.”

“and of course the catching on fire is also a slight downfall.”

“Loved the CRV. Just not enough top end power. The picnic table under the hatch and the shift on the dash were my favorite features. It had plenty of room too.”

“The CRV was about $100 less per year to insure than the RAV4 for me. That was last June so I'm not sure what it is now. CRV's only come with a 4 cylinder engine. Since the vehicles are lighter the 4 cylinder has enough power for me, but I don't drive off road. Today, I tried to get stuck in the snow driving up hills my van would never make, the RAV4 did well in that respect.

CRV's come standard with side air bags. I think they are still optional with Toyota.”

“I would avoid an automatic, they are a pain-in-the-ass for mountain driving......always shifting up and down.”

“you better buy one that will not go off the side of a mountain!!!
been there done that!”

“You two are a hazard”

“oh c'mon. we lived through it.”

“i don't know how to drive manual. everyone who i've tried getting to teach me refuses to let me learn on their car.”

“no way will i let you learn on my car. sorry but i love my clutch to much”

“.....she says as she clutches at herself.”

“see? that's what i'm saying.”

“http://www.womanmotorist.com/index.php/welcome

Lots of info here. I have a Toyota Highlander and the reason I bought it was it was very highly rated for safety, and they run forever.

Good luck”

“I would avoid an automatic, they are a pain-in-the-ass for mountain driving......always shifting up and down.”
MarkO
10:47:11 PM
1/22/05

That is the difference, between a four and six cylinder.”

“Jeep Cherokee's are the way to go. But I think the best mileage I ever got was 22mpg, but then again I never, ever got stuck or broke down. 169,000 miles and still going which is way more than we got from our blazer or explorer.
last edited: 1/22/05 11:10:01 PM”