Which Camera for Alaska?

“So...I had my heart somewhat set on purchasing a new Digital SLR, leaning towards the Olympus (for a variety of reasons.)

BUT....

after discussing with several previous attendees of the Alaska trip, I am learning that P&S may be the better way to go.

So....thoughts, suggestions on which camera? Input greatly appreciated.

I currently have a Nikon Coolpix P&S, which is ok for taking social pics, etc., but I am not happy with the delays I experience with it. It can be very SLOOOOOWWWWW.

So....a high quality P&S??? Anyone? A little help please?

:)”

“Panasonic LX3?”

“Pentax K7... check out this photo...

http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/albums/userpics/10002/_2MG0181.jpg”

“esprcorn....at what price?”

“You can get the K7 and kit lens (all weather, dust and cold sealed) for about $1050 after rebate... from Amazon...

It's an amazing camera... Nothing it it's class is close in price.”

“How 'bout a bear cam?
http://www.bear.org/website/visit-us/lily-den-cam.html”

“It depends on if you guys are basecamping or backpacking. Basecamping I would no doubt take an SLR and several lenses and a big sturdy tripod. Backpacking I will never repeat that mistake, I'd get Canon SX1IS (full 1080p HD video, 28-560mm (wide and super long), and 4 frames per second all for half the cost of an SLR with a very limited range kit lens. Of course, you could always rent a couple of nice lenses online if you go the base camping/SLR route. IMHO it would be worth the investment to rent quality glass and you gotta start you camera gear somewhere. Consider used as well.”

“Thanks...great input so far.

Dub, we are backpacking, so portability is definitely a factor. This is the main reason I am rethinking the SLR idea.”

“Dub, any comments about this one? http://www.amazon.com/Canon-PowerShot-SX20IS-Stabilized-Articulating/dp/B002LITT3I/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1264774240&sr=8-2”

“What about Olympus EP1. Micro 4/3 is a good middle ground between SLR and P&S, though not that much lighter than their small SLRs to be honest.

P&S you could look at a Panasonic LX3 or Canon S90.

Although maybe you want something with a little more reach for the wildlife?”

“Backpacking with a DSLR is very doable... so long as you don't take tons of equipment.

I have a lowepro belt pack that holds my DSLR and up to two extra lenses comfortably on my waist. Typically I only carry one extra lens and use the other pocket to hold cleaning equip, extra batteries, etc...

I have a small Slik Sprint Pro II tripod which is very light and easily stores in or tied to my pack.

Granted I'm adding maybe 6-8 lbs to my overall load, but it is worth it. I would definitely take a DSLR to Alaska...

Pentax K7”

“Another fine high end P&S is the Cannon G11.”

“Dayhiker, that camera would be great as well. A model similar to that one was my backup camera or assistants camera when I started doing paid photography. You can get some great shots with them. The best advantage is the reach, you have 28mm which is wide (with my SLR I carry a 10-22mm $700 lens) so it's not ultrawide but wide enough for the novice to get good open shots. It's also long, at 560mm you can shoot very far away if it's bright, I carried a 70-200mm f/2.8 IS L in Alaska, 3lbs and $1700 new. So your reach with that P&S would be farther but I could shoot in way less light. This camera also only shoots at 1fps, so if you're trying to take a bunch of pictures of something quickly you can't. Like the other Canon it can shoot a picture at 1/3200 of a second so don't worry about fast moving objects, you can almost stop the prop on the airplane with that. The only other difference between it and the more expensive model is that it doesn't shoot in RAW like an SLR or have 1080p HD video.

My SLR can shoot at 800ISO without any grain while those smaller P&S cameras and other mentioned here start to get grainy around 400ISO.

Also, if you are shooting with an SLR in a JPG mode and not in RAW then you might as well take a P&S. Shooting in JPG reduces any SLR to an expensive P&S which is what most of the public wants since they believe a better camera means they'll have better pictures. RAW is how the pros do it but you have to process each image afterwards. If you're unwilling to process the images properly but rather have the camera make decisions for you then you might as well get a P&S. Otherwise you won't be able to easily draw out the best parts of your image and you lose almost all of your lighting levels, tonal values, clarity, contrast and file size by shooting in JPG.”

“Another thing besides the weight to consider is how are you going to carry an SLR? Try carrying it around your neck for a day and see how it feels....not great. So you strap on a case to the side of your pack...then you can't access the camera quickly and may miss out on photos. So you get a syncpack or another bag that attaches to your chest....again you lose the ability to have it ready fast and you have something bulky on your chest that may make it hard to hike.

I choose to be a bit uncomfortable and after trying all of those methods above, the best way to carry an SLR is around your neck or strapped loosely to your shoulder straps with the lens cap off so you can shoot immediately. The camera will bounce around a lot. In Glacier 07 Chinmusic brought a strap that hooked around his chest to keep it from bouncing, it didn't take much weight off the back of his neck but no bouncing and fairly quick access. This is the best method if you're afraid of missing shots.

Here's a pic of us in Alaska.

Notice Pug in the red with his SLR and chest bag. You want fast access to you camera, lenses, batteries, and cards otherwise you might miss shots, so all of that goes on your chest. Each of our syncpacks weighed around 10lbs especially if you used a pocket for a gun or water. None of us were comfortable.

Chin also has a syncpack for his SLR and gear, notice it at the top of his bag?

Look how worn out everyone looks and this was around mile 3 for the day. Alaska is extremely difficult to hike in the lower areas. You will be crossing tussock which means you will be stepping really high and negotiating each step carefully. Fridge really needs to give all of you guys a lecture on tussock, it will whip your butt worse than anything you've experienced.

Next pic:



Notice that Duane is the only one of us standing. He did it smart, went UL, high end P&S that could hang comfortably around his neck and have fast access too. I think he was a lil cold though ;-) Warmer sleeping bag next time?

Fridge is on the ground tired as well. He also has a front pack. He was the only one who liked it. That field/valley may look flat but it's not, it's tussock 1 mile over tussock is easily equal to 2-3 over trailer. Not joking.

Now, consider what I've said I'm a big advocate of people breaking out of the JPG/P&S regime and getting SLRs and learning how to use them, how to compose photos, how to process them and how not to bore people with tons of mindless images of the same things.

I took 64GB of memory with me because I didn't want to run out. In Glacier I shot over 1000 photos a day. I assumed I'd take more in beautiful Alaska. In a week I only took 1100.

We were always on the move. The group did not have time for us to stop and spend a lot of time taking photos. You didn't want to get separated too far from the group because if you got lost, you were screwed. Fridge had the only Sat phone and that's the only way to let them know where you are, find the nearest air strip, and get out. There are no marked trails, it rained on us every day or snowed. The terrain was the most difficult terrain I've ever been on in my life.

Usually on a trip I take 8-10 hours to get to camp. I stop wherever I want, take pics, get the tripod out, get the shot I want, etc. This trip ain't a "hike your own hike" trip. You really really don't want to get lost out here. The third day Pug, Chin and I (camera guys) got stuck in a canyon for an hour putting us way behind the other group, they couldn't go on any further until we caught up some due to the risk of getting lost or hurt or in a bad situation.

If this trip wasn't so difficult, and was on trail, and there wasn't much that could go wrong by getting separated then I would have probably came home with close to 10,000 photos hoping maybe to have 100 outstanding photos. Which is why I brought several batteries and 64gb of memory (I usually shoot 16-24 just at a wedding).

Now, knowing that I like for people to get an SLR (I use Canon but think you can be successful with Canon or Nikon and should stick to those brands) I really believe you will be more comfortable and get many more good pictures with a P&S that has a wide angle and a big zoom.

Alaska was the most difficult trip I've ever been on, I hated it while I was there, but after the fact I am glad I did it and I would consider going back someday but one of the things I would change is if we were backpacking I would not bring an SLR due to weight and being able to access it and use it properly. I took some great photos out there but I could probably have done more with a P&S which is the first time I've ever said that.”

“The other thing and this is my last point is weather. It rained, rained rained and was cloudy everyday but the last one we were there. So think about how you plan on keeping your SLR and lenses dry? It's an expensive mistake to let it get really wet though most are sealed and can get a little wet...we got really wet. If you get cloudy weather like we did photo ops drop to a minimum, everything looks dreary. Which is why our SLRs were like rocks in our backpacks most of the days.”

“Dub....GREAT info...thanks for your input.

What do you think about the new "evil" cams...mirrorless, smaller...pricey.

I've seen reviews on GF1, NX10 and PEN -

Anybody have hiking/backpacking experience?”

“I am skeered now Dub, thanks!

I am taking Canon sx110 IS




http://reviews.cnet.com/digital-cameras/canon-powershot-sx110-is/4505-6501_7-33240754.html


last edited: 1/29/10 11:01:08 AM”

“I think the mirrorless "SLRs" (they're really not SLRs because you don't look through the lens) are another attempt at gaining business from more P&S users with money who want to get a camera they think will make their pictures better. This is why a camera like the GF1 comes with "scene" modes--for amateurs, to make them think they'll get a better picture. Again, its' too much for a user to actually learn to set the aperture and shutter speed and ISO, it's the concept of "you'll get better pictures with a more expensive camera."

I do like the fact that they have full size SLR sensors (some of them do, some don't). Most camera companies spend millions designing their sensors and to slap it in a virtual P&S is pretty good. However, the point of an SLR is too look through the lens so what you see is what you get if you set your camera correctly and to have fast access to all of the exposure controls.

I would avoid the EP1 and Sony's due to in-body image stabilization. Optical image stabilization has proven to provide sharper images with more contrast and be more accurate. That means better photos by not stabilizing in the body of the camera.”

“Hi Amy.....Long time.
If you're happy and comfortable with Nikon take a look at their high end P&S cameras, they have come along way with a lot less hesitation after shutter release. I'm a Canon guy and if I was looking for a P&S....I would be looking at the Canon G11. I'm sure Nikon has something very similar too.”

“OK....I think it is back to the camera shop for me. Just like any other backpacking gear I buy, there is only so much research I can do online, before I have to go and actually fondle the equipment.
:)”

“AmyG is going to fondle the equipment.

I just hope Gremlin doesn't see this.”

“For a great P&S you may also look at Sigma. They are one of the only (or maybe the only) companies to use a full size DSLR sensor in their P&S.
http://www.sigmaphoto.com/cameras/dp2.asp
last edited: 2/01/10 6:58:32 AM”

“Two things for Alaska - have at least a 10x zoom on your camera, and bring good binoculars. A lot of the wildlife you'll see will be a long way away. You'll be able to watch it with your binocs and take decent pictures with a good zoom on your camera.”

“I wouldn't take a long zoom lens on the hiking part of the trip. It's just too dang heavy and I think I used it once. IMO, stick with 17-105 range. I used the 17-40 for the vast majority of my shots.

I did enjoy having a quality binocular with me.

I might take a long zoom to Alaska and have it ready for shots on the drive there or a side cruise from Anchorage.”

“Hey Amy, I use a Nikon P90 . its one of their higher end P&S cameras. it takes AMAZING pictures. around 450 bucks with a 24x zoom lens. ill have it at FYAO so u can check it out.”

“jackstraw....are you propositioning me to fondle your equipment? LOL

;)”

“AmyG - nope. just for you to gaze upon it with awe. what happens after that is entirely beyond my control. LOL”

“hey I also saw a new nikon l100 that's worth a look see for about half the price”

“LOL js!”

“well...after seeing what jackstraw's equipment can do, I am impressed! Actually, I think the entire group was in awe....
;)”

“Nothing worse than an awed group, and it looks like you have one:)”

“Personly, I like my olympus Stylus1030SW, Water,freeze,shock drop, PROOF. Underwater is awesome. However its not A SLR. But great camera foer the all around outdoor enthusist! Yo bear! Wish I could go:(”

“A friend of mine had to tell me about the Fujifilm HS 10.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/1002/10020206fujifinepixhs10series.asp

* High Resolution super wide Fujinon 30x optical zoom (24-720mm) with manual (mechanical) zoom
* True wide-angle and extreme telephoto capture in a single compact unit
* Triple image stabilisation (sensor shift IS, high ISO IS, Digital IS)
* 10 MP BSI CMOS sensor with advanced shooting modes and high image quality
* 3.0” High Resolution tilting LCD
* Electronic Viewfinder with eye-sensor for automatic switching
* High speed 10 fps continuous shooting at full resolution and new motion-tracking auto focus
* Full HD (1080p) movie capture with stereo sound
* Super High Speed movie capture at 1000 fps
* Motion Panorama mode for ‘one shot’ sweeping panoramas
* Advanced capture modes including unique Motion Remover mode that removes tourists and other moving objects from your photographs
* Direct Shooting Command buttons and Command dial put advanced photographic features at your fingertips
* RAW and JPEG capture modes

So now I have to wait to see this one and what type of IQ.

DARN HER!!!”

“I've been waiting for that camera to come out too to see what kind of reviews it gets. I think it takes 4 AA batteries though.

Nikon P100 will be out soon too. 27x zoom but no RAW images. $100 cheaper than Fuji.”

“Thanks Tango....now I have another one to look at. ;)

I am anxious to see reviews on the Nikon P100 also. Plus, Olympus has a new 30x zoom coming out next month as well....looks like I will wait a few more weeks before I make the purchase.”

“grrrg yes it does take 4 AA's. The Nikon falls short on all the in camera cool shots that the Fuji can take and the Fuji is a manual zoom. I already had a comparison and the Nikon fell short. It all comes down to the image quality at the long end of the zoom. The Fuji is also 5 oz heavier.
Here are the diff specialty shots the Fuji can take:
Auto, SR, Adv, SP1, SP2, PANORAMA, C, P, S, A, M Portrait, Portrait Enhancer, Landscape, Sport, Night, Night (Tripod), Fireworks, Sunset, Snow, Beach, Flower, Text, Natural Light, Natural Light & with Flash High Speed Movie (60/120/240/480/1000fps), SR AUTO (Scene Recognition Auto), Motion Panorama, Best Framing, Frame No. memory, Histograms, Zoom Bracketing, Best frame capture, Face Detection (with Auto red-eye removal), Pro Low-light, Motion Remover, Multi Motion Capture, Silent mode

Here is the Nikon:
Intelligent Auto, Program Auto, Sensor-Shift Image Stabilization, Panorama, Beauty Mode, Magic Filter, Scene Modes (1. PORTRAIT, 2. LANDSCAPE, 3. SPORT 4. NIGHT SCENE. 5. NIGHT+PORTRAIT, 6. INDOOR, 7. CANDLE, 8. SUNSET, 9. FIREWORKS, 10. MULTI-FIREWORKS 11. MULTIPLE EXPOSURE 12. CUISINE, 13. DOCUMENTS, 14. BEACH & SNOW, 15. BIRD WATCHING 16. SOFT BACKGROUND SHOT, 17. PET), HD Movie Magic Filter(Pop Art, Pinhole, Fisheye, Drawing)

Hey no problem AmyG you can thank me later (like I plan to do with my friend)!!! I like to pass on the pain! It will be out in March so I am waiting for the reviews, but unless they are horrible I think I've made up my mind.”

“Since the edit feature is not working the list for the Nikon is wrong. That list is for the Olympus SP 800 UZ which is also a 30x coming out soon.”

“oooooh, the new Olympus model is out and it is purdy!!! :)”

“Tell us more about this purdy camera?”

“So I pulled the trigger and now own an HS10. I haven't had a chance to really do much with it but I'm taking it on a trip this weekend on the Foothills Trail. I'll post some pictures when I'm back.

I also have a Nikon D3000. Trying to decide which one to bring to Alaska...”

“Let me know what you think of the HS10. I am really interested in that camera. I hardly pulled out my EOS in Utah and it shows.”

“Well???? You've been home a whole day already!!! Whatcha think of the HS10???”

“Well???”

“I want one.”

“I do too. I am about to push the button! But I really did want to hear about trail use!”

“http://www.ambientweather.com/wy16018645.html
Cheapest I've found so far not in stock yet”

“Ok, sorry, work getting in the way of life. While it's definitely not a slr it is a very nice camera. I'm probably not the best person to comment on the image quality but here are a few I took this weekend...







”

“Great opportunities for HDR there.”

“Very nice pics. What did you think of it on the trail? Battery life? Heavy? Thanks.”

“It is about the same size as a smaller dSLR so it is maybe a little heavy but it didn't really bother me. I'm still using the same alkaline batteries that came with it and probably took about 120 pictures or so. Continuously autofocusing will drain the batteries so you have to watch for that.

I think for the price it's worth investigating the purchase of an entry level dSLR with an additional 50-200mm non vr lens for $100-$200 more. There is not a huge difference in 30x zoom and 200mm. I'm not sure which would be better on the trail but it's at least worth looking into. Might miss a bear shot at 200 yards while switching lens.”