ecOnOmic Stimulush

“Y2 everything you propse INCREASES Government interfereance, and time and again Government has been shown to screw it up EVEN worse.”

“So where do you guys put what has happening in the past couple of years.

Are you saying that things didn't need a last-minute rescue from governments all over the world to prevent a total collapse?”

“I think there are some strong arguments in support of the ideology you guys put forward, but that they break down when confronted with reality, and we've partially seen the consequences of that.

I don't think extremism works in any form.”

“I'm not avoiding your question at all Sarge - I've answered it. You didn't like the answer. It's an ongoing work in process as it will continue to be. We're what, nine months in with a minority party in congress blocking and delaying all they can.”

“No, y2, you have not answered it. I asked you about the paradox that Obama's policies have mysteriously changed the economy around, yet you can't name anything he's actually enacted to do that.”

“oh, sure then, the stimulus is at least doing part of what it intended.

The banking sector has stabilized thanks to government action and the risk of system collapse had receded somewhat.

A degree of stability has returned and we shouldn't underestimate the value of that in a time of crisis.

You want more.

Long term.

Changes in Energy policy
Investment in the future
Some planning for the future.

Energy policy is a big one because it ties into so many other areas in domestic and foreign affairs.”

“It is entertain trying to watch you lure people into one of your 'Gotchya's' though. I imagine you're sitting there with a few links to conservative websites with evidence that the stimulus isn't working.

You thought you had one when you found that old quote from me earlier didn't ya?
last edited: 10/30/09 9:10:10 AM”

“y2, again, all theoretical - what change to our government has there been?”

““It is entertain trying to watch you lure people into one of your 'Gotchya's' though. I imagine you're sitting there with a few links to conservative websites with evidence that the stimulus isn't working.”


I'm done with you y2. I thought we could get through this without that. Between you and Tilt's crap, I'm done for now.”

“Why don't you actually say what you think Sarge. Why don't YOU say YOU think there's been no change?”

“Well say what you think and stop trying to play people and we wouldn't get to this point time and time again would we.

Instead of trying to get me to say something just say what you think.

Other people do it, why not you?
last edited: 10/30/09 9:15:36 AM”

“I didn't "play" you y2. Remember, you are the one who suspected that I WOULD "play you". I didn't do anything you just accused me of that I was going to do. You are paranoid with your whole "gotcha" thing above.

as far as ME saying ... about no change, I answered that directly, unless he deleted that too.”

“This is why we always end up going round in circles.

You're more interested in proving liberals wrong that you are about whether America has really changed or is really changing. Certainly on here anyway.

If you're not, why the hell did you dig out a nearly two-year-old thread to try and get some sort of 'gotchya' moment - proving my hypocrisy was it? That I was against deficits before I was for them.
last edited: 10/30/09 9:25:04 AM”

“XL - god bless him - constantly tries to get a rise out of me too. But at least he puts his views out there for all to see.”

“y2, you constantly telling people what their motives are is why we're done here. It's so old.”

“Well stop playing the same games them.

Just tell people why you think there's been no change then.”

“y2, what can I say? My post was deleted. Ask your buddies if you want it.”

“Who? I have no idea what you're talking about.
last edited: 10/30/09 10:30:41 AM”

“exactly”

“No, I mean .... are they in the room with you now. What are they saying, what are they telling you to do? ;op”

“yup! ;)”

“Yawl are going in circles, because always one of you is dragging the 200+year old Constitution/BoRs with one foot and a 2000+year old bible with the other.”

“Y2...are you asking why I don't think the recent "end of whatever" does not signal a change?

THERE HAS been no change since the mid 2000's because each event has been greeted as an excellent chance to enlarge Government. This whole "big government vs small government" was solved when Cornwallis wet himself at Yorktown.”

“So things were much better in the 90s then XL?”

“Y2 the nineties were in the midst of the greatests PEACE time economic boom in history. Even the incompetent handling of Bush I -The Dawning of Moderation, the total absence of responsibility in Clinton and the follow up of BUSH II - showing the world you can screw up as bad as your father the boom lasted (and would have) if not for some actions of certain people to mortgage our future to pay off certain voters.”

“Okay now in the news....http://apnews.myway.com/article/20091029/D9BKMVMG0.html


WASHINGTON (AP) - An early progress report on President Barack Obama's economic recovery plan overstates by thousands the number of jobs created or saved through the stimulus program, a mistake that White House officials promise will be corrected in future reports.

The government's first accounting of jobs tied to the $787 billion stimulus program claimed more than 30,000 positions paid for with recovery money. But that figure is overstated by least 5,000 jobs, according to an Associated Press review of a sample of stimulus contracts.

The AP review found some counts were more than 10 times as high as the actual number of jobs; some jobs credited to the stimulus program were counted two and sometimes more than four times; and other jobs were credited to stimulus spending when none was produced

So right here we see in the lamestream media that the lies are so blatant even they cannot choke it down.

SO Y2 what happens in a few months when we discover that it was a LIE about the "figures of the 3 Quarter"?

Most likely the libbies will blow it off...but ...but...would a republican president get the same break?”

“Secret, secret, I've got a secret.....

~Styx, Mr. Roboto”

“Looks like someone's asleep at the wheel.........”

“THE incredible BRILLIANCE of Liberal Socialist thinking.

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9CF8SIO0&show_article=1

WASHINGTON (AP) - President Barack Obama outlined new multibillion-dollar stimulus and jobs proposals Tuesday, saying the nation must continue to "spend our way out of this recession" until more Americans are back at work.


Just Incredible Economics...so if you get laid off, ZIP ZERO NADA income coming in...you....TAKE OUT A LOAN ON YOUR KIDS!

"Sorry Junior, Daddy is out of work, but he wants that new Porsche so BAAD that he is going to get a credit line on you. Yes you will be paying for the next 25 years...but hey its not about you its about DADDY needin a fix."
last edited: 12/09/09 6:00:21 AM”

“[url]http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/71353-mark-penn-got-6-million-from-stimulus[url]

Hillary`s buddy get 6 mil from stimulus”

“LOL...like a third world Junta...more and more like the debacle in Rhodesia and South Africa...LOL”

“But, who on this board will do anything other than b!tch about it and then go out and vote for the other corrupt party in the next election- that`ll fix everything.”

“LOL..remember a year ago when (after the dems had just had the last two previous years in the Congress) everyone was saying "It can t get any worse."?”

“who do you vote for salebored?

(not expecting a straight answer)”

“You answered your own question perfectly as usual.”

“for one who does not admit to voting, you sure do a lot of complaining about other peoples' votes”

“Because I`ve said I have`nt voted for a Dem or Rep for 30 years you assume I do not vote. Well, you`re right, I had just as well not voted, but at least, I can sleep at nights knowing I didn`t elect the parade of fools that have haunted DC for that time.
Until 2008, I voted Libertarian since 1980, but this time I couldn`t check Bob Barr and wrote in Ron Paul instead.”

“SALEBORED WROTE IN A RE-PUB-LI-CAN!!!
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SALEBORED WROTE IN A RE-PUB-LI-CAN!!!
SALEBORED WROTE IN A RE-PUB-LI-CAN!!!
SALEBORED WROTE IN A RE-PUB-LI-CAN!!!”

“

”

“streeeeeeeeetch”

“You dudes must be Cubans, having to use TTpages for TP=TT=TP.”

“Obama administration predicts $30B loss on auto bailout

http://www.detnews.com/article/20091208/AUTO01/912080414/Obama-administration-predicts-$30B-loss-on-auto-bailout”

“U.S. already $292 billion in the red this year - CBO
Fri Dec 4, 2009 6:11pm EST



WASHINGTON, Dec 4 (Reuters) - The U.S. government racked up a gaping shortfall in the first two months of this fiscal year after posting a record budget deficit last year, congressional analysts said on Friday.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN0418093920091204”

“This is HILARIOUS. Okay we remember how all the libbies on this thread denied that part of the reason for the mortgage loan failure was that certain Senators (Dodd, Frank et al) were encouraging banks to make unsafe loans.......

SOOOOO..Lets reset the clock at ZERO.

http://www.finreg21.com/news/banks-face-pressure-reach-out-underserved-fdic-survey-documents-gap

Regulators will be bringing pressure on banks to make greater efforts to serve poorer communities after an FDIC survey showed that more than a quarter of U.S. households have little or no financial activity through banks.

i.e. they can't develop capital to pay their mortgage but its the FREE MONEY ...someone else can cover the loss.”

“part of the reason for the mortgage loan failure was that certain Senators (Dodd, Frank et al) were encouraging banks to make unsafe loans.......

Don't forget lawyer Obama who sued for that very thing in the 90s.”

“You can blame congress, the dems, the reps, the gays, the commies, the minorities, but lets not forget the Fed, AppraisersRus and Moody's, S&P and Fitch and their bundled messes and most importantly the bottom line price. Yes, price, price and price-up your location.”

“you selling on the cheap?”

“I'm tired of our psydo complicated crap finance. People with nothing better to do than watch TV and have a couple of brews could solve this better than the MBAs that are destroying this country.

Global Warming is being handled exactly like the real estate market. Get as far away from facts as you can and bring in a bunch of complicated crap to make the situation some kind mysterious gawd guided plot.”

“The numbers are in ....the stimulus was A MISERABLE FAILURE!!!!!

http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAnalysis/Article.aspx?id=517874

On Tuesday, the Treasury estimated that taxpayers had lost $68.5 billion in the fiscal year ended Sept. 30, 2009, on the Troubled Asset Relief Program and that the losses could go as high as $120 billion.

That isn't imaginary cash stuffed under some government cushion. It's a tax on you that comes straight out of your pocket. It's money that won't be used to fund private-sector jobs or pay for a child's education or a new house. It's gone.

Meanwhile, the Federal Reserve says it earned $45 billion last year � the largest one-year profit in its 96-year history.

As the Washington Post points out, that will easily eclipse "the expected profits of Bank of America, Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan Chase combined."

Why the big Fed profit? Basically, it printed money, bought Treasuries and private bonds with what it printed (we called it a bailout), then watched as interest on the investments flowed in. At year-end, the Fed held $1.8 trillion in U.S. government debt and mortgage securities, up from $497 billion a year earlier.

Don't worry, though. The Fed doesn't keep the money. It goes to the Treasury � which will just spend the money on something else.

All of this only underscores how badly the so-called stimulus has turned out. After trillions of dollars in outlays by the Fed, Treasury and Congress, the U.S. has zero net new jobs to show for it. Zip.

In fact, jobs at private businesses shrank by 4 million in 2009.

Nor have banks started lending to small and midsize businesses. Commercial and industrial loans, the lifeblood of U.S. industry, fell $252 billion, or nearly 16%, from January through November.

Why aren't profitable banks lending to businesses? Good question. For one thing, like the Fed, banks have found a sure thing in round-tripping bailout funds provided at virtually zero interest into Treasuries yielding 3%. No risk, all gain.”