Gay Marriage Bill in California

“This is why I ended up agreeing with Arnold as I understood him ( apologies to friends of Bill W) to say: If it's unconsitutional, then the courts should be the one's to say. If not, the decision should be made with respect to the Democratic process (not a quote but my attempt to summarize).

There are safeguards in our constitution as nded and in the State constitution that protect the rights of minorities.

Slavery does pose an extreme issue. There are many infringements on human rights that are more extreme or more fundamental than a system of permanent human ownership. In situations that are that extreme, extreme measures are probably justified. I don't think a statute that would allow for domestic partnership rights, but which denies the term marraige to gays rises to close to that level.

Personally, I think domestic partneships should be allowed between any two people, and that sex and gender should be entirely left out of the regulations. There should be a set of of rights and obligations that are conferred on partners who contract to take them on.

I don't want government involved in defining marriage at all. My marriage means a lot to me, more than I could convey in a post - but the fact that the Minister who married us sent the certificate off to government officials who registered it means very little. If he'd filed in the basement of the church I would feel just as married.

If the government is going to define marriage, my vote is to include same sex couples who commit to take on the obligations of marriage. I can't say that it's as important to me as is it is to a lot of people.”

“pedxing, the only problem I have with what you said is that if you suggest government shouldn't define marriage, then why do YOU personally think it should be limited it to a "couple"?”

“Crash Bang, we are obviously talking about the "Constitution", no? If they outlawed all religions except one, then it wouldn't even be the United States of America as we know it and our guiding Constitution would be null and void. Of course it would be wrong and illegal. But that has nothing to do with gay marriage, which is a social issue, not a Constitional "rights" issue.”

“That bill is soooooooo gay.”

“Buck, good question. To be honest, it gets complicated when you get beyond two adults (how would the others share responsibility?) - I'm not sure if it would work. I have no problem with it in principle - if it could work, why not? It seems easier to just say that once its more than two adults, that other categories like dependents (if one or more are disabled), cooperatives, bussinesses be set up. Certainly employers wouldn't want to provide health insurance for 10 adults in a domestic partnership just becuase they employed one of them.

Note that for my purposes - this has nothing to do with sex. Sure most people who use it would probably be sexually involved, but it would also be available to anyone (for example two divorced or un-married siblings who inherit their parent's house and agree to share the house and take care of each other).

We recognize families now, but for many purposes people are not part of the family after the reach 18, 19, 21 or finish college.
last edited: 9/09/05 2:01:12 PM”

“pedxing, it would just seem that a bisexual who is very much in love with a man and a woman, and who is physically and romantically inclined to both, would be forced to choose only one for the rest of their life in regards to sharing their life in legal marriage.”

“You need to find another example Crash because gay marraige and religion aren't on the same level.

its called an analogy, and its very appropriate because both sexuality and religion are tied very closely to our deeply-ingrained sense of identity.

“Crash Bang, we are obviously talking about the "Constitution", no?

no, im not talking about the constitution. all legalities aside, im asking how would you feel about it if something so deeply ingrained into you that it was an integral part of your identity, like religion or sexuality, was outlawed? and dont bring up goat-fvcking or NAMBLA, because being gay doesnt necessarily make you a victimizer, like goat-fcking and NAMBLA and any other slippery-slope examples you want to bring up”

“buck, i know you think the admonishment against homosexuality is an order from god, but have you ever considered that it was because of practical reasons? 4000, 5000 years ago, when humanity was little more than small bands of roaming nomads living in the wilderness, occasionally gathering in what we would consider today small cities, gay unions would have been not only very impractical, but an outrageous affront to a tribe that was fighting for its very survival and needed to produce as many offspring as possible. now there are too many people and too many breeders in this world. i think god has long since rescinded this command, if he ever issued it at all. the only arguent against homosexuality is religion, and thats pretty shaky since there is no evidence the bible or the torah or the koran is the word of god, or even that there is a god”

“ why do YOU personally think it should be limited it to a "couple"?”

i believe i shot down your (or s-rges, or somebodys) slippery slope argument a long time ago. try something different

pedxing, it would just seem that a bisexual who is very much in love with a man and a woman, and who is physically and romantically inclined to both, would be forced to choose only one for the rest of their life in regards to sharing their life in legal marriage

and your point? its a major decison that shouldnt be taken lightly by ANYBODY, gay, straight, or bi. and its a decision that people oftentimes make the wrong one. what, you suppose that bi's are going to defile marriage with their AC/DC bent cuz they wanna have their jake and edith too? wake up and get a clue. its doubtful that theyre going to do any worse than straights married couples have, with their 50 percent divorce rate, not to mention the cheating that goes on even with couples that stay together. marriage is already a joke. the gays and bi's cant mess it up more than it already is
last edited: 9/11/05 11:27:09 AM”

“I heard a great song performed live last night on this topic. Here's the you tube version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gpnqn2l_IF8&mode=related&search=”

“http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/05/15/same.sex.marriage/index.html

unconstitutional”

“Dear homophobes:

ha-ha!”

“Hey, you guys are in for a natural disaster now.

Jerry Falwell appeared to me in the form of a hairless chihuahua as I was walkin' to work this morning and told me so.

Hang on to your lug nuts, it's gonna be a bumpy ride!!”

“Validation at last!”