The destruction of New Orleans?

“Gee...I distinctly remember that the roads were at first so covered with debris and downed electrical wires you could not go very far at all...certainly not by car...and then the roads...where me and my family were...were blocked off for rescue vehicles only...once they had mobilized. Gee, in fact, we too had to wait for help and supplies...at least a week. Some people looted. The poor and ignorant and those who IMHO only serve to drain society.

People stranded on roofs are trapped.

People able to run rampent and loot like a bunch of thugs? Doesn't sound trapped to me. Basic supplies - okay, I sympathise. Extravagent items and guns and setting #&%!$ on fire? Ha. Shoot em.

Fear is fear. And many people are much better equipped to deal with these situations...and are able to think of the big picture and not only of their own selfishness.

These people knew this would happen. They were told to leave. If they choose to stay they should have had a hurricane preparedness stash. If you live in the tropics or along hurricane paths - you should use your brain and be prepared.

That's all I'm going to say on this matter...I'd rather use this energy and be proactive in getting help to those people who need it and are not acting like a bunch of friggin' fear-mongerin' animals.”

“for that matter, the state of virginia issued a state of emergency today to activate their national guard to assist. this will also allow them to send DOT crews/equipment to help rebuild the infrastructure when the time comes.”

“Update on the news, say people seem to be shooting at the helicopters. They sound like criminals to me. Who thinks to steal guns when they need food and water? Not people with morals. Having an unlicensed gun will get you jail time and is a much more severe offense than stealing to feed your family.

Maybe I heard wrong, because it's hard to believe, but people are waiting in droves near a hospital for "goods" and two truck loads were hijacked two blocks before the hospital.

One story had a brother shoot his sister over a bag of ice.
last edited: 9/01/05 3:57:49 PM”

“Suddenly, three days after a Cat 5 hurricane strikes a city that lies below sea level, it suddenly dawns on the White House that a federal response is needed???

Geobeet
3:32:24 PM

You make a good point that our federal emergency agencies could be activated more rapidly. However, how rapidly is very relative. We do a great job as comparied to any other country. FEMA alone is short handed and still reeling from last seasons hurricanes. Also, one of the falicies such a large organization is the lag time to be activated instantly. One of the largest mistakes that made was that all experts just before the storm hit declared besides MS NO would be spaired. Until late tuesday most of FEMA efforts were focused east of NO. The hurrican was only the spark that set off the series of events that has led to this tradegy in NO. Under no administration has federal emergency agencies been prepared to do more than react on a large scale effort.”

““Update on the news, say people seem to be shooting at the helicopters. They sound like criminals to me. Who thinks to steal guns when they need food and water? Not people with morals. Having an unlicensed gun will get you jail time and is a much more severe offense than stealing to feed your family.

Maybe I heard wrong, because it's hard to believe, but people are waiting in droves near a hospital for "goods" and two truck loads were hijacked two blocks before the hospital.

One story had a brother shoot his sister over a bag of ice.
last edited: 9/01/05 4:57:49 PM”
lipstick hiker
4:57:09 PM
9/01/05
ignore this user

I don’t think everyone who stole guns did so to wreak havoc. If I was put in the same situation these people are in, I think I would probably steal a gun to try and protect my family.”

“SC, by law the military can only be used in situations like this as a very last resort, that is what took so long...oh yea, and when you "blame" god, please make sure i'm not standing by you ;)”

“you can't blame the city of No either baume. You can't force everyone to leave. There will always be the ones who want to stay. Where are you gonna drag them to? Are you gonna risk more lives to drag out the ones who want to stay behind? Plus there was no way out. No planes,trains or automobiles (sounds like a movie doesn't it ;))

The city had built up precautions from the last big Hurricane. This past June the Corp of Eng had funding pulled from them about studying the effect a Cat 5 hurricane would have on NO. (someone posted a link to that) So they were trying to do things. Needless to say there study is now 1st hand experience. The flooding came about due to the levee's breaking down.

NO will try to rebuild. They will take what they have learned and put it hopefully to good use.
last edited: 9/01/05 4:12:47 PM”

“Nobody blames Bubya for the disaster. But the response should have been ramped up over the weekend so assets were in place to respond the minute the hurricane passed. This didn't exactly fall out of the sky unannounced with no prior warning. Once Katrina passed Florida and got into the Gulf, it was announced that it would become a powerful storm.

Those 28,000 troops are not yet in place. They may be on the move at this point, but again, too little too late. It will take a lot more than 28,000.

Could they have predicted the extent of damage? Probably not, but again, a Cat 5 storm heading toward a city under sea level, ... hello, ...

Fact was, the extent of damage was predicted before the storm hit. Exactly what happened was what was predicted on Sunday morning, including a mix of toxic chemicals and disease due to flooding from levee failure. That was Sunday morning - 24 hours before the storm hit. There was enough time for 80 percent of the population of New Orleans to evacuate in an orderly fashion, even given jammed highways.

But not enough time for the federal government to get on the stick???”

“What's happened along the gulf coast, not only in New Orleans, is an intensity and a paradigm shift which the rest of us have never experienced. It's beyond the comprehension of those of us not involved.

I will not throw stones or cast judgement, for who knows what my actions would be in such a situation.

We are animals at our core.
someone said this earlier, I'm repeating it)
Not much seperates the US from a third world country. (espically when you take away our elecricity, internet, and tv)”

“I'm not sure how I feel about the timeliness of our government's response to this catastrophy.

But I do wonder what role class and race has played with this particular situation. Of course, the poor black will also wonder, and so will the NAACP.

I understand that circumstances are much different than any other disaster we have experienced, at least in my lifetime.

All of this is just unimaginable to me. I am a firm believer in "things happen for a reason" and this could possibly be another natural way to rid of pests, be it people, places or things.

For those who were criminals, poor and living in poverty before Katrina, I hope to God they take heed to this possible chance to turning their lives around.”

“This certainly would of made a great summer book to read.

To survive the hurricane but die from the aftermath, thats what really would suck.

The coming forced evalcuation of New Orleans will make the lootings quite insignificant in comparison. Most all that loot will be bull-dozed and whether it was in the stores or the the looter residences, it just doesnt matter.

..and the KILLER MOLD to come will wipe 99.93% of the Population of the world......”

“...and the choosen few will be shot to the center of the earth via a raucous fart emmanating out of the Wizard of Oz's arsehole.”

“My partner in Tuscaloosa (4.5 hrs from NO) said she picked her daughter up from school today and a teary eyed mother was enrolling her two kids in school. The mother was from NO and evidently wound up here in the evac.”

“Wolfeyes,

I would have said that earlier, but I didn't want to think it.

It does make you wonder.”

“Anyone know how goods can be donated? I see Red Cross only accepts funds.”

“twinkle, everything i've read or heard discourages sending goods except water...they say they need cash more than anything
last edited: 9/01/05 4:45:59 PM”

“What about first aide kits, tarps, clothing and shoes, canned foods, toiletries, bedding, etc..?

Trying to both funds and good sent..”

“i know some local organizations like churches and such are taking goods but from what i understand the national ones just want cash”

“The guy I car pool with has a family member who is a superintendent of school in Eufala (Souther Alabama town). He said they have alost 100 new students signing up for school the past two days.”

“100, wow, and that's Eufala. You can't get there from here. Not exactly an obvious evac route. If Eufala has that many then Tuscaloosa, B'ham, and Anniston will be flooded since it's a direct route by interstate.”

“Twinkle Toes,
You could donate money to the Red Cross and donate the other stuff to a local charity such as a homeless shelter. I'm sure there are plenty of people in your area that could us things like first aide kits, tarps, clothing and shoes, canned foods, toiletries, bedding, etc.”

“New Orleans - this is what we would have to look forward to in a terrorist attack? Nice job GWB, way to prepare our emergency services.”

“I do wonder what the terrorists are thinking at this point, also. Not like we are giving them proof of any weak spots or anything...”

“wolfeyes, I thought about that earlier this week when the Fox News went on and on about how important NO is to our economy since is the 5th largest port in the world.”

“um...did we just get timewarped? I could have sworn there was a feud going on between Sarge, Chili and some other silly folk? Did I post on the wrong thread or were we *gasp!!* censored?”

“i just gave $20 to red cross. the way people are acting, im tempted to go ask 4 it back.
last edited: 9/01/05 5:10:24 PM”

“well said twinkle...CB, HA...i beat you, i gave $30”

“well then, im going to ask for your 30 back”

“I hear ya on that one CB! I defintely am shaking my head at the way some people are acting after having lost everything, and then trying to bite the hands that are trying to save them to feed them.”

“well then, im going to ask for your 30 back

...touché”

““Nobody blames Bubya for the disaster. But the response should have been ramped up over the weekend so assets were in place to respond the minute the hurricane passed. This didn't exactly fall out of the sky unannounced with no prior warning. Once Katrina passed Florida and got into the Gulf, it was announced that it would become a powerful storm.

Those 28,000 troops are not yet in place. They may be on the move at this point, but again, too little too late. It will take a lot more than 28,000.

Could they have predicted the extent of damage? Probably not, but again, a Cat 5 storm heading toward a city under sea level, ... hello, ...

Fact was, the extent of damage was predicted before the storm hit. Exactly what happened was what was predicted on Sunday morning, including a mix of toxic chemicals and disease due to flooding from levee failure. That was Sunday morning - 24 hours before the storm hit. There was enough time for 80 percent of the population of New Orleans to evacuate in an orderly fashion, even given jammed highways.

But not enough time for the federal government to get on the stick???”
Geobeet
4:14:46 PM

The company I work for holds a large FEMA contract. All those things you mentioned occurred. The response was ramped up even before the weekend so assets were in place to respond the minute the hurricane passed. Yes, it was known that she was going to be a powerful storm however; the last thing emergency management officials wanted was to be a part of the disaster. And your belief that 28K troops should have already been in place is quiet unreasonable. The logistics alone are near impossible and quiet frankly ineffective before action is required. That's the reasoning behind emergency assessments. No one knew what we would actually be facing. Please specifically explain to me how the reaction is any different than under any other administration? As bad as I dislike him, Rush was right on predicting that this will somehow become Bush's fought in the left's eyes.
last edited: 9/01/05 5:26:47 PM”

“save your breath trailhound...some people just want to point fingers”

“Ya'll could come help me, 4 churches in my area have gotten together and 3 of them are opened as shelters, I was originally assigned to one the churches to work by the Red Cross (I trained as a shelter worker)but know have been put in charge of accepting and sorting donations at the 4 th church. We got 300 people in the first 12 hours we were open, we're in NW Houston. Most of our refugees are people who left NO, planning on being gone for just a few days, now they have nothing left but what they are carrying.”

“Maybe all the critics can form their own business that specializes in rapid response to disasters and do a better job. Its obvious that some just seem to know so much more than the professionals.”

“Can you imagine what would happen if we ever had to go back to the days of taking care of ourselves and our neighbors? We'd be extinct in no time flat.”

“Ahhhhhh, Birch has touched on something here. Think about it, Republicans despise public institutions, whether it's FEMA or your public schools. They want to privatize all of these entities, so if an organization like FEMA looks bad due to lack of funding, it plays into thier hands, and Joe's idea..... privatize the industry, so rich people can make a profit, and we pay more.

Now let's further explore Joe's idea. If you privatize an organization like FEMA, and have private contractors located throughout the country poised to service a disaster area, many bad things could go wrong. 1st and foremost is the high prices that we taxpayers will be charged without oversight. A good example is Halliburton in Iraq. Much of what Halliburton is doing is what the Army and Army Corp. of Engineers normalloy would do. We pay more for private companies to do the work. 2nd is the quality of service you'll get. How many of these private disaster relief companies will go out of business when two years go by without a need for them. Hell, we'll have nothing!

Privatization of basic essential indsutries like disaster relief, education, energy and healthcare is dangerous and not cost effective. You'd think taxpayers would learn from Halliburton, Enron & Ohio's worthless Charter Schools, yet the sheep keep comin' to the sheerer.”

“BB, youd politicize a bowl of chicken soup!”

“Chickhawk soup?”

“And here I thought birch was trying to gently show that belly aching and blame placing are completely unconstructive. Turns out this whole time he was running some kind of psychological republican shell game on my ass. Trying to suggest that private rich companies take over the government in order to get fatter and richer.

Birch you slick bassturd you!”

“Chicken Soup is the evil food scheme of republicans to ween people into taking needless drugs. They say chicken soup will cure a cold, but after you take it, and your cold remains, you'll go out and buy pharmaceuticals. Litttle does the citizen know that the chicken soup would have taken effect in 24 hours.”

“Its obvious that some just seem to know so much more than the professionals.”
birch
6:02:28 PM
9/01/05

you wouldn't have said something like that about some of your bosses would you ;)”

“Tango, I like that you can choose exactly where your money will go too. My wife and I are giving up eating out until everyone goes back home.”

“That's great Nigal. I only wish I ate out so I could give it up.”

“Ewker, LOL nope not me...at least not in a loooooong time.

No one is talking about privatizing anything BB. FEMA does an amazing job. My dad worked with them last year in FLA forhurricane relief and had nothing but compliments about their abilities. Give your legs a rest from all of the jumping to conclusions you have been doing.”

“still no word from my brother, I am thinking of making a road-trip down there this weekend. he lives in an RV and is a cop in new orleans. that's gotta be the worst profile ...”

“I've heard some scary things about FEMA. They are said to be the most powerful government entity and under the right conditions could do just about anything they want and operate outside the law if need be.”

“I think I might give some money to a Detroit-based charity.

I know the need is really bad in NO.

But I was driving through Detroit a few weeks ago and there are many sections that don't look too different from what's on the TV right now from the South. Maybe minus the water.

And I think that lots of the NO victims were trapped before this hurricane came. And that's why I think it is and will be difficult to make this situation better.

But if we, as a nation, concentrate billions of dollars, troops and massive effort at a troubled city, good can come out of this. Maybe it took a hurricane to bring this area to public consciousness.

How do you connect public services and infrastructure to an area that didn't really probably have it in the first place?”

“So... Tango gives it up every night?”