yet another shooting. again. still. anot her.

“"should we change our name to the 'National Association for the Advancement of African Americans'?"

"NAAAA."”

“Good post 'Toast.”

“rad, you crack me up. somebody's going to hear me laughing and i'll have to get back to work.”

“wow, I can't believe how ignorant some people are about racism and bigotry. To get a first hand look at how they rationalize their prejudice is pretty interesting and creepy. Some people need to learn not to post that cr@p in a public forum if they want any respect at all. Even more interesting is to see people who are bigoted against homosexuals criticize racists. Unbelievable. And then to have people who can't stand organized religions comment on any of this is just utterly incomprehensible.”

“mutt--huh?”

“mutt--huh?

Not to start a war (which, I am sure, this will--who cares?) but one first needs to look at the definition of "bigot"--it means, basically, someone who adheres strictly to their own beliefs. So, even the gay-rights folks are bigots.

Big difference between homosexuals and races--people are born whichever race they may be; homosexuality is a choice. Now, I could go into a very scientific explanation as to how this is true, but for now, LET THE WARS BEGIN!!

Grenade!”

“Kids are being shot and you (we) don't care enough to not let this thread become a p!ss!ng match.

AMF”

“flyguy--see my soapbox post about 10 posts ago (same thread).

by the way, how is anything we do in this thread going to change what kid is going to do with a gun? don't get me wrong (you can tell from my previous post my position) I care, but let's all think rationally--this chat room is going to *save* no one. we're merely venting/conversing/trolling, etc.”

“flyguy--see my soapbox post about 10 posts ago (same thread).

by the way, how is anything we do in this thread going to change what a kid is going to do with a gun? don't get me wrong (you can tell from my previous post my position) I care, but let's all think rationally--this chat room is going to *save* no one. we're merely venting/conversing/trolling, etc.”

“CURSES! I guess i like posting doubles. sorry. . .

So, in continuation, let me say that thinking what one says in a chat discussion is going to change the world, change a heart or be of some real value is to be a little kooky! Face it--no one is here looking for "answers," we're all just ranting about socks and cars and shootings and storms and whatever else. If we really want to think that we're going to make a difference or have some impact, perhaps we (collective) should actually DO something instead of sitting around complaining about others' lack of compassion, understanding, caring, blah blah blah.

As for me, I work with little kids in AWANA (www.awana.org) and I also word weekly with guys in jail through Prison Fellowship. I do other stuff and hope to become involved in Boy Scouts when I have kids. This may sound like I want some recognition, but I am merely backing up my assertion that if we want to make a difference we have to DO something. Constructive.

So, instead of complaining about the actions of others and wondering what bad thing is going to happen next, perhaps we (collective again) should be proACTIVE and influence the future.

Man, I told you my soapbox was big today, but it just keeps going and going and going. . .”

“Toast, I disagree about the choice of being "gay". Ask any early elementary ed teacher and they'll tell you that they have seen students that are definately gender confused and will likely be "gay" when they grow up.
Besides everyone has both male and female genes and hormones in them, so in reality were all just asexual with slightly more male or female hormones.”

“I think parents should bring their kids up better, but if the parents themselves have problems, how do they help their kids? Kids also learn things from their friends. Good learning at home can circumvent outside influences.

My parents taught me how to be a good person to my friends and others in life, but they did the same. They were nice to people, even if they new these same people were predjudiced against them.

I've take their good attitudes everywhere I go. My parents taught me not to sink to the low levels of others.”

“Here I go, I'm jumping in.

I think that a lot of racism laws and hate crime legeilation are screwed up. How is that any white person killing any other race or somebody of a different sexual preference considered automatically a hate crime? If a gas station robber shoots the clerk, it doesn't matter what the clerks race is. According to current laws, if that person is black or green or whatever, and the shooter is white, then it's a hate crime and that person gets a stiffer sentence. While if a minority kills a white man, then it's just plain old murder. Also, what's up with afirmative action? That's an insult to the capitalist society. We won't choose the best worker for the job because of race? Maybe a few companies in Alabama, but come on. Profits are what do the talking. If you force a racial percentage, then you limit that companies ability to maximize it's skill potential. They would have to take in a member of a minority even if they aren't as qualified for the job as another white person. While I'm on the topic, why would somebody want to work for somebody when they got the job because the law forced the guy to be hired. If you were in the situation of the employee, wouldn't you rather find a job where you were hired on your merits and not based on your race?

Everybody cries for equality but once they have it they just want more.”

“Okay, you bit--I'll set the hook.

My wife IS an elementary school teacher and she's never seen any kids like those of which you write. Now, those who *usually* display effeminate characteristics also *usually* come from, you guessed it, broken homes and they're reared by their mothers (no paternal/"manly" influence). [talking about males here--females work, too if the parental role is reversed]

Now, the whole notion of "evolution" is crap (admitted by those scientists who used to espouse it--now they lean toward "intelligent design") but IF we were to use the principles of that theory and applied it to homosexuality, there would be no homosexuals. They would not have the ability to reproduce and, thusly, would become rapidly extinct.

Homosexuality is a choice because someone has the ability to engage in its practices.

You are partially correct with your statement that "everyone has both male and female genes and hormones. . .so. . .were [sic] all just asexual." Yes, every male and female has both testosterone and estrogen (the so-called "sex hormones") but in greatly-varying amounts. Sex can be determined in the fetus in seconds after mitosis, so the idea that we're asexual is really invalid. There ARE genetic anomolies (kleinfelter's syndrome, "she-males," etc.) but, once again, they die out--don't have the ability to reproduce.

Even a simple look at the anatomical differences between men and women proves that the man's "part" is supposed to go in the woman's "part" and not in the man's dirt chute.

But this is neither here nor there--what about my soapbox!? Is anyone actually DOING anything to better humanity or are we all just complaining about it? (I fully expect Rad's comment to blast me right about. . HERE!)”

“Reptiles, If a person engages in a homosexual lifestyle it is a personal choice. For the sake of argument lets assume a person is sexually attracted to the same sex. The sex act itself is a choice, not a predisposed occurance.”

“What if gays are genetic anomolies too, and that it's a more common anomoly than she-males? And switch hitters can reproduce, keeping the genetic anomoly alive and well in the gene pool.”

“oh, man, there is just too much...

i'll let mutt ream you on this one. i'm just too damned lazy.”

“guns, racism, homosexuality...

where can this thread go from here?

and why are we all sitting in this big handbasket?”

“Affirmative Action is unfair to everyone. I do agree with burnt on this one. Why should black people get a job if they don't deserve it. It doesn't make sense. I've seen and heard of many token blacks on the job laying back & having bad attitudes because they know they can't be fired easily.

As for gay people, they seem to know they are gay atleast when they reach puberty and have feelings for the opposite sex. I don't really know if they have a choice. It came naturally for my friend. I've heard gays have some differences in their physiology, but I never really heard anymore about it, so I just don't know what's true. I don't know any gay person that wants to "fix" themselves to not be gay. I just feel if someone doesn't bother me, why should I dislike them.”

“rad, you disappoint me. i expected FLAMES, man!!

:(”

“hmm.”

“you're so flaming that you're BURNT!”

“yeah. take that. you flamer.”

“hey, lipstick chick-i didn't do the affirmative action bit. not that i wouldn't mind taking credit. . . .

i didn't jump into the racial thing on purpose (i think AA is crap).

Is ANYONE going to gimmie hits on the REAL purpose of my multi-paragraphical posts?”

“Sorry for misquoting you burnt toast.

A hate crime is when a person of a particular color is picked out to harm over all others, and may make statements like "take that you white/black/asian etc, !$%&. In this case in Seattle, the harmed person, a cop, is dead, so he cannot testify. Not all hate mongers are going to make a hate statement during their crime.”

“I give up.”

“thank you.”

“Let's move on to something less controversial....any of you women out there hike braless? I heard braless women were easier to pick up.”

“yeah.

kleetn is braless!

he's a slut.”

“Background:

Laura Schlessinger is a US radio personality who dispenses sex advice to people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that as an observant Orthodox Jew homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 and cannot be condoned in any circumstance. The following is an Open Letter to Dr. Laura penned by a US resident, which was posted on the Internet:

Dear Dr. Laura:
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your radio show, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.
I do need some advise from you, however, regarding some of the specific Bible laws and how to follow them.

a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord (Lev. 1:9). The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her? She's 18 and starting University. Will the slave buyer continue to pay for her education by law ?

c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev. 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? ....Why can't I own Canadians?

e) I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should this be a neighborhood improvement project ?

f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev. 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?

g) Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here? Would contact lenses help ?

h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27. How should they die?

i) I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev.24:10-16) Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your devoted disciple and adoring fan”

“that has already been posted here...”

“And I didn't reference God once. Huh.”

“Whelll, excuuuuuuuse me.

The topic of homosexuality was referenced on numerous occassions.”

“I think there are two types of homosexuals. There are the true homosexuals who actually have the feelings and come about it naturally. I also think that are are people who become gay because they want to be a part of a group and that communitiy is the only one that will accept them. I actually knew a guy that did this. He wasn't popular and he had no luck with the ladies, even though he tried. He was also always picked on (not my me mind you). He was also always trying to fit in with everybody, but failing. After he went off to college he decided out of the blue that he was gay. I seriously think that he did this because he saw the homosexual community as the only group that would welcome him with open arms.


Now I've said that I want to bring up something I find strange. How come when all the AIDS statistics come out, the gay community is one of the highest groups hit? What's so special about them that makes it spread so fast. I have a few threories, but I'll let the rest of you churn on it for a while.”

“We all know the CIA is responsible.

If you haven't read it, read "And the Band Played On." It's gives a pretty clear description on how and why AIDS spread through quickly through the gay MALE (take note) community in the 70s. Unprotected sex with multiple partners and IV drug use were prevalent in the disco/gay bar scene. Also, as you can imagine, one form of sex among gay men can lead to blood, etc.”

“I read an article some time ago about a game in some parts in the gay community called Gay Roulette(sp?). The object is to have sex with strangers without wearing a condom. Obviously this isn't the main factor for the high rate of HIV in the gay community, but, behavior like that sure as hell doesn't help.”

“There have been 10+ copycat shootings since the one in Santee California, 15 minutes of fame gone astray.”

“Reptiles, you are avoiding the question.”

“Sid,

Obviously Gay Roulette is the factor for the climbing HIV rates. Homosexuals who are celibate will not become infected with HIV.”

“Of course, sex without protection is THE main factor. I was just pointing out that some of these guys are actually making a game of it.”

“I just saw on tv that 5,000+ in Africa die from aids.”

“....that's per day.”

“I think I heard that 1/3 of the population of Africa has it.”