Bush to open 34.3 million acres to loggi ng/mining

“http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-05-05-forest-roads_x.htm

This man makes me sick. And I feel soooo helpless. He is an unstoppable force it seems.”

“The category you choose for your thread is very important on how it will be displayed on Trail Talk. Please make a valiant effort. General topics about the outdoors and other friendly topics that everyone enjoys should be put under the General Backpacking/Outdoors/Fun category. All political and religion threads should be placed under Fuego. thebackpacker.com reserves the right to edit, delete and re-categorize any thread.

It's a dirty job, but someone has to be the Nanny around here. LOL

I'm not picking on you bionicear, just a reminder as you are kinda new here. A lot of people here don't wish to 'hear' the political threads so matt set up the Fuego category for them.
last edited: 5/05/05 10:20:49 PM”

“There was not a category I felt was apropriate. I didn't see anything called "fuego". My apologies. You don't have to be mean.”

“mean? Under TT standards that was so sweet I had a cavity form in my eye just from reading it.”

“It's the last little fire icon.
You select it by clicking the last drop down category 'Fuego' under Thread Category:
I'm sorry if you felt I was being mean, that was not my intent.
last edited: 5/05/05 10:26:26 PM”

“s s just has to be an ass some times.I think it may have to do with his childhood.go here bionic ear www.earthliberationfront.com”

“ELF is a terrorist org that makes legit environmentalists' jobs even harder. ELF makes headlines, but they seldom make progress. Unless you call burning down a resort in Vail or a Hummer dealership progress. Which I do not. Electing earth friendly officials is the only way to obtain sustainable protection. Like Clinton tried to do just before leaving office in 2001. But as we are now seeing, if an a-hole (bush) wants to reverse what his predicesor did...he can...and will.”

“LOL@OObrett
eco-terrorism is his answer

Nice hairdo dude!
last edited: 5/05/05 10:56:17 PM”

“action not words. as we see all we have here is words,right stovie?”

“this is why it is feugo. You spout idiocy and expect no one to call you on it. If Clinton cared about the environment he would have done those things you are lauding him for at an earlier point in his 8 years that would have had a lasting affect instead of a little boy spiteful prank right at the last second.”

“you should see it up close stovie then make a comment,but you fall into the words not action catagory right?”

“brett, would it be ok for SS to burn your house down since you demand he take action?”

“would it be ok for you to shut the f*** up? did i speak to you directly?”

“That was a compliment dude.”

“And what part of what I was spouting is idiotic?

Clinton's midterm record was not stellar, but he ended on a high note. You have to remember that Congress was controlled by the Pubs after 1994, thus making his job very difficult. He sidestepped many Congressional debates by enacting the national parks act of 1906, first implemented by Teddy Rosevelt. Clinton had a mixed record, but compromise is necessary. A heavy hand never wins.

How many acres has ELF increased our national parks by?
last edited: 5/05/05 11:07:23 PM”

“Leftists are so violent.”

“sorry, didn't know you were holding the talking stick.”

“Leftists are violent? Ummmm ooookaaaayyy. Need I remind who is sending my friends to Iraq right now to destroy stuff and get killed?”

“Clinton only did what he did out of spite. He knew they would all be reversed the first week Bush (or any other President, dem or rep) was in office.”

“I was talking to OObrett, bionicear.”

“My kingdom for a "quote" option. That would make thing a bit easier.”

“some times violence is the only thing that gets people to notice what the hell is happening to our national forest and parks. as i have said on this site before ,apathy is rampant.when our national forest are gone what will you do about it?whine on a internet post?i don't think that will accomplish very much do you? and if you have all the knowledge about this issue hyway why don't you enlighten this rest of us?”

“bionicear, SS is behaving nicely, if he was like Brett he would have said “would it be ok for you to shut the f*** up? did i speak to you directly?”

BTW, I hope you don't hold grudges, I try, but I just can't manage to be serious on here.”

““Clinton only did what he did out of spite. He knew they would all be reversed the first week Bush (or any other President, dem or rep) was in office.”

Not true. His last ditch efforts were done in good faith that his succesor would do the right thing. Clinton did many things during his 8 years that have benefited the environment, and continue to do so. Like he directed the Environmental Protection Agency to combat environmental racism. Pinnacles in central California, was enlarged by nearly 8,000 acres. Under EPA rules approved during Clinton's era, diesel fuel sold in the United States must be sulfur-free by 2010. etc etc etc.”

“bionicear, the reason you should mark these type threads as Feugo is because you won't be convinced to change your opinion and others won't either, so they end up be long winded diatribes that only partisan bickerers like to read. The rest of us just turn off the fuego threads and are free to be niave and ignorant.
last edited: 5/05/05 11:20:21 PM”

“This kinda crap just bumms me out!”

“you mean you like to be apathetic ,right?”

““bionicear, the reason you should mark these type threads as Feugo is because you won't be convinced to change your opinion and others won't either, so they end up be long winded diatribes that only partisan bickerers like to read. The rest of us just turn off the fuego threads and are free to be niave and ignorant."

I assumed that we would all have a common bond in that we all enjoy the wilderness the way it is...wild. Maybe some of you would enjoy hiking in a dusty plain, but not me. I enjoy trees and drinkable water not polluted by mining runoff. Sorry to ruffle your feathers. I was imply trying to inform all of you about an upcoming assault on our playground.”

“LOL
You know what they say about assuming.... ;-)”

“So were all asses now I reckon. Cool. Long as I have good company.”

“Nite nite, you children play nice. ;-)
Work calls tomorrow.”

“[chanting] Fue-go... Fue-go...”

“Hi there, Oobrett!!! I haven't seen you in a long time, but I was down your way a couple weeks ago. I assume you're good these days? ;)”

“i try to be ruby but i have to admit some times i just can't help sounding like an a**hole how are calvin & hobbs? they keeping you as busy?”

“You know it! We leave early in the morning for Red River Gorge for the weekend.

You crack me up, OObrett. Hope Mrs. C is doing well as well as the kiddies.”

“i so can not wait for the end of shrubs term it is our only hope”

“guilty for what my grandchildren will inherit.

China Tibet Nepal...
Alaska, "eco" tourism...

Now I'm depressed, thanks alot guys now I have to hit the trail this weekend to make myself feel almost humane again.”

“it's times like these that make me glad i don't have any children.

don't know how all you guys with kids sleep at night knowing they'll inherit this place.”

“So Hyway, SS, you seem intent to criticise Clinton for not doing this in a way that Bush could easily repeal? Bush didn't have to lift the restrictions. Though I guess once he's taken the money from the lobbiests, logging, mining and energy interests then it would be wrong of him not to deliver what they want.

So SS, Hyway - Bush did the right thing by lifting this protection then?”

“Burn it! Burn it all!”

“(said in joking manner)
Y2 - Get your facts straight ya commie pinko! ;-)


I have not said anything about Clinton on this thread. As a matter of fact, I have not said anything political about this at all other than the 'leftists are so violent' comment.
Reading comprehension needed here.
last edited: 5/06/05 9:39:43 AM”

“y2, do you really believe what Clinton did was done because he cares about the environment? I figure you for an astute, connected person and would think you would no bull#&%!$ when you saw it from a politician. His last days in office were an out and out money grab and he didn't care who saw it.”

“Not true. His last ditch efforts were done in good faith that his succesor would do the right thing. Clinton did many things during his 8 years that have benefited the environment, and continue to do so.
bionicear

"President Clinton has done more to harm the environment and to weaken environmental regulations in three years than presidents Bush and Reagan did in 12 years". Former Sierra Club President David Brower

Yeah right, do you ever wonder why they were last ditch efforts? Clinton's proposals were made at the last minute because they were controversial, very very costly, and also without sound science (an effective scientific legislation cannot be written over night) and essentially only for political gain. Each of these last second proposals occupied because he could not put together a group of Democrats and a few Republicans, to get them passed. By no means could these policies be considered bipartisan. Yes, Clinton did do some nice environmental things. However, so much of his environmental legacy was nothing more than lip service. As an environmental scientist I’m really tired of this whole media circus as classifying a President as green. Sorry, but we have never had an environmental President nor is there an environmental party. Laws and legislation can be passed and removed all the day long. Doesn't mean anything really changes. I for one believe expecting an administration to make a difference in the environment is useless. It should at lest be on a state, county, or local level. Who has to live with the legislation after all is said and done.

How soon we forget or maybe it was never reported:

Supported mountain top removal strip mining.

Signed the Salvage Rider law which cut down thousands of acres of healthy forests and considered one of the worst environmental policies in ever written.

Lowered grazing fees on public land.

Clinton and Gore's promise to shut down the East Liverpool incinerator known for spewing toxins into the air a few hundred yards away from a school, never happened after the election.

Funding of mass transit heavily decline under this administration.

Clinton ended the ban on production and importation of PCBs.

Supported the weakening of the safe drinking water act by allowing increased levels of arsenic and lead in drinking water.

Continued to heavily subsidize the sugar industry in Florida that continues to poisons the Everglades & diverts water away from wildlife that needs it.

Supported the World Trade Organization, which weakened or removed environmental protections, including the weakening of the clean air act and the removal of part of the Endangered Species act's protection of sea turtles.
last edited: 5/06/05 11:24:41 AM”

“My understanding is that the new policy simply leaves control in the hands of the states vs. the federal gov't to decide where logging is appropriate.

I understand that most of us would prefer to see those lands protected, but in the political debate lets not misrepresent what the new policy is.”

“Fritz, it would be unnatural for most Bush critics to let the facts get in the way of the accusations.”

“oh please.

we should allow the states to control NATIONAL forestlands?

especially since most of the land in question lies within RED states?

gimme a friggin break. do you actually think bush did this b/c he believes it's states rights/federal issue?

don't you think the millions he recieves from logging and mining interest groups had something to do with his choice?”

“LOL @ mtn gal
Good point!”

“sacco, some can't see the forest for the trees but you will be able to now”

“ewk, somewhere, there's a good pun response about seeing the shrub for the scum he is, but i'm too wrapped up in the TTer game thread to think it up”

“Burn it! Burn it all!”
Bison
9:27:32 AM
5/06/05
ignore this user


Always liked that Reagan Era joke about his Secretary of the interior.

How much energy does it take to burn all the forests? One Watt (James)”