Don't Shop at Wal-Mart

“Pixie be damned!”

“Can I ask the name, pixie? Or is that TMI on the boards?”

“SS - I'm eating some evil Wal-Mart peanut butter Hershey kisses. bwu-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!”

“OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO....Pixie is evil.
LOL”

“I don't see why not: WestFarm Foods. We are owned by the Northwest Dairy Association (the farmers) We produce, process and supply milk and other dairy products all over WA, ID, OR and CA. Our own licensed products are Darigold, but we sell milk to large grocery stores like Safeway and Fred Meyer (Kroger) that process and package under their own name. But the raw milk all comes from our family owned dairies.
We sell milk to small cheese manufacturers.
We also produce a lot of commercial products, such as powdered milk and butter as ingredients for other companies to make their products with.
We co-package Nestle Quik drinks and CoffeMate creamers as well.”

“sounds to me like pixie is in on the dairy conspiracy to take over THE WORLD!!!

dum-dum-daaaaaaaaa!!!!!”

“You're a Co-op?”

“I think I'm in luv with that evil little capitalist running dog Pixie. ;-)”

“Bearmagnet:
Fair enough, wanderer2. let me ask you a question. I'm not sure of the answer but does it not seem like that most Companies that don't offer decent benees are ones that employ mostly uneducated or less educated people? Would unskilled be more correct?”


I'm not sure what your point is, but I would guess you're 100% correct. I would further state that that's the way I believe it SHOULD be! What we have been esposusing for the last 100 years or so is that if you worked hartd, got an education, strove to be a "cut above" in your work ethic, that the benefits would be more opportunity to get ahead, a better job opportunity, etc.

You're surely not saying that we should have equal pay for those who are less than qualified or less motivated or have less incentive to do a good job, are you?”

“Wow!! I hope that isn't what BM was insinuating. That didn't even occur to me that anyone would suggest that.”

“I'm not sure what I'm saying. Unlike most people, I go into a debate to debate, not to prove a certain point.

If what I said is true, than good benees become a class issue,no? Not everyone can get a higher education. I bet Wal Mart makes a lot more money than many Corporations that offer good benees. So profit margin can't be an issue.

I'm not talking about equal pay. I'm talking about offering decent benefits no matter who you work for.

How about this for a comparison - Marriott offers its employs great benefits. Why is Wal Mart different?”

“benefits are pay”

“I have to say, this is one of my favorite most entertaining threads of all time!!”

“I bet Wal Mart makes a lot more money than many Corporations that offer good benees. So profit margin can't be an issue.


LOL. The more I read those two statements, the funnier they are! (no offense bearmagnet, but you have to admit in hindsight ... maybe that's not what you meant)”

“Bearmagnet: "If what I said is true, than good benees become a class issue,no?

Let's keep "class" out of this, OK? "Class" has a racist sort of overtone to it, & I don't think that's what you meant.

Not everyone can get a higher education.

Bull#&%!$. Have you not heard that we have a public education system here in the US? ANYONE who obeys the law must attend school, and upon graduating from HS is more than qualified to apply for a retail job in a K-Mart, WalMart, etc. If they want a better job, they should strive to get a better education. There are a tremendous # of financial programs out there for anyone who wants a higher education.

I bet Wal Mart makes a lot more money than many Corporations that offer good benees.
SO what? Your point is????

So profit margin can't be an issue.
It's not your place to tell them what an "acceptable" profit margin is. Vote with your feet (don't shop there) or vote with your wallet (don't invest in their stock) if you don't like the company philosophy. BUT you have no business telling them how to run their business if you're not an (A) customer (B) investor (C) employee, or some other individual with some vested inteest.


I'm not talking about equal pay. I'm talking about offering decent benefits no matter who you work for.

"decent" pay is a subjective term. If anyone working there doesn't like the job / benefits, etc., they are free to leave & get another job.


How about this for a comparison - Marriott offers its employs great benefits. Why is Wal Mart different?”


They are different businesses altogether, there is absolutely no comparison between the two businesses. That's like asking "why doesn't the guy who pumps gas at the corner make the same $$ as the Doctor right across the street?"”

“It is easy for me to sit back and say that the American dream is worth a little more. I am in a position that Ive fought to be in. I do have secondary education. But I worked through college as a laborer. I had hard times and didnt always think the way I now do. I am a boss and I remember what it was like to suffer.To see my three kids sick and know I had no way to pay for doctors. I was able to overcome. I am not a liberal or a socialist, but a man who was raised on welfare who pulled himself up from the ranks of the desperately poor by my desire to succeed. My primary goal was to provide more for my kids than my dad did on a failure of a farm in rural Missouri or than my mom did on the government when they split. Why should major corporations be allowed to dictate wage by lack of competition? I also am not saying it is the governments that should do something about it either but us by casting our votes with the dollars we spend not by begging intervention by socialist or liberalist governmental control. My rambling is simply to help you see it another way and make the decision yourself. That is what is beautiful about this country we may not agree but my view cannot be imposed upon you without your permission!”

“Stove, the competitors are Kroger and Meijer both signatory to UFCW and both profitable and successful by choice”

“"To see my three kids sick and know I had no way to pay for doctors"

Response: It is illegal for a healthcare system to turn away a patient who needs medical care. This statement isn't accurate.

"Why should major corporations be allowed to dictate wage by lack of competition?"

Response: The beauty of our system is that NO corporation can dictate wages... if you don't like what WalMart is paying you, you're free to leave & get a better job elsewhere. They are not the only employer in the U.S.”

“In some rural places the disfortunate are forced by monetary circumstance.

It is illegal but you do go knowing that you are only burying yourself furtther into a mountain of debt you may never escape.”

“Did you read what I said wanderer? That is the beauty. Now I believe redundancy is Beautiful.”

“Wow. Not sure I have the energy for this but this is interesting.

To see my three kids sick and know I had no way to pay for doctors"

Response: It is illegal for a healthcare system to turn away a patient who needs medical care. This statement isn't accurate.

Needed to include this. Are you saying you can't be turned away? I was admitted to GWU Hospital & Diagnosed with Hodgkins Stage IV. The recommendation was I needed to start chemotherapy immediately, as in within the week. But then the Dr. realized I had insurance they didn't take and I would therefore have to pay for any treatment upfront, in cash. I had to search for another doctor. My treatment was delayed.

While I waited for emergency insurance, I needed tests before I could start chemo. I couldn't only get most of the tests by paying up front 1000's of dollars. I didn't have it, Dani did. Without Dani, my treatment might have been delayed by a month or so. Potentially a deadly delay in my case.


Let's keep "class" out of this, OK? "Class" has a racist sort of overtone to it, & I don't think that's what you meant.

I am most certainly not using class in that sense and I think it is an issue.

Not everyone can get a higher education.

Bull#&%!$. Have you not heard that we have a public education system here in the US? ANYONE who obeys the law must attend school, and upon graduating from HS is more than qualified to apply for a retail job in a K-Mart, WalMart, etc. If they want a better job, they should strive to get a better education. There are a tremendous # of financial programs out there for anyone who wants a higher education.

This is an opinion. I don't think everyone is cut out for higher education. It's like anyone can become President. That's complete BS, IMHO

I bet Wal Mart makes a lot more money than many Corporations that offer good benees.
SO what? Your point is????

So profit margin can't be an issue.
It's not your place to tell them what an "acceptable" profit margin is. Vote with your feet (don't shop there) or vote with your wallet (don't invest in their stock) if you don't like the company philosophy. BUT you have no business telling them how to run their business if you're not an (A) customer (B) investor (C) employee, or some other individual with some vested inteest.

My point is Why not offer it? Vested interest? Who picks up the tab when an uninsured person ends up in the hospital?

"decent" pay is a subjective term. If anyone working there doesn't like the job / benefits, etc., they are free to leave & get another job.

Yes but might not Wal Mart be located (often?) in places that make it the lesser of the Evils?


How about this for a comparison - Marriott offers its employs great benefits. Why is Wal Mart different?”


They are different businesses altogether, there is absolutely no comparison between the two businesses. That's like asking "why doesn't the guy who pumps gas at the corner make the same $$ as the Doctor right across the street?"”

No. I'm saying Marriott has many unskilled employees that have excellent benees because Marriott is nice(?) that way. They may make the same wage, same background, etc. as a Wal Mart emp but they have benees.

Why?”

“1. "It is illegal for a healthcare system to turn away a patient who needs medical care."

I was referring to emergency care. It is true that a provider doesn't have to accept assignment from an insurance carrier they don't have an agreement with, or, MediCare / Medicaid pt's.

2. You have to define what you mean by "class" before I can intelligently respond.

3. "This is an opinion. I don't think everyone is cut out for higher education. It's like anyone can become President. That's complete BS, IMHO."

You're incorrect. EVERYONE can achieve SOME higher level of education, that doesn't mean anyone can become CEO of a fortune 500 company or become President, but EVERYONE can do better if they desire.

4. "My point is Why not offer it? Vested interest? Who picks up the tab when an uninsured person ends up in the hospital?"

You obviously have no understanding of how our free-enterprise capitalistic system works. (1) The answer to "why not offer it" id BECAUSE THEY DOBN'T HAVE TO!. The answer to "Who picks up the tab when an uninsured person ends up in the hospital?" is YOU & ME, TAXPAYERS. It is not the employers responsibility to provide healthcare benefits.

5. "I'm saying Marriott has many unskilled employees that have excellent benees because Marriott is nice(?) that way. They may make the same wage, same background, etc. as a Wal Mart emp but they have benees"

Well, go get a better education & get a job a Marriott if that's what you want. No one is forcing yuou to work at Wal Mart, are they? Aren't you free to go apply at Marriott if that's what you want to do? Is Wal-Mart holding a gun to your head telling you that you can't resign & leave?

That's the idea behind striving to be a little better, Bearmagnet... so that you will be offered the better job by Marriott (or whoever)... that's what separates those who are willing to work a little harder from those who are lazy or simply don't care about having a more comfortable lifesytle.


Work a little harder, strive a liitle harder, reach a little higher... stop whining about what you don't have, almost anything in the world is available to you if you really want it! THAT's the message we should be delivering to young people, NOT "mean old WalMart won't pay for my insurance"!

Get a grip.”

“I have to take a break now. Nurse Dani is putting in "A Christmas Story". Part of my therapy is to watch a comedy every day.

Gotta go. ;)”

“Get well!”

“I really think you all would enjoy the film "WalMart - the High Cost of Low Price." And the book "Nickled and Dimed." There is a lot of information floating around that addresses the opinions expressed here.”

“Thanks for the get well.

Now, every town that has a Wal Mart doesn't have a Marriott. You misunderstood my comparison of Marriott & Wal Mart, btw. Read it again.

Because we pick up the tab of the uninsured then we ALL have a vested interest, no?

I think we disagree on a fundemental level. I don't think anybody can be anything. I think there is so much diversity that by default some can't reach certain levels.

I also have a pet peeve about that "American Dream" crap shoved down everyones throat from birth. I don't buy it.

Anyway. I'll respect your opinion. Please respect mine.

Peace.”

“I think you should stop shoving that "respect my opinion" crap down everyone's throat.”

“

(sorry if I disrespected your opinion)”

“How many of us on TT can say we have achieved the American Dream?”

“Here's one. My wife (not a TTer) is another.

I'm just glad I'm in a country where we have the freedom to try to achieve "the American Dream", should we so desire.”

“Everyone's "American Dream" is different. I have rocky roads all the time but I'm a pretty happy camper nonetheless. I think it's well said that we at least have the freedom to try to achieve it.



My question for the anti-Walmart crowd (and I am neither a friend to Walmart---a direct competitor to my employer, nor a foe) is exactly what do you hope to accomplish in your opposition to Walmart, and how????”

“I'm sorry for those of you that don't see the benefits of an open, free society where you are free to pursue the career and/or lifestyle of your choice, for that is the essence of "The American Dream". (as long as it's legal, of course, and your dream isn't to run the biggest, most successful drug-running business going).

It doesn't mean (or promise) that you'll end up running your own milti-million dollar company, it means you're free to try.

And Bearmagnet, you can't deny that. You are free to try to be whatever you'd like, and as long as you're willing to put forth the effort you have a pretty good shot at it.”

“Attaching healthcare to American business seems to be turning out to be worse every year. It puts business at a disadvantage in competing with forgein companies that have national healthcare. I think I read somewhere that GM pays $1900 per car sold on healthcare where Toyota pays a few hundred dollars. More people are falling through the cracks and the sicker you get and can't work the harder it is to keep up just paying for healthcare and everything else. It's complex subject, but it just seems to be getting worse every year.”

“I bet if Walmart sold expedition quality hiking and climbing gear 25% cheaper than REI or Campmor you'd shop there.


....and to think I came here from the other site to get away from this crap. Here we go again.”

“Nah, other than the occasional streak of nastiness, it's pretty fun here, CW. Just click off the fuego square and you'll be able to avoid the battles for the most part. This entire thread has actually been fairly civil. After a while you'll recognize the trolls for what they are. :D


But I'm warning you, sometimes it's hard not to get drawn in, LOL! (You might even be tempted to troll yourself.)”

“Nonconformist, that's a good question - what do we hope to accomplish and how? I saw the WalMart movie, and I hated what I saw. I shop at a local business around my town, and I like what I see. I've accomplished feeling good about where I spend my time and money.

And the feeling good goes forward in time. I know that some part of my $$$ spent for local dairy products finances free ice cream cones at the county fair, and I like knowing that a family on a limited budget can go to the fair and the kids can all have a treat, even a treat every hour, without mom and dad having to wonder if there's enough money.

I shop at my local produce market. I like it that I can ask them for a donation for a school fundraiser and in no time, the okay is granted and the donation is made.

One last thing I like. I eat at small Mexican restaurants and taco trucks a lot. I know what I like to eat, and I order it whether or not it's on the menu. There's never any fuss. Whoever takes the order, figures out a reasonable price, tells the cook, and presto!!! I have what I want to eat.”

“Rich B kinda' hit it, it's such a complex situation with interdependent relationships that there is no easy answer. We put environmental constraints upon businesses which drive up costs, yet we let consumers buy from foreign entities that don't have such environmental laws. Same with healthcare, same with "fair" wages for unionized workers, the list goes on & on. This is exactly why there are isolationists, if we're going to put all these constraints / laws upon a U.S. business, then it's almost unfair to allow consumers access to foreign-produced products from 3rd world coutries who don't have these restrictions that drive up costs.

I'll go out on a limb here & predict National Health within 8-10 years, all the signs are there.”

“Let's hope not. National Health plans fail miserably world wide.”

“No choice, healthcare has become way too expensive, the Feds are paying for more & more of it, and there are way too many inconsistencies in delivery for them to continue doing so without exercising more control. It's coming, whether we like it or not.”

“Is it Wal Mart's fault that suppliers sell to them cheaper then anyone else? Why don't people blaim the suppliers for jacking up the price to Mom and Pop stores so they can't be cost competative to Wal Mart?”

“No DDX, but people should be made aware of the effect their spending habits have on their communities.

Walmart is free to practice business as it pleases. The buying public should be aware of the consequences of choosing to shop there. If a company uses ethical business practice then they shouldn't worry that the spotlight falls on them. Awareness is rising though - it's yet to be seen if they'll put their money where their mouth is.

And public healthcare makes sense, America spends twice as much on healthcare as most other industrialized nations, and yes still manages to leave 40-50 million American uninsured beyond being scraped up and patched up should they bit hit by a bus.”

“People scream public health care public health care but they have no idea WHY health care costs so much now adays. If health care still governmentalized it will still cost way too much and we all will still have to foot the bill. You still have to solve the problem of WHY health care costs so much it just won't go away if it's made public.”

“"National Health plans fail miserably world wide."

Really? Us having to pay more than everybody else is not a miserable failure? Letting insurance companies run the system like we do is the worst example I know of.

The only thing WalMart is doing illegally is blocking all attempts by workers to organize/unionize. They buy enough lawyers to tie things up in court until the regular schmoes have to get a job somewhere else. If a few of WalMart's employees were represented by a union, the company would have to treat everyone else better to keep them from joining.”

“People scream public health care public health care but they have no idea WHY health care costs so much now adays. If health care still governmentalized it will still cost way too much and we all will still have to foot the bill. You still have to solve the problem of WHY health care costs so much it just won't go away if it's made public.”
DeoreDX
6:29:50 AM
12/04/05

DX, tell us why health care cost so much these days?

this past month my insurance went up over 100.00 a month. Want to know why? I had a birthday!! It had nothing to do with being sick or costing the insurance company any more money.
They haven't had to pay a thing out on me but because I get a yr older I have to pay more.

It will eventually get to the point that no small or middle size company can afford to even offer health insurance because of the cost to them.

Believe me I have looked at trying to buy my own health insurance. I can't get covered because I inherited high cholestrol from my parents. BTW I pay for my own medicine and still haven't met my deductible for the yr.”

“Ewker, you're paying more because your age now puts you a higher-risk pool. A lot more is spent on healthcare as people age, duh.

As to "why" our costs are so high, there are multiple reasons. (1) Up to 30% of healthcare dollars go to administration of the system, that's 3 out of every 10.00 just to pay for the paperwork & assosciated mess. (2) we are a consumer society responding to the pharma companies constant barrage of advertisements, "if there's anything wrong, take this pill". That's killing us. (3) Americans somehow have come to the conclusion that they don't have to do anything to take care of themselves, the "just take a pill" mentality, which has resulted in a whole bunch of overweight, unhealthy people, which costs us over $1,000,000,000 annually (yes that's "billion" with a B) to care for. Overweight people now cost us more than smokers, if you can believe that.”

“I think some form of national health is on the way too. With more people using Medicare and Medicaid it's already moving in that direction. It's only going to get worse as more American businesses won't offer healthcare at all or scale it back to bare bones packages most people couldn't afford to pay.”

“National health ---that's too french.”

“I shop at my Super Wal-Mart and will continue doing so.
Nannie nannie boo boo to all you little Socialists. ;-)”

“I heard Walmart was selling children’s t-shirts that read,

“My mommy got trampled at Walmart on Black Friday and all I got was this lousy t-shirt.”.”

“People scream public health care public health care but they have no idea WHY health care costs so much now adays. If health care still governmentalized it will still cost way too much and we all will still have to foot the bill. You still have to solve the problem of WHY health care costs so much it just won't go away if it's made public.”
DeoreDX
6:29:50 AM
12/04/05

Healthcare costs that much because it is privatized.”