JMT 2010

“Thought I'd throw this out for interested parties to consider...

A week, maybe two, on the JMT.

Starting Florence Lake/Muir Ranch, Southbound, Roads End #1 (Woods Creek/Rae Lakes/Bubbs Creek loop), or Roads End #2 (Roads End/Bubbs Creek to Whitney).

Ideally, 3-4 people, moderate hikers (no soldiers) who want an adventure, not a mission.”

“Lightfoot Mocs Highmaintenance and I were talking abut the JMT during our treck through the smokies.

Lightfoot has done it 3 times and has all the maps etc as well as his detailed plans regarding food drops etc..

I am not familiar enough with it to know what section you are talking about, but if I do it I will be ding the whole thing. Maybe we could hook up for your section.

What time frame are you talking about?

'32oz”

“Could be almost any time... pretty flexible at this point, but mid-June to end-July probably a good target...”

“At this stage, I'm thinking early to Mid-July... but I'm pretty flexible. Been putting together my maps, just getting started, and of course, getting excited about the planning...

I'm seriously considering entry by way of Florence Lake. From there, a short stop at Muir Ranch, and on to the JMT, South to Whitney. That's about 100 miles, though a shorter hike cold be had by way of Woods Creek, or Bubbs Creek.

If you're interested, email me.”

“Due to a medical situation within the family, I have had to put all plans for this summer on hold.. I am still hoping to make a trip out west, but as of now I can;t really commit to anything... I hope you have a great trip!!!! Maybe 2011 will be my year....

'32oz”

“I got invited to join some from here for a late July trip from Little YV to Reds Meadow, I guess they have a few openings on their permit. About half the route or more I have covered over the years. Never been up out of the Valley though for the longest stretch I've not been on. Not sure I can make it, work may not be any more. I was invited last summer for a three night trip out of Florence Lake, got to meet the folks next to Muir Trail Ranch, the Ross family. Loved the peace and quiet there and got to soak a bit in the hot spring and the wood fired hot shower. Talk about rustic.”

“obi - Were you planning to stay at Muir Ranch for a night? If so they have restricted dates for thru hikers...you can check it out on their website.

Good luck with your hike!! I have one section left of the JMT myself...not sure when I will finish.”

“Phil, no plans to stay at Muir Ranch... Since I'd probably be entering from Florence Lake, the ranch is just a little too much comfort too soon... but it sure sounds like a nice option. You can bet I'll stop at the hot spring, though... Last time there, was about 6 people buck nekid... always when I'm not prepared... Murphy's Law...

Hikerduane, are you considering doing a section? If I can pull this together, will go N to S...”

“Obiwan,

There is a small bunch of us going out from Reds meadow and finishing at Happy Isles.
Starting on 7/26 and ending up on 8/3 er sumpin like that. We have all our permits and even have a resupply and Toulamaine Meadows set up.

I can send you a map with our route if ya like.

My email is on my profile.

See ya later.

Randall”

“sounds so exciting, i wonder if i would be up for it. my knee is good, but i have been off of the trail since september.”

“obiwan, depends on work. I was asked by the other group, may be Randall's trip. I didn't get all the names. One of my AK 2009 companions mentioned to me from Facebook.”

“Randall, sounds like you have a short one on the agenda, and frankly, I could get into that one as well... 3-4 days? I'd love to see the map... got TOPO! ?

By the way, I've got the old Regional Series of Topo! with several areas in CA., but per an inquiry I sent a few days ago, NatGeo got back to me to inform me they' discontinued the regional series a long time ago... and I have the only - and latest - upgrade they offered.

I had considered looking at the California State package for $100, and considering that it offers the entire state, it could be worth it... not familiar with all the new features, but the series I have works fine, and have just printed out Topo's for the Muir Rand to Whitney segment. I used NatGeo's Adventure paper, and it appears to work very nicely... no bleeding, colors and detail were excellent (1:24,000 printed at 50% scale). Included elevation profiles too for each map's segment, and printed these in a way that I can weave maps together from one section to the next by using, i.e., Map 1 on the front, Map 3 on the back, next sheet Map 2 front, Map 4 reverse... worked out impressively, and required 9 sheets total.

Now, I agree that a larger map with an overall view is a good idea too, and really, I have to ask myself, are maps of the detail I put together REALLY necessary?

Not sure it matters... I like it, weight is quite minimal anyway, and besides, those darn regionals cost me $50 a pop!

Now I gotta work on my recipes...”

“obi - OK on the Muir Ranch thing.

The JMT is so awesome. I've done it in week-long segments and frankly don't think I could fully appreciated it if I did it all at once.

The butt-kicker for me was the high passes section. I wish I had been in better shape for that section.”

“Obiwan,
Ya got mail!!
See ya later.
Randall”

“Randall, got it, thanks!

How do you like the DeLorme topo software?

I've got the Regional Series Topo!, and like it, but it's been discontinued for a more updated version, cannot be upgraded, and at this point, I'm not sure it's compatible with the newer State Series.

If anyone has the NatGeo California State series for Topo!, is it compatible with the 2.7.7 version of the previous series?

I'm sure the latter has more features, but those regionals cost $50 a pop, and I've got 6 different regions plus the GPS USA. I don't really want to spend another $100 on the new version, and suspect for purposes of such well travelled hikes as the JMT, I probably wouldn't need to upgrade anyway.

Thoughts?”

“Just pay googleearth.”

“Thanks, Rosey... such a practical answer... and for $20, I can have the professional version... really, it makes sense. But I so love to play with the topo software!!”

“Obi,

Delorme is very powerful stuff and can do way more than I have time to learn.

It has some bugs but overall it works very well, the 3D option is kinda neat but is really more of a toy than anything else.

I have yet to make it download GPS routes to any other Handheld other than theirs.

It has a lot of cool printing options and supports several different Digital formats like the one I sent you.

I have found that most of their maps have less trails displayed than TOPO's and when you zoom in you can get lost rather easily.

Best use comes with a big monitor.

It seems to me that any of these mapping software’s should come with a universal converter so that you can email GPS routes (Like the one I sent you) to your friends and they can down load to their Handhelds
So far TOPO seems to be the best at that!!

See ya later.
Randall”

“I've been in contact with the NatGeo folks, who produce the TOPO! software, and whom also originally purchased the business from Wildflower Productions. Unfortunately, they tell me the prior Regional Series will not be receiving any further upgrades, the last of which was offered more than 3-4 years back.

Even more aggravating is the fact that while the original TOPO! Regionals do support GPS, and can be downloaded to several models - like my Garmin 12CX - these are older model GPS which are probably only available now through Ebay or some aftermarket place that sells 'em cheap. Newer models - like the Garmin 60 CSX I'm considering - are not supported by the older series, thus forcing anyone who wants a topo program compatible with newer models must also buy the newer software.

I suppose it's the nature of capitalism, but it still pi**es me off.

The folks at NatGeo/TOPO! emailed back asking a few other questions before they offer their perspective, but I doubt they'll have anything useful, other than to say "Gotcha! Gotta buy our software if you wanna dance!"”

“Thus explains my curent use of Delorme!!!”

“I was right...

Sometimes I hate being right...

Sometimes I don't like whoever it is that PROVES I'm right...

Being right doesn't always make me happy...

Being right, right NOW, makes me furious...

Well... it at least frosts me pretty good...



I get an email back today from National Geographic, the present provider of the NatGeo TOPO! software, and it's very short, terse, and matter-of-factly informs me there's no way the previous versions can be upgraded to assure compatability with current GPS units, specifically, the Garmin 60CSx I've been considering.

Dear obiwan_canoli,

Thank you for contacting National Geographic Maps,

These products are all part of the Regional Series. They can only be upgraded to version 2.7.7. They will not work with the Garmin 60CSX

Technical Support
National Geographic Maps

So then I fire off a reply, asking them to offer some idea of how long they'll provide support for the current version of their software, before they twist another couple hundred out of me to "upgrade" that one? And on it goes...

Maybe it's just me, having already popped for $400 worth of their previous versions - not including the cost of the Garmin GPS I also bought - but it's inevitable that GPS will continue to evolve, as technology offers opportunities to include more features. Yet despite the effectiveness of the older TOPO! series, no further upgrades which would include newer technology (i.e., the 60 CSx) are available.

If you wish to upgrade to newer technology, it's simpler and more profitable for them to require newer (read: Revenue-Generating) software with which to use it. Forget about Customer Support... it's all about geting them back in line for another run at the register...

Forgive me... I'm just a little pi**ed off right now... And no, I don't care to be stuck in the past, and yes, they deserve to make a profit on sh*t they sell. If it's the only choice they leave me with, I'll have to accept it, and move on.

But I STILL hate being right.”

“OBI,
Send me yer home address and I'll send you the Delorme disk. It will take a while to learn though and as I explained it very poor at transferring routes.
See ya later.
Randall”

“Done - thanks, I'll give it a thorough look-see!”

“Unless you are planning to go cross country or off trail there really is no reason to carry a GPS while hiking the JMT. The only way I could see getting off track would be going through one of the passes during a snow storm. I used the Tom Harrison maps when we hiked it and they were excellent:
http://www.tomharrisonmaps.com/online%20order.html
last edited: 2/26/10 5:28:23 PM”

“So does Google Earth do 3D?

I have a friend who tells everybody interested in the JMT that Vermillion Valley Resort is much more hiker-friendly than Muir Ranch.

You should put this on the trips page. Maybe I'd hike in from Onion Valley to meet ya.”

“gforce, I agree. But aside from being a gadget freak, I believe it offers a perspective you can't get from a map (and vice versa, of course). Such a well traveled route wouldn't need the weight of the added technology, and yet, things have a way of happening on a hike...

I wouldn't do that kind of hike without a map, and as you note, the Harrison Maps are pretty good. I suppose I'll never get over the 'nology thing, but for the peace of mind it offers, I'm willing to carry the extra 7 ounces...”

“I've heard from Paige who is in our group of CA bpers. She loves VVR, just take some money if planning on chowing down there or snacking. With the ferry and avoiding some of the hot, south side of the canyon Muir Trai Ranch is in, VVR is a good option. I met some of the Ross's who have the place next to MTR last summer. Loved hearing stories.”

“Randall -

Got the disk today... thanks. Will load it up this weekend and let you know hoiw it goes.”

“Check out my TOPO! thread...

Looks like I'm going to be able to test both products. Thanks to you, I have the opportunity to check out something I've not tried before, and wonder how it will compare to the TOPO! I've not only been using these last several years, but the new NatGeo TOPO! software that's soon to arrive.

In any case, just a note of thanks to you, as I contemplate another hike on the JMT...”