Ron Paul

“There is no doubt that OBL feels threatened by us, not only from our traditions, but from our military power and where we deploy it. - Sarge

He probably does now, post-Afghanistan (if he's still alive), but no, IMO he was not particularly afraid of America pre 9/11, particularly in light of our blunders in the past 3 decades.

For whatever reason, people like Ron Paul are way to self-absorbed and self-centered to be objective about it. Maybe it has something to do with Western White Male Guilt? I don't know about that for sure, but what is definite is that focusing solely on our actions as the cause of terrorism is foolish in the extreme. We're simply not that important to AQ in the big picture.

AQ *wanted* us to attack. They wanted to us to over-react militarily. They wanted us to so enrage the Muslim Street that a transnational muslim caliphate would arise. That was their motivation. It wasn't religion and it wasn't that we had bases (though both were useful tools). This was entirely about THEM, about their quest for power.

And that's why people like Ron Paul are not up to the task of acting on the global stage.”

“Consider a Ron Paul directing this country around all of this mess 20 years ago. Had these people read a little more nonfiction, our lives would be alot simpler about now.

We, 4 1/2% want all the power and the spoils.
last edited: 1/09/08 7:49:16 AM”

“We, 4 1/2% want all the power and the spoils. - uncliff

Western-White-Male-Guilt self hatred in action.

People with PC warped perspectives like uncliff and Ron Paul must never be allowed to control the future of this country.
last edited: 1/09/08 7:53:51 AM”

“A simple matter of proportion proves you wrong.”

“Aaaaannnnd he's back to nonsense again.”

“Please, Sarge, tell me one place CLOSING the borders has made them impervious. Look the Old Soviet borders in Eastern Europe had DEATH traps, land mines, walls, barbed wire..(none of which the American Criminal Leadership Union would allow) yet people did try and did cross year after year.

SO the question is. You close the border, pull back from the world (since if we LEAVE the country our citizens and interests are at the whim of the Islamos) there is NO way that we can remain a free country and totally lock down our borders. THEY WILL GET IN. And we both know one towelhead with a suitcase of certain "items" can kill maybe a hundred, or a thousand Americans. So if it hits say Chicago, or New York or Washington or even West Memphis Arkansas. What will be the estimated hit on our nation? What is the response? Restrictions on personal freedom, tax increases to cover the rising losses and the multiple numbers of new victims (real and imagined)....It is a recipie for failure.

The French tried the Defensive Tactic in 1939...remember the Maginot Line? How'd that work? NOT TOO GOOD.”

“It's fun watching the wing nuts tear eachother apart!”

“It's fun watching a wingnut call the kettle black.”

“I give up. You people have obviously been appointed to be in charge of the world and I'll back away into a wilderness of truth and observe from hillside in peace.”

“He probably does now, post-Afghanistan (if he's still alive), but no, IMO he was not particularly afraid of America pre 9/11, particularly in light of our blunders in the past 3 decades.

The reason that is irrelevant is because he used the fear of America to motivate AlQ. Whether or not he was sincere about it is irrelevant, that WAS his motivating factor for the people who attacked us. It's also irrelevant whether or not he's alive. You asked me a specific question, and I answered that question - not some hypothetical of the future.”

“Obviously, this group took it's que from our fearless leader, the UNITER!!!”

“XL - nobody is suggesting closing the borders and arming the border patrol (NG), would create a seal-tight border. It would prevent MILLIONS from entering each year. The other part of the equation is the enforcement of laws which make being here illegal .... (wait for it) .... illegal.”

“The French tried the Defensive Tactic in 1939...remember the Maginot Line? How'd that work? NOT TOO GOOD

Why do you insist that we become Germany?

Vigilante Nation.
last edited: 1/09/08 8:32:47 AM”

“You asked me a specific question, and I answered that question - Sarge

With two different answers now, yes. LOL.”

“Where are the troops and enforcement at the employee door of illigal employers? The supply side is the real problem.
I'm sorry I saw that on 'the price is right'.
last edited: 1/09/08 8:47:07 AM”

“Whatever Mutt. Here we go again. Why don't you be specific and tell me what the two answers are. You keep claiming I flip-flop, but never provide any specifics.

Maybe I can play that game ... You ... uh .... um .... You always support Hillary Clinton when it comes to domestic policies. How do you explain your dislike for her, yet your seeming total agreement with her on the issues?”

“Sarge: Bin Laden felt threatened by us.

Mutt: No he didn't.

Sarge: Er, he USED fear, and might not have actually felt threatened.

Mutt: make up your mind.

Sarge: #$%@!$$#”

“You asked me about the terrorists.

Whether or not OBL is alive - he used the fear of us, in the form of a threat - to rally AlQ.

If you want to argue he might be dead, or whatever, so be it. The fact is, that was the motivation of "the Islamofascist terrorists hit us on 9/11". Who, incidentally, were led by OBL. That was the motivating factor of the attack.
last edited: 1/09/08 10:33:20 AM”

“Say what you mean!!”

“By the way Mutt, if you don't believe me, do some search of Osama speeches to his "troops" from the 1990s. He states very clearly his distaste for (1) our way of life, and (2) our military presence.”

“Mutt, I say exactly what I mean. It would help if you wouldn't read into it, or take away from it, as you please.”

“Of course, I agree.”

“Ok, so we agree. What was your point in asking me?”

“I was wondering if you agreed with Ron Paul. That's why I asked you about basing being the motivator.

You replied with something about Bin Laden being afraid of US power, and I replied to that tangent.

Then you said that's irrelevent and tried to tie my response to your tangent to the original question.

Don't you just love these converstations? LOL”

“Well, let me just add that I don't agree with EVERYTHING Ron Paul says, but I do on this.

I think where you're misunderestimating me is that you think that now that I'm a Ron Paul supported, I back everything he's ever said and done, and that just isn't true. Just like I'm pretty sure there isn't any candidates that you are lock-step with. 'cept maybe Hillary.”

“And Ron is wrong to pull so much focus on it, as it is not a black-and-white issue.”

“THAT isn't a black and white issue, but the consitution is. At least, that's his position on it. So, being that he's coming from a constitutionalist viewpoint, it makes perfect sense to be certain of any issue - because the constitution is very clear on powers it grants the federal government.”

“Monday morning August 32 1827.”

“Order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to
pick up their welfare checks three days after rioting began. - Ron Paul on the LA riots”

“our country is being destroyed by a group of
actual and potential terrorists -- and they can be identified by the color
of their skin - Ron Paul”

“only about 5%
of blacks have sensible political opinions - Ron Paul”

“I think we can safely assume that 95% of the black males
in [D.C.] are semi-criminal or entirely criminal. - Ron Paul
last edited: 1/11/08 11:10:58 AM”

“Mutt,

Do you want to be honest and tell us who really wrote those quotes, or are you going to use deception to make your case?

Do you also want to tell us what Ron Paul actually said about those quotes, or again, are you going to use deception?”

“He speaks his mind and uses that mind to find solutions for the state of the subjects of you quoted remarks, but I still wonder if he really did say or write those quotes.”

“I know what Ron Paulogists say about the quotes from his newsletter: "Yeah, well, it came from Ron Paul's office claiming to be from Ron Paul, but really it's this ghost writer that he's refused to name, and Ron never did read what the ghost-writer put in the newsletters that was supposed to be Ron's commentary".

What's your version, Sarge?”

“Did you watch the debate last night? He answered your question directly Mutt.

He said he didn't say those things - he doesn't support those quotes - and the people who said those things are hurting his campaign.
last edited: 1/11/08 11:41:12 AM”

“I'm voting for Paul for the monkey wench its throws at the system and at the way the system has corrupted the constitution. I don't know if he is a racist or not, but your partial quote is a far cry from what the whole quote meant ...

Indeed, it is shocking to consider the uniformity of opinion among blacks in this country. Opinion polls consistently show that only about 5% of blacks have sensible political opinions, i.e. support the free market, individual liberty, and the end of welfare and affirmative action.”

“well, that's 1 out of 4, hyway.

And how about Ron blaming Mossad for the WTC bombings?

tsk, tsk.”

“Stormfront sure has a special place in their heart for Ron. And then there's all that money that Ron's taken and not given back when called out on it.”

“Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Mutt!

Where are you going.

Back up a minute dude!

What up with your misquotes of Ron Paul???”

“Right Sarge, I routinely have people write my opinions for me on my office stationery, sign my name, and send it out without ever reading it. Because that's what people worthy of being POTUS do.”

“Exxon money is cleaner.”

“Mutt, nobody (with credibility) is saying he said those things. He publically denounced the people who wrote that. I think you grossly mischaracterized what he feels about those issues. He specifically said he doesn't agree with them ... so your point of saying them is completely mute. But, I see that it might help your cause, too bad you can't use truth to further it.”

“When I was out of Congress and practicing medicine full-time, a newsletter was published under my name that I did not edit. Several writers contributed to the product. For over a decade, I have publically taken moral responsibility for not paying closer attention to what went out under my name. - Ron Paul

At the very least, the guy is a profoundly stupid idiot for letting it go on in his name for 10 years. At the very least. Frankly, his denial that he agrees with those things is very suspect, to put it mildly.”

“Uh, that's not what that says. It doesn't say he let it go in him name for 10 years. He said he's take the responsibility for it, publically, for 10 years ... something that happened 10 years ago.

Again, nice mischaracterization of events Mutt. You seem desperate here to make something out of nothing.

Read it again. Now who is the "profoundly stupid idiot"?
last edited: 1/11/08 11:59:47 AM”

“Sarge's response:

”

“Funny photo aside, read it again. You are wrong.”

“lol at that pic, not because of the way it was used, but because it's funny.”

“Deny something long enough in hopes that people will see it as truth. That's what Ron Paul did, and that's what Paulistinians are doing now.”