3 climbers fall from Mount Hood

“PORTLAND, Ore. - Three climbers fell off a ledge on Mount Hood Sunday morning, and rescuers were ascending the snowy mountain in an effort to find them, authorities said.

The climbers were in a party of eight people, Strovink said. They were not visible, and they have not been communicating with the remaining members of the party, Strovink said.

Emergency dispatchers received a call for help from someone in the group, which was believed to be at an elevation of about 8,300 feet. Strovink said the climbers have cell phones and were all carrying electronic mountain locator units, but no one has been able to pinpoint their location.

The mountain can be treacherous for climbers, particularly in the winter. In December, search teams scoured Mount Hood for days in the hopes of finding a group of missing climbers alive. The bodies of Brian Hall, of Dallas, and Jerry "Nikko" Cooke, of New York, have not been found. Another climber in their group, Kelly James, of Dallas, died of hypothermia.

The three had set out on a two-day trek, but James called his family to say that the party was in trouble and that his two companions had gone downhill for help. Authorities suspect James suffered a dislocated shoulder, perhaps in a fall.”

“I hope these guys are ok. How reliable and critical are the personal locators? If they use GPS technology wouldn't they know just about were they are located? What are some opinions on them?”

“The technology isn't fool proof, for either the cell phone gps's or the PLD's.

Airplanes have been using ELT's for many years and they don't always work right. They are tools, the men and woman on the ground are the ones who ultimately make the difference......usually.”

“Seems they might have been found....

PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) - Rescuers located three climbers who fell from a ledge on Mount Hood on Sunday and all appeared to be in "relatively decent" condition, a sheriff's spokesman said.

Rescuers were in the process of rappelling about 150 feet down a cliff to reach them, said Jim Strovink, spokesman for the Clackamas County Sheriff's Office.

"We believe all three are in relatively decent" condition, Strovink said. One was believed to be fine; the other two may have concussions, Strovink said.

Five others who were in the climbing party also were located and were on the way off the mountain, he said.

Emergency dispatchers received a call for help from someone in the group earlier Sunday. The group was believed to be at an elevation of 8,300 feet.

The rescue efforts were being complicated by heavy snow and wind on the mountain, but authorities said the climbers were wearing electronic locator devices.

The mountain can be treacherous for climbers, particularly in the winter. In December, search teams scoured Mount Hood for days in the hopes of finding a group of missing climbers alive. The bodies of Brian Hall, of Dallas, and Jerry "Nikko" Cooke, of New York, have not been found. Another climber in their group, Kelly James, of Dallas, died of hypothermia.”

“It sounds like they're okay. I certainly hope so.”

“MOUNT HOOD, Oregon (CNN) -- Three climbers stranded on Mount Hood after falling off a ledge Sunday were found in good condition and will walk off the mountain, a spokesman for the rescuers said.

"Everything they did was right," said Lt. Nick Watt with the Clackamas County Sheriff's Department. "In fact everything the climbers did in this occasion was right which makes the big difference between ... a successful rescue and a recovery."

Watt said the two women and a man are expected to walk down the mountain with rescue teams late Monday.

The climbers used a mountain locator unit which helped rescue teams find them.

The three had huddled in their sleeping bags with a Labrador retriever along for the trip to keep warm as they awaited rescue, according to an official with the rescue team."

I need help understanding how taking a dog up Mt Hood was "doing everything right."”

“A rescuer commented this morning that they don't recommend taking dogs!!!

It still amazes me that anyone would want to climb a mountain like that in such bad weather!!!”

“Whew. Nice to hear some good news - I was hoping this wouldn't end up a repeat of the last Mt. Hood episode!”

“should they be called "climbers" in the story..does that make it more dramatic?
They sounded like "hikers"

and yes there is a difference to me..and should be to anyone

Where can i get a harness and belay device for my dog?”

“Teaching a dog to self-arrest with an ice axe would be a good trick.”

“Looks like most of the climbing community is ripping into these hikers for taking a dog up Mt. Hood.”

“Yep -- I missed what they actually said about the dog. It was a live hotwater bottle?”

“According to CNN.com coverage the dog may very well have saved their lives.

Two sleeping bags for three people gets a mite drafty in those conditions”

“Well, we know about the dogs on Roald Amundsen's push to the South Pole.”

“Maybe they were thinking cut the dog open and putting their frostbitten feet inside if it got to that.”

“I know several climbers with dogs, including myself. None of us would ever take a dog on a serious mountaineering trip.

It's enough to take care of yourself and partner without having to worry about your dog as well.

If you need your rope, ax and crampons to keep you safe, your dog has no damn business being there.

Has anyone heard how much experience these folks have? They strike me more as tourists than climbers.
last edited: 2/20/07 9:49:51 PM”

“one dog nights aren't supposed to be that cold...now a THREE DOG NIGHT....that's cold!”

“I was sitting here waiting for that one Opie!”

“What's the dog's name, Lucky?”

“Has anyone heard how much experience these folks have? They strike me more as tourists than climbers.
last edited: 2/20/07 10:49:51 PM”
mtnsteve
10:48:57 PM
2/20/07

I don't know Mt Hood at all except by recent reputation. Is summiting the only option for trails there or are there loops or other trails that one could use. I have seen no coverage of a summit attempt, or a route they were taking at all. Is it possible they were not planning on summiting? According to the coverage, they did things "right" and certainly knew enough to take the mountain locators.

That dog on youtube was neat. But nowhere near as big as a Lab. If that's the kind of terrain they were covering then I agree... no place for a dog.”

“Mountaineering has gone through the same changes that has happened many other sports. It's been "Dewed" . You use to spend years learning, training and practicing your craft... now you buy some gear, read a book or take a class and call yourself a, rock climber, ice climber or mountaineer.

It don't work that way.

One of the main rules of mountaineering in the past was self rescue. Mountaineering, especially winter mountaineering, can be extremely dangerous. If you go up expecting to be able to call someone to come and get you when you get into trouble, your going to die. You have to rely on you and your partners, not your cell phone or beacon. You need to rely on constant training and practice, not someone else. Granted you may indeed need to call for a rescue, but that should be only a last resort, not the first thing that comes into your head.

I know many, many climbers, real climbers not tourists or posers. All have had epics and been in situations that required extreme measures to get out alive. Not one has ever needed to call for rescue. They relied on their own skills and training to save themselves. Broken ankles, avalanche burial, extreme hypothermia, lost in white out conditions, extreme bodily injuries, you name it....and all have managed to self rescue. I'm not saying it wont happen and I'm not saying you shouldn't call for a rescue if you feel it's needed. I'm saying that 90% of the rescues I see lately would never have happened with proper training.

I can teach anyone here how to rock climb or ice climb in a couple days. I can even teach you the basic skills of mountaineering in a week or two, but that does not make you a climber.
last edited: 2/21/07 9:17:53 AM”

“I just watched these folks on GMA. They don't sound like climbers.

Anyone wonder if this dog caused them to fall?”

“Anyone wonder if this dog caused them to fall?”
mtnsteve
10:16:33 AM
2/21/07

According to the reports I have seen, which admittedly are CNN.com and not knowledgeable folks, the dog went over last. It was unclear to me if the dog was roped in with the three or simply tagging along. It would seem shear ignorance to rope the dog into the group.

Mtnsteve I have a question for you which I ask more out of my own ignorance than anything else. The rescuers are praising these folks for doing everything right. Yet as others reflect and look in hindsight, is that the best thing for the sport? Does it lend credence to the mindset that you mentioned above? If there is a problem you will be rescued. Just bring your cell and the locator? I am not dissing the technology. But what is the responsibility of the SAR folks to be frank and candid about what they see?”

“Climbing the south side of Hood in summer is not a small task, and has rapidly changing weather, steep snow/ice areas, risk of a fall, a few crevasses you could fall in. You need crampons, and most people rope up for the steepest slope, which is above the Hogsback at the highest part of the peak. You can trip on your own crampons, step on a rope and pull a partner off balance, have a step break out and send you sliding, etc. Plus its at a good elevation, so you are very tired, and not thinking so well. Climbing it in the winter adds the risk of avalanche, plus cold, and worse weather. Taking a dog is just nuts, and I would say shows very poor judgement. These are the slopes they would have to drag a dog up, with him cutting his feet on the ice at every step. This is the south side of Hood, in summer (sorry about the lousy quality of the pics). I didn't take any pictures descending the steep part, because I was busy not tripping. One picture is below the steep part, looking up. The other two are above the steep part, looking at the Hogsback.







”

“"Mtnsteve I have a question for you which I ask more out of my own ignorance than anything else. The rescuers are praising these folks for doing everything right. Yet as others reflect and look in hindsight, is that the best thing for the sport? Does it lend credence to the mindset that you mentioned above? If there is a problem you will be rescued. Just bring your cell and the locator? I am not dissing the technology. But what is the responsibility of the SAR folks to be frank and candid about what they see?” Ramblinrev.

I would have preferred to hear one of the rescuers say that having the devices with them made their jobs easier... BUT, if they had proper training they may not have found themselves in that situation in the first place.

I can't blame the rescuer on TV. I've had the cameras in my face and kicked myself later for what I should have said rather than what I did say. It's easy to do.

They are now talking about requiring a transmitter for anyone going over 10,000'. This whole thing is getting blown out of proportion.

In Northern CA, we went on at least 30/40 missions for hunters, hikers, lost kids, Alzheimer's patients, walk aways, fishermen, plane crashes and missing husbands for every climber we were called out for.

It's not the climbers that cause most of the problems, it's the rest of the folks. How would hikers, hunters and fishermen feel if they required transmitters to be carried every time you went out? There are far more searches for hikers, hunters and fishermen that climbers.

Sorry, I'm ranting. We keep talking about this at work, even our customers are asking us what we think. It's just gotten blown out of proportion.

I need a beer.
last edited: 2/21/07 8:10:07 PM”

“Steve,

In no small measure do I consider myself a climber; yes I know how to self arrest, team arrest, climb in a rope, etc (ok technically but never had to arrest seriously). I consider myself a backpacker who occasionally finds myself going up a steep snow covered hill (mountain).

But, everyone I know, including acquaintances who know about my activities are driving me crazy with all of this....why do you go; haven't you learned your lesson; why, why, why oh why!?

I can't even imagine the kind of questions you have dealt with over the years.
last edited: 2/21/07 9:21:10 PM”

“Sandy, I consider you more of a true climber than half the folks I have seen lately.


Chadnsc, on the other side, posted this when someone asked when you could call yourself a mountaineer...

"When can you call yourself a mountaineer? Simple, when you have the skills and knowledge to know when to climb and when to retreat".

I like that.
last edited: 2/21/07 9:43:59 PM”

“After hearing this on the news my wife asked why I don't have a PLB. I said I don't need one and got the look. Then I said it would be different if I climbed mountains in the winter and besides they are $500, and she saw things my way.

Better rant on this site, mtnsteve.”

“You have a wise wife my friend ;-)”