Beat the heat on the Delaware River (pad dle trip)

“I want to get a kayaking / canoe trip together. I do not have the dates just yet. Trying to juggle a busy summer and find time to go paddling is not easy.

I was thinking of putting in at Narrowsburg and go from there.
Is there anyone interested in doing a Fri - Sat trip on the Delaware River?”

“WTF's wrong with Widesburg?”

“to big. kinda like your butt :)”

“Dates are set

Aug 11th - 13th”

“Yes, your Highness”

“Sounds great, the kind of backpacking/kayaking I was waiting for! But a still have a few questions:

How are you planning to handle the shuttle of all the kayaks/canoes??

What's the intended final stop?”

“you want to go?”

“zee,
I guess putin might be milford or dingman. need to check milage then pull out at smithfield. id rather putin further north but not to sure about the rapids. any input?

treebeard will be dropping me off Fri am and picking me up Sunday.

do you have a kayak or canoe?

tree has to head to Ten Mile River Boy Scout camp to pick up land stalker”

“Maple there was severe flooding on the Delaware last month and many campsites on the river and some launch areas are still closed. You should check the National Park Service web site or call an outfitter like Landers or Kittatinny to check on conditions. Also water quality could be an issue. Some towns in the watershed had their sewage treatment plants flooded and some are still shut down, which means they are releasing waste water that isn’t fully treated.
last edited: 7/31/06 9:21:05 AM”

“ive kayaked in the hudson. what could be worse? LOL

will check that out now”

“Party pooper!!”

“ok your right about closers. but the ones that I need are open. have not found anything about them flooding the river.”

“I own a 12' kayak (pungo120) and a yakima rack with canoe adapters on my car, but I might be able to fit another one if needed.

As far as campsites I won't have a problem, as long as I can find two decent trees to hang my Hennessy Hammock.

I just need to know the putin & out points to get a better idea on the logistics...”

“I drove along the Pennsylvania side of the river July 5.

It flooded wicked bad.”

“I can check out anything you like from say Hankins to Port Jervis. I know my wife's friend campgrounds in Roscoe closed permanently. The Callicoon bridge was the only one open up here for a while. Not sure/haven't heard if the others re-opened. Going to look at a camping trailer (hi-lo) to replace my wife's pop-up in port jervis sometime this week.”

“Can you swim there?”

“Swimming is great on a Delaware River trip.
You can bail out for a cool dip anywhere you please.
I suppose there is some concern about shiddy water......hasn't the river flushed itself yet?”

“Right. I'll put it on the list with the Potomac, Anacostia, & Rock Creek.

What is Hell? Being surrounded by water in triple digit heat with humidity to match and not being able to go into the water without fearing for your life.”

“Does anyone know how bad the water quality really is...if it's that bad we may have to choose other alternatives...”

“I found this, it's from July, 20th


NEWS
Is the Delaware River Safe for Boating and Swimming?

Date
July 20, 2006

Contact
Loren Goering, 570 729-7574

The National Park Service at Upper Delaware Scenic and Recreational River (NPS) has received a lot of questions about whether it’s safe to go back on the Delaware River after the recent flooding. These are valid concerns; river users are advised to continue to exercise considerable caution. Concerns include high flows, debris, hazards to navigation, diminished water clarity, and possible elevated bacteria levels.

The National Park Service and other agencies (federal, state, and county) routinely monitor surface waters to determine the typical or average water quality but no-one continuously monitors water quality. Many sewage treatment plants (STPs) have been flooded and are off-line, or are operating at diminished capacity. Some STPs are only able to treat discharged sewage with chlorine; others with primary (partial) treatment, while other plants are fully functional. The National Park Service sampled water for fecal coliform bacteria in multiple locations on the Delaware River and on some tributaries on July 11 and July 18, 2006. These samples showed fluctuating levels. Fecal coliform levels can change from day to day depending on discharges and water levels. The fecal coliform counts for the Delaware River ranged between 2 and 103 colonies/100ml, below the 200 colonies/100 ml that would result in the closure of a public beach area. On Tuesday, July 18, the fecal coliform counts on the Eqununk Creek and Ten Mile River exceeded 500 colonies/100ml. The National Park Service urges river users to use caution. As always, do not drink surface water and wash your hands before eating.

The water of the Upper Delaware River is not tested for fuel and oil spills or other toxic substances. The National Park Service does, however, wish to hear of any suspicious spills, oil slicks, odors, or unusual reactions (e.g. rashes or illnesses) people may encounter when on, in, or near the river. Any containers with unknown materials that may need to be removed from the river or the floodplain should be reported to PA DEP (570) 826-2511 or NY DEC (845) 256-3145.

Any safety hazards or hazards to navigation, such as trailers or other debris that may have been washed into the river, should also be reported to Upper Delaware Scenic and Recreational River. Do not attempt to remove or salvage such items from the river. There are no salvage rights on the Delaware River, and keeping property found in the Delaware River is against the law.

For more information please call Upper Delaware Scenic and Recreational River at (570) 729-7134.

http://www.nps.gov/upde/pphtml/newsdetail24560.html
last edited: 7/31/06 5:13:44 PM”

“I guess I'm out them....unless someone comes up with a better solution...”

“ok so the Delaware is out.
ok lets move it further up North. near the catskills. any ideas?”

“Jump in a lake?”

“How about the Pine Barrens? I know you can canoe the Mullica, Batsto, Wading and Oswego rivers. I've never been on those nor do I know about camping on those rivers, but it may be worth looking into.”

“not this trip. tree is heading towards the catskills to take son to boy scout camp. so i thought he could drop me off on fri then pick me up on Sun”

“You all are invited, anytime to Missouri to float my river...the 11 Points. Its clear, cold and spectacular.”

“Paddle faster Maple, I hear banjos!

>8^O”

“I spent the last two hours looking for info on the water condition. nothing.
so I am going on as planned but it is a little further up the Delaware River.


start at callicoon and end narrowsburg or ten mile river. i still need to look at the river map which is being mailed to me. (so subject to change)

i might have to stay at the campgrounds (hate public campgrounds)


last edited: 8/02/06 9:40:00 AM”

“called the campground. they have room
$15.00 per night and with river side camping.

also asked about the water and she said it is fine.
works for me :)”

“I just found on article online about the bacteria levels in the Delaware. It seems the Middle Section is not that bad...

http://www.recordonline.com/archive/2006/07/22/news-vwsafewater-07-22.html

"...In most areas, the river is considered safe for swimming and boating.

"We've been doing sampling once the flood waters receded," said Allan Ambler, a biologist for the National Park Service in the Delaware Water Gap region of the river, which is south of Sparrowbush and includes Port Jervis. "We did not have any high readings at all in the Middle Delaware."

In fact, the Park Service announced yesterday that it's reopening some public beaches on the river, including the one in Milford, Pa., which had been closed because of high water levels and debris.

Boating and swimming is continuing along the entire stretch of the river, and the crowds have returned in droves on weekends.

And the warnings aren't deterring folks from taking a dip..."”

“i am going to the Upper part
mid and lower part has way to many peple”

“Mapes here are links to some online maps and distances between put in locations on the river. They may help in your planning.

River Maps

Mile Markers”

“I wish I could join you you’ll be right in my backyard. I can’t promise anything though. I’m working 70 hour weeks right now. I wanted to get in an overnight float trip with my family this month.”

“"..also asked about the water and she said it is fine.works for me :)..."

Of course they'll say is fine, they are not scientists, all thay want is to protect their business.

After what I read about the water quality of the upper Delaware I won't touch it with a stick. "...The levels were generally higher than the norm all along the upper Delaware. ..."

I might go to somewhere in the pinelands instead, that way I could combine kayaking and hiking on the Batona Trail or something...

Have Fun and take Care!”

“The water of the Upper Delaware River is not tested for fuel and oil spills or other toxic substances

HeyZeus #&%!$ing Crisco! Are ya #&%!$ing Kidding me???????

What kind of Industrial Centers are within the Delaware Watershed????

Googling Delaware river toxins epa:

Reproductive Toxins--Dupont Chambers Works in Deepwater, NJ dumped more reproductive toxins into the nation's waters than any other facility: 210,000 pounds for 1992 through 1996. All of these discharges went into the Delaware River. The Carolina Eastman Div. facility in Eastman Columbia, SC, Tennessee Eastman Div. in Kinsport, TN, Pfizer Inc. in Groton, CT, and North American Rayon Corp. in Elizabethton, TN round out the top five dischargers of reproductive toxins to America's waters during the five year period analyzed.

More reproductive toxins, 220,000 pounds between 1992 and 1996, were dumped in the Delaware River than any other body of water in the U.S. The Delaware was followed by the Congaree River in South Carolina, the Holston River in Tennessee, the Thames River in Connecticut, and the Wautauga River in Tennessee.

http://uspirg.org/uspirg.asp?id2=7007&id3=USPIRG&

The Delaware River
Total toxic pollution reported in 1997: 4,378,209 Pounds
States discharging the greatest amounts of toxic chemicals to the Delaware River in 1997.
State Toxic chemical release to water (pounds)
Percent of total release:
New Jersey 3,696,975 - 84.4%
Delaware 490,419 - 11.2%
Pennsylvania 190,815 - 4.4%

Polluters discharging the greatest amounts of toxic chemicals to the Delaware River in 1997. Facility Location Toxic chemical release to water (pounds)
Du Pont Chambers Works Deepwater, NJ 3,086,517
Du Pont Repauno Plant Gibbstown, NJ 410,074
Ciba Specialty Chemicals Corp. Newport, DE 185,302
Mallinckrodt Baker Inc. Phillipsburg, NJ 176,920
Allied-Signal Inc. Frankford Philadelphia, PA 107,022
Rodel Inc. Newark, DE 104,550
GMC NAO Wilmington Assembly Wilmington, DE 68,575
Star Enterprise Delaware City, DE 50,769
Sun Refining & Marketing Co. Marcus Hook, PA 36,845
Noramco Of Delaware Inc. Wilmington, DE 31,075

Toxic chemicals discharged in the greatest amounts to theDelaware River in 1997.
Chemical Toxic chemical release to water (pounds)
Nitrate compounds 2,636,493
Ammonia 352,277
Methanol 259,315
Sodium nitrite 238,230
Nitric acid 235,394
N,N-Dimethylformamide 113,768
Glycol ethers 112,273
1,3-Phenylenediamine 104,112
m-Dinitrobenzene 81,587
2,4-Dinitrophenol 48,869

Total carcinogens, persistent toxic metals, and reproductive toxins discharged to the Delaware River in 1997.
Carcinogens 172,150 Pounds
Persistent Toxic Metals 31,035 Pounds
Reproductive Toxins 92,548 Pounds
Total ** 278,660 Pounds

Polluters reporting the greatest amounts of carcinogens, persistent toxic metals, and reproductive toxins discharged to the Delaware River in 1997.

Top dischargers of carcinogens to the Delaware River in 1997 released to water (lbs)
Rodel Inc. Newark, DE 104,550
Noramco Of Delaware Inc. Wilmington, DE 21,360
Rohm & Haas Co. Philadelphia Philadelphia, PA 10,630
Du Pont Chambers Works Deepwater, NJ 10,466
Star Enterprise Delaware City, DE 6,782

Top dischargers of persistent toxic metals to the Delaware River in 1997. Persistent metals to water (lbs)
Du Pont Chambers Works Deepwater, NJ 14,001
Star Enterprise Delaware City, DE 7,670
Sun Refining & Marketing Co. Marcus Hook, PA 3,413
NVF Co. Yorklin Complex Yorklyn, DE 1,885
USS Fairless Works Fairless Hills, PA 1,700

Top dischargers of reproductive toxins* to the Delaware River in 1997. Reproductive toxins to water (lbs)
Du Pont Chambers Works Deepwater, NJ 82,802
Sun Refining & Marketing Co. Marcus Hook, PA 6,996
Noramco Of Delaware Inc. Wilmington, DE 2,520
Star Enterprise Delaware City, DE 150
Zeneca Specialties A Business New Castle, DE 28

http://www.newhopepa.com/DelawareRiver/currentissues_3.htm

Sorry. I'm really not trying to rain on your parade. And maybe y'all are gonna be North of the major polluters? And maybe they don't dump anymore? I am paranoid.

I use to do lots off stuff that people didn't like and they would warn me: "You're gonna get Cancer". My response was always: "If I'm gonna get Cancer it's going to be from swimming in Lake Eire and its tributaries when I was growing up".

Needless to say, I don't need that reply anymore. Of course I can't prove the source of my ailment, but I'll never touch Eastern Rivers/Lakes again unless I'm in the Mountains.”

“Those locations are on the lower river and bay, which is heavily industrialized. The difference between that section of the river and the upper Delaware is like night and day.
last edited: 8/02/06 11:54:13 AM”

“what a bunch of pansies!
have fun in the pines. oh and if your worried about filthy water? you might want to bring a wet suit cause that water is nasty smelly.

i will be packing a wetsute just in case!


well the invite is still open.”

“good website conk



Callicoon, NY 27 (put in)
Callicoon, PA 27.5
Cochecton, NY 32
Damascus, PA 32
Skinners Falls, NY 35 (day one)
Narrowsburg, NY 40.5 (day two)
Ten Mile River, 43 NY (pull out)

a nice relaxing weekend :)”

“"...what a bunch of pansies!"

I just like to be cautious, not stupid. Remember the Leave no trace principles "Plan ahead & prepare"

"...that water is nasty smelly...."

Never judge a book by its cover. For your information that "tea colored water" in the pinelands is the cleanest in the state.

Also the fish caught in those waters, is the only one that does not have any eating restrictions because of mercury content.

The color is because of the heavy deposits of iron and the cedar. But one could even drink it untreated. Try that in the Delaware now.

Just have fun & be safe out there.”

“Thanks Conk. I'm kind of ignorant of the area. So where is the upper Delaware River? Is it in the Catskills area? Trying to reference several maps is difficult, at least for me. :D”

“That's the Delaware Watershed. I can see where it might be nice as long as you're North of NJ.”

“Bearmagnet the Upper Delaware is the section that forms the border between NY and PA. Known for it’s clean water, great fishing and scenic beauty. No big rapids class I and II mainly. It’s also a great place to see bald eagles. My daughter and I counted 27 bald eagles along a 4 mile stretch of river this past winter. Even along NJ especially from the Delaware Water Gap north it’s still a great place. I’ve done a lot of canoeing on this stretch of river in the last 30 years.”

“your right about the wildlife conk. I might even go further nother on the river. less people!
last edited: 8/04/06 4:19:50 PM”