Trails you CAN'T hike....

“Private property is private property, but it pisses me off that they can connect to public trails, then deny entry to theirs.....

a GATED COMMUNITY....Keep your asses out of here unless you buy in...and get out of our way when we travel onto city bike and greenways......

http://www.mcmullencove.net/trails.php#”

“Pay them, or pay the goverment. You choose.”

“How is that any different than a private drive that connects to a public street?”

“being in the public highways business that is exactly the thought I had. What people fail to understand is that they can walk on public lands be cause they are OWNED by the public. You can no more walk on private land than you can park in someone else's driveway and sleep in their bed.
last edited: 1/23/08 11:26:20 AM”

“I wouldn't want strange people hiking across my property either. Thats what them signs are for. Anybody can sue anybody for any reason these days.”

“You can no more walk on private land than you can park in someone else's driveway and sleep in their bed.”
hyway
2:22:28 PM
1/23/08

Really, you can't? I guess that explains the screaming and getting chased by police in the middle of the night.”

“I know it seems obvious to most civilized people, but the private part of private property is tough to understand for some people.”

“It's more annoyance at the attitude displayed than the actuality of it all...it started when a collision occured where the private trail enters the greenway (south on the map of trails....) the greenway is the THRU, and has the right of way...but the issue was that the biker on the Greenway was BLOCKING the private trail entry...(He was in MOTION fer cripes sake...) but how DARE he be in the way of someone from "McMullen Cove" (Sarcasm font here).....”

“Thanks, SuperTroll, for the warning about the use of Adobe for the map! Everytime I click on something that uses Adobe, I have to kiss 10 to 30 minutes goodbye!”

“Supertroll... I wonder how much of that is due to the attitudes of the private trail users and how much is due to the attitude of injury lawyers who work on contingency. If they can prove the guy on the thru was at fault, they can seek personal injury compensation. The lawyers probably haven't been on a bike since they were five years old. The private user may be thinking, It won't cost anybody anything cause insurance will pay for it.”

“well thats a different issue than private trails attaching to public trails”

“exactly

we have a lot of private land developments in this area that connect to publicly owned trail. I am not aware of an attitude like supertroll mentioned... but I am aware of the attitude that I mentioned.

I have found private users to be pretty congenial.
last edited: 1/23/08 12:11:26 PM”

“I read in a bike mag. that some places in europe the land can not be posted and people are free to wander in some nice wilderness areas without reprisal unless they are doing things such as littering or destroying property. A refreshing view. In my area are some beautiful streams with spectactular waterfalls that people are not allowed to see. What a shame.”

“Stay off my land.”

“Some ramdom idiot walking on my land could step in an animal burrow, and break his leg. The jerk could sue me and win.”

“fingerslake hiker let me rephrase your post and tell me if its inaccurate.

“I read ... that some places in America the land can not be posted and people are free to wander in some nice wilderness areas without reprisal unless they are doing things such as littering or destroying property. A refreshing view. In Europe there are some beautiful streams with spectacular waterfalls that people are not allowed to see. What a shame.””

“Actually many states have laws protecting the landowner from liability to folks participating in passive recreational pursuits who are permitted users of the premises.

So, at least in PA and NY, if someone walks with your permission through your property on a dirt trail and steps in an animal burrow, they might sue but they won't win.

(And, yes, a marked hiking trail crosses my property in northern PA, so I've looked into this...)”

“The key term is "permitted users".
Your average run of the mill trespasser is the issue.”

“GOOD Lord...is there ANYONE here who has the slightest idea how to "hunker" properly?

Jeeze I have hunted, hiked and camped on private property that was closed off to the owner's FAMILY. Just because I was able to HUNKER properly.....”

“Man old man. I LUV trutspassin!
Some times my daddy says "run ever buddy so we do not get shot and what never!" when we are walkin in the woods aroun heer. BOL!”

“I'm not above a bit of trespassing myself, nor above using closed trails usually they are just closed because the park doesn't have the money to clean them up after a storm), I am just against whining about it when you get caught :).”

“My point is that there is some very nice places in this world that most people dont get to see due to the greediness of one person.”

“I understand your point, but thats world wide and unlikely to change. There are some very nice women in the world that I will never get to enjoy due to the greediness of those women, too. The things I can't have are pretty numerous. I'd rather put my interest into the things I can obtain.”

“Finger I agree...but isn't that the individual's RIGHT? I mean its THEIR property right? Hyway is right...I wish women weren't so stuck up about throwing down a hummer or two (like the last President said its not really sex). And Hey ....do you mind if someone comes into your house, eats your food, and takes what they want?”

“Thanks, SuperTroll, for the warning about the use of Adobe for the map! Everytime I click on something that uses Adobe, I have to kiss 10 to 30 minutes goodbye!�
nowslimmer
1:57:04 PM
1/23/08


Which you point at the map link the file name that appears in the lower left hand of IE clearly shows pdf.”

“My point is that there is some very nice places in this world that most people dont get to see due to the greediness of one person.�
fingerlakeshiker
10:21:22 AM
1/25/08


I know a horse camper that is very putoff at seperate trails. (hiker only) The best parts of the Sipsey Wilderness are hiker only. He's considering using ADA as a possiblilty to fight the hiker only designation. This would also apply to the Smokies which he often rides but half the trails aren't open to him.”

“Horse people destroy trails.”

“That's what I told him. Evidently, the horse trails are in worse shape because of where they're built along the height of a mountain instead of traffic. I had no idea 8) He was quite the expert on hiking trails which is amazing since he physically can't hike and hasn't been on trails that are hiker only.”

“nevermind. you said ada. i assume thats americans disability act
last edited: 1/25/08 9:47:47 AM”

“finger, so everyone but the handicapped should be able to experience these wonders you are being denied? Or do you have more people on your list that won't be allowed to view the wonders you get to view if you have your way?”

“I know a horse camper that is very putoff at seperate trails. (hiker only) The best parts of the Sipsey Wilderness are hiker only. He's considering using ADA as a possiblilty to fight the hiker only designation. This would also apply to the Smokies which he often rides but half the trails aren't open to him.”
dayhiker
11:52:20 AM
1/25/08

There's actually a similar debate going on here. Only substitute horses with atvs. The move is being spearheaded by the atv lobby. Basically they are trying to exploit ADA as a way to reverse the laws that state motorized vehicles are prohibited in wilderness areas.”

“People need to face the Truth that there are just some areas not open to them, be it due to private property or physical limitations.”

“��People need to face the Truth that there are just some areas not open to them

like the girls locker rooms, right, hyway?”

“well, there are peep holes, air vents, windows, surveillance cameras, etc ...”

“Thanks, dayhiker.

However, I'm using Netscape! I just pointed the mouse at the link and did not see anything that would alert me. And I'm not going back to IE. I'll just have to continue to suffer from time to time. I was only irked enough that I had to sound off. I was more mad at myself and I told myself off in some distasteful language.”

“I have a number of local maps I copied @ topozone.com. This area's growth is out of control, and I have little hesitation in regards to exploring many of the yet sizable woodlands up in here, yo.”

“all they can do the first time is ask you to leave”

“Yeah - so I've noticed :)”