Can you oppose the war and support the T roops

““MarkO when do we need to get involved? When it is a token force that can be stopped by a few thousand or when they are threatenting the very shores of the nation and the sacrifice will be in the millions?"

I assume your are referring to Vietnam.
That's absurd.
We were told 40 years ago that if we didn't fight them "over there" we may very well have to fight them here.
That was total BS. Those people barely had shoes and they sure as hell didn't have a navy capable of delivering assault force to the U.S.
The proof is in the pudding......the U.S. government eventually left them alone and they never had any intentions against the U.S.

"Do we turn a blind eye to tens of thousands of humanity overloading boats to escape and becoming victims of pirates or exposure off the coast, just trying to escape?"

That disaster was a direct result of stupid foreign policy.
Sure, help those in need of help.
"You break it, you fix it."


"I have a neighbor like you. He thinks we are insane to respond to fires off duty, says if we aren't getting paid its not our problem."

NO, you don't have a neighbor like me.
Please stop trying to define me.
That is a back-handed rotten-ass thing to say about me.
You are attributing things to me that are so far from reality as to make your self seem mentally ill.
This could be a serious personality disorder on your part.”

“MarkO was was referring to 1936 when Hitler marched into the Rhineland. Even Heinz Guderian admitted in his notes that a token force from France and England would have destroyed the Nazi plans.

Then again that was um lots of countries problem before it was ours.”

“I wonder if Bush let the UN keep up with it’s hollow actions on Iraq and we left Saddam in there, just like the anti-war crowd wanted, and then Saddam facilitated a terrorist attack on America during the next administration (likely a democrat one) how many of these same anti-war people would be on every mountain top blaming Bush for not doing anything?

Answer: Every last one of them.”

“You're changing the subject, guy.

This was about you trying to make a noble cause out of the U.S. intervention in S.E. Asia.

Now you are trying to paint me as a Nazi sympathizer???

Oh you nut!!”

“You are not being painted as a Nazi Sympathizer, I am painting you as an apologist and an appeaser. You may think it is SUITE (LOL) to give in and play the homely little farm girl to every bully frat boy that rises up. But I am realist enough to understand that what we are fighting is not a 'we hate you for being you" but a We intend to enforce a Fascist Religious (actually it is a Ethno-Centric belief in Iran) control on you.
It will be less costly in the long run to fight the battle in Iraq rather than America (think now...ask the Belgians).”

“Can you oppose murder and support the police?

Can you oppose cancer and support doctors?

Can you oppose fire and support firemen?

Can you oppose stupidity and support teachers?”

““You are not being painted as a Nazi Sympathizer, I am painting you as an apologist and an appeaser."

I am not, and you are changing the subject like a whore changes bed partners.

If you want to know how I feel about Islam, just ask.

Please stop "defining" me with your insanely false and increasingly desparate accusations.”

“Nice Duck walk and Quack you got working there....LOL”

“we never had any real evidence that Iraq was any threat to us

seriously? no threat? i guess that depends on how you define "real" and how you define "threat" and how you define "us".
Jimmy san


Lets see, they had no nukes, no icbms. in short no real way to reach us with any military weapon. there was never any proof that Iraq had chemical weapons at the time we invaded except a few fuzzy sattellite photos that were no where near current resolutions or quality. The only real means Iraq had to attack us was with terrorist groups operating inside the US. There was also no proof that Iraq had any real dealings with Al- Quida either.

You should also consider that if there was a real threat in Iraq we could have easily blown it up without all the expense of an invasion. The ease of our invasion shows just how poorly they were armed.

The claims of poor intelligence is also a ruse shown by the sattelite photos themselves. We have long been able to read the license plate of a truck from space and that was 20 years ago. I use to work around the intel stuff and if the president wanted to know what color panties hussein wore to bed they could find out....

The simple fact of the matter is someone in power wanted to invade Iraq and all the rest was just a convienient excuse.”

“XL - your right, it is amazing how many have switched sides once they figured out how much this is gonna cost us in the long run. Bankrupting the country is not good politics.”

“speaking of that - the deficit is way down thanks to tax breaks for everybody”

“For heavens sake Lumber I have posted a number of news articles referring to WMD's that were found.

Now the question you should as is DID THEY HAVE THEM?...Yes the Marsh Arabs could attest to that.

Did they get rid of them. We never knew but apparently NOT>

Lumber can you show me one place that Bush said we were invading for WMD's I thought it was to enforce the UN Resolutions....

Using the trite failed lines from Dead Air America is silly, try some facts.
last edited: 10/13/06 3:02:49 PM”

“do you even remember why the US left troops in saudi arabia after the first gulf war and what sprung out our presence in that part of the world?

did you forget that saddam violated the terms of his surrender after his defeat in the first gulf war?

did you forget that us and brit aircraft receiving anti-aircraft fire from iraqi forces pretty much on a daily basis?”

“Jimmy I think most of these people are like the kid screaming Sieg Heil to Col. Joe. They think it is cool to be a "protester". They have no idea how hard it is on our men and women over there to see this type of crap.
But then Hanoi Jane and company thought they were being socially astute. I am certain the MILLIONS or more brutally murdered or starved in the ensuing years will thank them.”

“Cool to be a protester??

The war is wrong and those of us with a good grip on reality have the good sense to stand up to the government.”

“Lumber can you show me one place that Bush said we were invading for WMD's I thought it was to enforce the UN Resolutions....

XL The fact is I have no real clue why we invaded Iraq, there were so many excuses given and WMD's were one of the alledged excuses handed to Americans. Do I really need to dig up all the WMD threads? you remember all the hoopla over saddam gassing people dont you?


Jimmy there wasnt anything there a couple of bombs couldnt take care of...Makes one wonder why we didnt deal with them more harshly then we did after the gulf war. Strange how Iraq got the impression we would not intervene over Kuwait... you just dont want to see a pattern that has existed long before the current administration. A pattern we are currently duplicating in N korea and Iran of half hearted measures when we could have solved the problem long ago.”

“Liars and crooks, Oh My!!”

“WOW....

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/001/607rkunu.asp”

“Makes one wonder why we didnt deal with them more harshly then we did after the gulf war.

Because the UN, being impotent, would not permit us to do so. Not a problem this time.”

“Or maybe it was because the party of Violin and MarkO were more interested in Sucking up to the people who were trying to kill us. I.E. a fake genocide in Yugoslavia so that he could look good to the muslims.

Then he could walk away from Isreal (who wouldn't bribe him).

So he sold out to North Korea, China, and the Terrorist countries.”

“Uh huh.... and how does this all prove you cant support the troops while opposing the war?”

“Two retired senior Army generals, who served in Iraq and previously voted Republican, are now openly endorsing a Democratic takeover of Congress. The generals, and an active-duty senior military official, told Salon in separate interviews that they believe a Democratic victory will help reverse course from what they consider to be a disastrous Bush administration policy in Iraq. The two retired generals, Maj. Gen. John Batiste and retired Maj. Gen. Paul Eaton, first openly criticized the handling of the war last spring, when they called for the resignation of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld.

"The best thing that can happen right now is for one or both of our houses to go Democratic so we can have some oversight," Batiste, who led the Army's 1st Infantry Division in Iraq in 2004 and 2005, told Salon. Batiste describes himself as a "lifelong Republican." But now, he said, "It is time for a change."

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2006/10/25/generals/index_np.html”

“Sounds like the support the troops and the war just not the way it is being handled.”

“I support them if they do it my way.

*rolls eyes*”

“I support the soldiers and their ability to do their jobs. I have a problem with how their jobs are being manipulated by the people in power.

It's really not that damn hard to understand.”

“lol seriously”

“I support terrorists - whenever they are changing diapers and taking their kids to school and telling jokes and having picnics and doing other regular things.

I support terrorists.”

“Glad you admit it.

According to your definition of supporting the troops, I apparently did not support myself when in the military. I often questioned my superiors and recommended better ways to accomplish things. I disagreed with several things I was told to do, and said so, but did my job.

By disagreeing with what I was doing, I was not supporting myself, because according to your definition of support, I have to agree with everything I'm being told to do.

As always, Sarge, you're a brilliant mind trapped in an idiot's ideas.

Now feel free to try all your silly little semantic games... How about you start with something like: "When did I define anythin? Quit putting words in my mouth".”

“fyi Phaedrus - I quickly clicked on the little plus under the assumption you were addressing me specifically. I don't read your posts, nor have I been speaking to you or to any of your points. Carry on.”

“Someone finally realized the kitchen was too hot and got out. Good for you, Sargie! Now you can feel free to make all the idiotic statements you want, without having to worry about seeing print that takes you out of that little comfort zone.

Feel free to ignore everyone, and just post in the blind. It'll make you feel even better!”

“Didn't you get the memo? Yeah, it's all about Phaedrus.”

“I think that's what Cheney does Phaed..... could it be ...... has anyone ever seen them in the same place at the same time.”

“No, Nigal, I think he ignored me because of his own insecurities. It doesn't really have a lot to do with me.”

“Haha! I quit trying to have any kind of mature exchange with you years ago. You have never been able to view things from any way but your own. It’s good that sarge has come to that realization and it’ll save Matt a whole lot of band width.

Just because you have a right to free speech doesn’t mean you have the right to a response.”

“LOL...Generals racing to get to a camera like a bunch of Congressmen.

Old Soldiers never die, they just try to find a Liberal Think Tank to pay them big bucks for life.”

““Haha! I quit trying to have any kind of mature exchange with you years ago. You have never been able to view things from any way but your own. It’s good that sarge has come to that realization and it’ll save Matt a whole lot of band width.

Just because you have a right to free speech doesn’t mean you have the right to a response.”
Nigal
11:34:14 AM
10/27/06

Hey, that's all fine. I quit trying to have any exchange with you at all when you sent me the private email asking me to be nice to you because you were trying to become a better person and needed support. I tried. After I quit giving you your shlt right back, I noticed you turned back into the jerk you had been previously.

Like this - taking a pot shot at me for something you have no stake in. If you're going to cry, feel free, but don't expect me to pull punches on you when you send me another email.”

“You can be as mean to me as ya want to Phaed because I gave up on trying to be civil with the dicks like you, Kleetn, Violin and Buddha long ago. Even when people try to avoid you in an attempt at civility you jump all over it and claim superiority over them for lack of a response. It has always been about being right with you and nothing more.”

“It's been about being right for you too, but you're wrong so often it hurts your feelings to be called on it. Then, when people become "dicks" in your eyes by showing you time and time again that you have no talent for discussion or, well, reality and logic, you resort to your infantile little potshots - sort of like Sarge.

You're two of a kind.

Oh yeah:

Visorbltch.
last edited: 10/27/06 3:19:48 PM”

“HMM I remember when a General made a negative comment about a Democratic President...two in fact....lets see what happened.

McArthur vs Truman? McArthur's career ended

Then there was the General who opposed JIMUH's removal of troops from Korea...lets see..he disappeared too...but then those are two perfect examples of the "tolerant" nature of the Liberal Socialist Defeatocrat party (LOL)”

“If that's how you see it Skidmark but hey, how many people have threatened to kick your ass on TT now? three or something like that? No one ever was pushed far enough to threaten me. But yeah, as you say, it's gotta be me because it can't be you. LOL!

Are we done here shorty?”

“The internet is full of tough guys, Nigella.”

“Here is a serious, hypothetical, question for those who say you can't support the troops without supporting the war.

Can you imagine any cirumstances under which you would oppose a war and still supporting the troops?

Imagine the next President were to decide it necessary to invade Israel and occupy Gaza, the West Bank and Israel and work to establish a pro-Western, one person - one vote Democracy with full right of return for all decsendants of former occupants. Would you support the war once it started? Would you support the troops?”

“not supporting a war = not supporting the troops

this isn't higher math”

“War is not math -if it were, we would never see another war. When arrogance over rules logic the result is a mess.”

“apples aren't math either - doesn't mean we don't add them together”

“i oppose the troops but support the war. i want to see it all fought by giant robots.”

“Personally I disagree with the equation.

I was vehemently opposed to starting the war. Once the war began, I wanted things to go well for the US effort - the cost of failure would be too high. At this point, I'm not in favor of immediate withdrawal or even a time table. The enemies in Iraq are smart enough to know how to work a timetable. And a timetable limits our ability to respond to unanticipated events.

Still, I think war is being prosecuted badly and that our goals need to shift.”

“Still, I think war is being prosecuted badly and that our goals need to shift.

You wouldn't know how well it's being prosecuted unless you're familiar with the amount of infiltration we're accomplishing into the middle east. I have never even heard you speak of our real goals - only the 'aside' goals.”

“So it is the place of the US government to infiltrate the middle east. The CCCP was right about the capitalist american pigs trying to take over the world. Go bark at the moon you hick.”

“So it is the place of the US government to infiltrate the middle east.

What on earth do you think military intelligence is? We don't send out mailers with a self-addressed envelope asking for the enemy to fill it out and send it back in a timely manner.

reality escapes you”