Hey there New Yorkers

“for me and my sister. She lives in Pleasant Valley, NY. The town is near the AT and she has some gear (prolly 15 years old) but hasn't hiked in years. I'm looking for a 2 overnight excursion that will entice her to get out for a "sister's hike and to get out to enjoy the solitude of the wilderness. I've checked websites to no avail. She really needs this outing (but doesn't know it just yet)

I'm looking at Spring because I'm not sure she will bite on a winter excursion. I can outfit both of us out of my gear stash but am having a difficult time finding good information to plan a route. NY it seems as just about as hiker friendly as Chicago.

Any thoughts.....suggestions? I'm sure we are willing to drive a fair distance from her home.

p.s. I know you guys are out there. :-)”

“Hey D! I have to run to the airport to pick up Maple right now. But, we'd love to expand on this thought later or in the morning. Give us a chance here and we will get back with you, ok?”

“Harriman is always nice, not to hard for a newbe, and the AT runs right through it.”

“An AT Runs Through It......”

“I don't know that area too well, but the three areas that come to mind are Harriman, the Gunks, and the Catskills.”

“You guys are awesome! Thanks!!!!!!”

“Set 'em up with a butt-kicker in the Catskills.”

“Pleasant Valley is near Poughkeepsie, I think. For overnight, you have the AT over in nearby Harriman, Bear Mtn, and Fahnestock State Parks, and also over near Pawling NY and into Connecticut.

On the other side of the river over the Mid-Hudson Bridge are the Shawangunks, featuring Minnewaska State Park and Mohonk Preserve. Both are very scenic and under 1/2 hour from Poughkeepsie, but only offer day hiking, as camping in the 'Gunks is strictly prohibited.

About an hour north on the NY Thruway, though, lie the Catskills. Quite possibly the Northeast's best kept secret, the Catskill offer challenging trails, excellent views (many peaks over 3500'), and some of the best campsites I've ever stayed in.

Iffn you ask me, my recommendation is to drive to Woodland Valley in the Catskills and take the red-disc-blazed Wittenberg-Cornell-Slide trail over the Burroughs Range, which features Slide Mtn at 4180' -- tallest Catskill peak), and camp in the col (saddle, gap, etc.) between Cornell and Slide Mtns. On the second continue over Slide Mtn, and at the junction with the yellow-disc-blazed Phonecia-East Branch trail, head back toward Woodland Valley. However, for your second night, stop at Giant Ledge (blue-disc-blazed spur trail) for quite possibly one of the most phonomenal campsites in New York.

Maps can be obtained from the New York/New Jersey Trail Conference -- for the hike I mentioned about, specifically the Slide Mountain Wilderness on Catskill Trail Map #43.

Anyway, please don't hesitate to ask if you need anything else. Good luck!
last edited: 10/20/06 8:56:30 PM”

“Do you wanna scare her??????? I want to bring out the inner granola girl, not scare the bejeezus out of her.

Me, I'm up for any buttkicker you can throw my way (BRING IT ONNNNNN) but, like I said.........she hasn't hiked in years.

BTW - If you can give me links to trail maps or a topo area to plot it would be awesome. That's what I've had a hard time finding online.

I'd be up for posting this on the trips page as a "Hike with dhutch's sister" trip.
It would do her good to meet some real outdoor folks. Scary as it sounds it may do her good to meet some trailtalkers!!!!!!! That would be a great reality check and she needs it!”

“OMG Phantomsoul. You are my hero! I'm going to check it out right now.

Treebait, any thoughts on this?
Once I cajole her in to this idea, I'm inviting you all along!!!!!!”

“You may want to also check out the New York - New Jersey Trail Conference.
http://www.nynjtc.org/

I believe their maps would cover the areas mentioned above.”

“Not too far north is:

The Taconic / Copake Falls State Park has some nice hiking. You can hike in 3 states there.

New York, Conn & Mass.

You can stand on the trail where the 3 states meet. Nice trails, views of rolling farmland.”

“PS hit it pretty much on the head. As for Maple and I, we'd love to meet up with you guys. Let us know the details as they come about.”

“Hiking the LOOP in Chicago does have an effect upon people's attitudes there.”

“Thank you all. I'll take this info, begin planning and keep you posted on the entailing hike.”

“MARK O
“Do you wanna scare her??????? I want to bring out the inner granola girl, not scare the bejeezus out of her."

Hey hon, I was just jivin'.

By all means, get out there for a hike!”

“I know ;-)

I've already ordered the suggested mappage.”

“I'm looking at map 43 and see the route you mention clearly phantom soul. It looks promising. Friday 4+ miles in to the col, a longer hike Saturday to Giant Ledge and then a short day back to the parking lot on Sunday. I'll probably be making it a 3 day trip for sis so we can make it around at a relaxed pace.

You're sure camping is allowed in those areas? I see lean-to's marked but not designated campsites.

Once I can take a better look at the rest of the maps (40-42, 44) I'll make a final answer and firm up the itinerary.

Thanks all!”

“Over the years, I've hiked with several people who haven't been out for long periods of time... they tend to think they can do more than capable of without much pain. That's my $.02 on that issue. Otherwise, the Catskills have some excellent backpacking/base-camping/dayhiking possibilities for re-newbies --without their butts getting kicked. Some easy-to-moderate itineraries I'm thinking of would be the former Demming leanto area, Batvia Kill leanto/area, Giant Ledge, etc. These locations have good water sources, and close proximity to some great dayhikies out of your base camp if you like.

Have a great time wherever you go.”

“M Silver - I heartily agree and have seen the same thing. I understand the conditioning it will take to get us around a loop and am prepared to carry all of the weight if necessary but more probably will haul the greater majority of it.

She's already walking daily in preparation and will need to add a hefty day pack towards Spring in order to prepare for carrying 20-25 lbs of overnight gear. Knowing my sis the challenge alone will bring out the overacheiver within.

I'll be scouring the maps closely in the next few weeks to get an even better idea of the required effort and tantalizing routes. Elevation gained and lost will be the key takeaway.

Thanks for the 2 cents always appreciated :-)”

“To follow up on M_Silver's point, I'd like to remind you that the contours on Map 43 have a 100' interval, so to that end, yes the trails are more challenging than many other places around here and definitely more challenging than around the Midwest.

That said, however, the most strenuous section of the Burroughs/Giant Ledge loop is by far the first day to the col between Cornell and Slide Mtns. The second day involves going over Slide Mtn, but once on top of Slide, there is a graded trail all the way down to the road, and a level easement woods road you can hike along from just north of Winisook Lake to the junction of the yellow and blue trails near Giant Ledge. On the third day, the 3 mile hike back to Woodland Valley is all downhill along a graded path.

As for the camping, both places are actually designated campsites. They're not marked on the map because the Catskill Wildernesses follow the basic LNT camping rules (anywhere 150' from trail, 1/2 mile from the road, etc.) except that there is no camping above 3500' to help protect the alpine forest up there (there are signs on the trails at the 3500' crossings to remind you about the camping ban at those altitudes).

In the case of the col and Giant Ledge however, look for yellow camping discs on the trees (look like a yellow blaze disc, but have a picture of a tent and campfire on it), which denote places where backpackers are encouraged to camp -- also, not to be confused with the "no camping" discs, which look the same, except they have a red X over them)
last edited: 10/31/06 7:40:42 PM”

“I live in the Catskill Park & Phantom Lost Soul is pretty accurate about camping.

Dec 21 to March 21 camping is permitted above 3500' but from experience you'll be more comfortable camping out of the wind at a lower elevation in the dead of winter.”

“the hike Psoul laid out is a good one and the mileage isn't too bad. It's about 6 miles to the Slide/Cornell Col from Woodland Valley. There is a good solid climb to Wittenberg, but it's broken up in two climbs.
There is some rock scrambling near the top. The very peak of Wittenberg affords one of the best views in all the 'skills.

The col between Wittenberg and Cornell isn't too deep 200-300 feet and follows a narrow ridge known as the causeway, it's pretty cool. It's probably a remnant of the glacial ice age. There is some good scrambling on the way up to Cornell, lots of fun though. Cornell has a nice view of Wittenberg and the causeway and the best view of Slide (IMO) in the Catskills on the other side. Then it's down into the col. In wet conditions there is water right when you first hit the bottom of the col. In less than wet conditions, it just be a small seep on the trail. IMO, the best campsite in the col (there are 5 or 6) is the second one, but watch out for a pesky porkupine. ( :D )

Another water option is bushwhacking down to the headwaters of the Neversink, or climbing 700' to a reliable spring three quarters of the way up Slide. There is some good scrambling on the way up slide and it's pretty steep in sections, including a section with ladders.

A the Soul man said, the hike down from Slide is easy and the hike to Giant Ledge is moderate at most, with a little bit of climbing on the approach to the Ledge. The Ledge is definitely a sweet spot and you'll rise in the morning with the sun rising if'n you're awake and it's not socked in. Maybe there will be a morning fog down below in Woodland Valley. If'n you're feeling good and want to add to your hike, you can go up to Panther Mountain for some nice views of Phoenicia and the Rt 28 corridor.

From the Ledge, it's all but down hill back to Woodland Valley, with the exception of a good 500' steep climb toward end, fondly known as the stairs of death, you'll know what we mean when you get there.

I guess your trip is some months away, but this is a gem of a hike and you and your sister are sure to love it.

For us midatlantic TTers, it's one of our favorites!”

“Having been one of those who bit off more than I could chew, I have a couple of comments. First is that I appreciate the dilemma. The second is that it is not always a simple lack of training that contributes to the problem. Sometimes, the only way to find out you can't do it is to not be able to do it. The only way to see how some things respond under fire is to put them under fire.

I realize the comments were not directed at me personally and I did not take them as such. When you know you are traveling with newbies it is helpful to be very loose with you own plans. I've been on both ends of it. Part of the wonderful value of a group like this is the way in which we have all been there at one time or another.”

“Thanks for the camping and water details.

Believe me I'm not going to put my sister through a sufferfest. I can read the topography and she lives near that area so understands the terrain in theory. Most likely I'll pick a couple of hikes and she will make the final decision. Of course it's always prudent to have a bailout option and be flexible. Right now my very spare "spare" time is preparing for a weekend trip to the Rockies so I'll pour over the maps more over the next month or so.

Watch for more questions and final route choice. And if she is up for company, a trip posting! It'd be great to meet some of you east coasters!”

“Just remember the weather / temperture changes at higher elevations & often.”