thebackpacker.com - backpacking, hiking and camping Welcome to thebackpacker.com
create account   login  
     home : trailtalk
    articles  beginners  gear  links  pictures            
mtn gal
2:43:17 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
oh, give it a rest.
radagast
3:29:26 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Mountain Gal, please put your clothing back on. Thank you.
ken
3:32:35 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I believe that birds see in color. Insects may have certain abilities, too, amazingly enough.There may be other creatures that do as well. I have a book somewhere about how vision and perception function, maybe it will give some ideas if I can turn it up.
pekka
3:36:32 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Radagast?
Yes son
I want to kill you

Mtn Gal?
I want TO... ALRIGHT!
COME ON YEAH!!!!
CX
4:37:32 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
SO WC/CX...

Raddy
is yo
Daddy
!?

MG
is
yo
Mommie
!!??

splains a lot, mebbe.
PedXing
5:48:30 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Pekka , I couldnt agree with you more on the subdued colors. I cannot stand looking across a river or cove (isle royale for example) and seeing a mass of yellow or red. Those colors are great for K2 or Everest but in most cases unnecessary. My tarp is green,most of my gear is green or khaki, my pack is royal blue (yuck) but I bought it for function not fashion. As my pack ages the color will dull.

If you depend on the color of your tent to locate your site,stay home! Carry a signal mirror and whistle cheap and light. Dont act foolishly or take unnecessary risks. 90%+ of wilderness accidents are caused by our mistakes not circumstances outside our control. If you are worried about an injury that much carry a phone,or a frickin locater beacon for downed air crews that turns on when you get a boo boo.
hyperpacker
9:50:19 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I agree most whole heartedly with most of you. Myself, I used to be quite camo - now, I've chosen new colors, black & blue (except for my tent - camo). It's just enough "off" of natural for me to be spotted by search & rescue. I travel much deeper into the backcountry than I used to, and I started to wonder if I ever got into a serious emergency situation, how would I be spotted in camo? I've never been in this situation, but I consider myself lucky.
wyrd
11:06:41 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I have long been an advocate for controlling color pollution in the backcountry. It's getting crowded enough without having your eyeballs blasted by day-glo. You can always carry one bright article of clothing for those rare situations when visibility is desirable. I haven't gone so far as to hike in a ghillie suit, but one is handy when attempting some wildlife photography.

As to the animals thread -- according to a wildlife biologist friend the black and white story is largely myth. Most mammals have some color vision, although not in the same range as humans. Deer, elk, and other browsers have limited ability to see near infra-red -- just beyond the human range of red.
gordon
11:30:20 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
gordon, ghillie suits are pretty cool, though I haven't seen a "high-tec ultralight" model yet in my Brigade Quartermaster or Cabela's catalogs, LOL. Maybe the folks worried about lurking disaster just subconciously fear the others are sneaking up on them in their low viz outfits. Of course, I just saw Enemy at the Gates last night, so I have snipers on the brain (ooh, that was an unintended pun if you saw the movie).
pekka
6:09:52 PM
4/21/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I had a busy day. I went out to hide a Geocache and then to the golf course. Since the golf course was on the other side of the State Park I wore a white golf shirt.

I felt like a neon sign. I could spot all of the other hikers hundreds of yards away (as usual) and truly missed my normal stealthy attire especially since I was trying to hide something.

I usually wear olive green and khaki.
bacpac
6:27:42 PM
4/21/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I'll bite bacpac, what's a geocache? I see the parts geo and cache, so I have some notion, but not a particular.
pekka
6:35:37 PM
4/21/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
pekka, It is one of the may nerd clubs that I participate in.

Geocaching.com
bacpac
6:41:39 PM
4/21/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Backpac a nerd? I find that a little hard to believe.
sirpeteofmillwork
7:04:19 PM
4/21/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Techno Nerd baby. I can spend hours trying to eliminate a few microseconds of processing time or days trying to save a couple milliwatts of power.

In between failures I post to TT.
bacpac
7:17:54 PM
4/21/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
bacpac, sounds like an interesting sport, a latter day orienteering but with a different mindset. For a discussion of your nerdish quest to save microseconds, have you read James Gleick's "Faster: The Acceleration of Just About Everything" ?

Now this is certainly digressing from a wilderness ethic, unless we bring back the discussion on the appropriateness of GPS vs. compass thread.
pekka
12:46:48 AM
4/22/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
This is a step back to the third posting on this thread and refers to the original post. (but still off just a weeeeeee bit)

I had to "lol" at your post, Lost in Idaho. SO TRUE!!! I was a broadcast major in college and the only "learnt" knowledge I retained is the FCC was started in 1934. (errrrrr... or was it '33?) And, yup, those were some HUGE radios back then. ROTFLMAO at the image!!

Yep, that wasn't a personal radio with headphones, no way!! lol!!
lizs
12:27:12 PM
4/22/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I don't mean to degrade this thread, but Bacpac I'm extremely interested in that Geocache thing - they have some ppl doing that out here. I haven't purchased a GPS yet, but plan to this year. I'm fully willing to contribute a nice trinket to participate in such an adventure!
wyrd
12:28:24 PM
4/22/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Here wyrd a few folks here are into it.
baume 66
12:36:33 PM
4/22/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I imagine some animals can see colors that we can't see. Is this right? Well, then we need to be on the watch for the "secret" colors that we might be wearing, but unable to detect. You can't be a real low-impact hiker with the hawks laughing at you.

And the geocaching thing involves burying little boxes under rocks and logs. This is definitely not low-impact and should be banned.
reformed lurker
4:16:03 PM
4/22/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Oh, and let's outlaw trails, too.

rl (member - hiker's for a flat earth)
reformed lurker
4:19:39 PM
4/22/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I stick to the Leave No Trace guidelines published by the Adirondack Park. Also, my tent is grey-blue (Eureka) and my bivy sack is olive drab. Happy trails.
gremlin
9:07:13 AM
4/23/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Yeah ... very cool ... I'll be gettin' into that, this year.
wyrd
8:41:38 PM
4/23/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
The heck with LNT!

I practice LTB camping (Leave Trash Behind).

One of the guiding principles behind this form of wilderness experience is High Impact.

When you chose a site, you must terra-form it to meet your needs. You know how many people will sculpt the snow to make bunks inside their tee-pee tent, seats and kitchens? Well we do the same thing with the earth. It?s fun and so much more permanent!

On one trip to a popular wilderness area, we were able to cut enough standing dead wood to build a bonfire visible from space. We so depleted the forest that the rare Pileated Woodpecker, which depends on exactly that type of standing dead wood, was pushed that much closer toward the brink of extinction.

Springs and streams make the best latrines.

Bright colors are the best! With the wildlife frightened away, you have all the wild berries to yourself.

Do yourself a favor and try this style yourself. Its FUN!
Joe Moma
11:46:32 AM
4/24/01

<< back to Trail Talk main page

 

Post a Message

In order to post a response to this thread you must first be logged in. If you do not already have an account, you must first create a new account.

 

A wilderness ethic

View Messages

Viewing posts 1 to 37 of 37 messages posted.

To add this thread as a favorites, you need to first login.
 

A wilderness ethic
1. When I leave my campsite, I look back and ask, "Can I tell I was here?"

2. I keep visual and audible impact to a minimum -- and leave my radio at home.

3. I bury human waste off the trail, at least 100 feet away from the nearest water source.

4. I never cut green trees, dig trenches or wash in a stream.

5. I cook with a stove, and if I have a campfire, I keep it small and away from boulders, rocks or fallen trees.

6. When leaving, I "dead out" the fire with water and sand, bury it and "no trace" the campsite.

7. I pack out ALL trash, including that left by others.

8. I leave my campsite better than I found it.

-- Mic Mead, founder of Adventure 16 (1942)

Right on. Except I say 200 feet, and for number 7 I say there are limitations.

8-)
nightvision
3:38:13 AM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
nightvision,on item number 2,there seems to be some question on how far to go with low visual/audible impact. It first came to the foreground of my thinking when Isle Royale added low viz recommendations to their camping guidelines some years back. I had a personal affinity for green gear already, being a military brat and Scout who absorbed the concept of khaki and olive drab, though it went against my photography training that some bright color enlivens photos.

Some folks have expressed concern to me that they might get too invisible on the trail for emergency location if they go to all greens and brown in equipment and clothing. Certainly I don't think everyone needs to be in camo, though I actually like it myself -- low vis clothing and gear can have big benefits when it comes to wildlife spotting, for example. On the other hand, I've got some gear that's pretty visable, such as two blue day packs and a blue windbreaker/pants set, and a "mango" rain parka, the latter such a good sale deal that I couldn't pass it up.

And do bear bells on you pack ruin the serenity of the back country? How about a harmonica around the campfire? How far to go on this?
pekka
8:28:46 AM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
1942 and a radio? Would not a typical 1942 commercially produced battery powered radio be about the size of a small backpack? Of course he left it behind if backpacking. I think this guy was car camper or horse packed.
lost in Idaho
10:16:43 AM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I always try to keep my flatulence to a minimum in the backcountry so as not to frighten the wildlife.
MadRiver
10:22:06 AM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
pekka,

I agree with you on the camo thing...I like to be as invisible as possible, particularly when solo. It's a good idea for safety reasons, as well as the added benefit of increased wildlife sightings.

As far as people wanting visibility for emergency rescue puposes...don't people carry mirrors and/or whistles for this?

I am more of a naturalist in the woods, I guess you could say. I like to tell time by the sun, the weather by watching the skies, geography by studying the landscape...
I leave the radio at home. No cell phone, no watch(unless it's an extremely short trip with >cringe< deadlines for returning). I do enjoy some benefits of modern technology, as far as goretex and polypro as it makes my load lighter and gets me farther into the back country. Also, I bring a compass, of course. :o)
AmyG
11:11:23 AM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
#4 - One should never cut dead trees, either. If it isn't fallen, leave it alone.

#6 - This should include dismantling the fire ring, and scattering the rocks, then placing dirt over the coals/ashes.
gojo
11:49:20 AM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
AmyG,
By staying low viz -- not necessarily camo but subdued earth tones, I have been just off trail on a rock outcropping when a noisy group of hikers has come up a trail and never noticed me, though I could have snatched the hats off their heads. I, too, enjoy the naturalist approach when hiking, being observant more than observed. And I agree on its benefits for solo hiking where you don't want to draw attention to your solo-ness, especially and unfortunately, perhaps for women. Though I've never met any women on the trail in camo, maybe I just couldn't see them!

Isn't it interesting, but the folks who have told me they want emergency visibility have never brought up signal devices. I guess they plan to wave their red backpack or parka at the ranger's plane.
pekka
11:52:30 AM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I don't actually wear camo(it's not my color) but generally blacks, browns, etc neutrals.
The one thing I don't like about my Zephyr, other than no vestibule, is that part of it is red(and tan). I usually camp(solo) well enough off-trail that it doesn't matter though. Unless it is dead of winter (with snow), you probably won't see me. ;o)
AmyG
1:36:13 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I must confess, please forgive me, in reference to number 7 (...pack out ALL trash) - I burn as much as possible and pack out the rest. This is probably not acceptable but compared to an incinerator stack spewing toxins day in and day out, or the rotting stench of a landfill, "my poof of smoke" of shrink wrap, folger single wrappers, oatmeal wrappers, empty lipton noodle pakaging and goya rice wraps(foil like plastic) doesnt amount to much harm. Hell its got to be done anyway.(by me or the Municipality Waste Entity) I do pack out foil, used coffee tea bags and other items bescause that is litter plain and simple.

Have I sinned agaisnt nature and my fellow outdoors lovers?
nimrod
1:40:25 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
One thing I've never understood. I thought all animals, except primates/humans, only see in black and white anyway. SO why the hell does it matter what color you wear?
roseymonster
1:56:43 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Rosey,
Animals can't tell that it's bright red but they can tell it's a very different shade of grey then the surounding green trees. Also, they are great at picking out large patches of single colors, not many things in nature are single colored, geometrical in shape or have perfect straight lines. Camo is also designed to break up or blur the shape of the body helping you blend into your environment.
REPTILES
2:07:55 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
Safety YELLOW!!!!!! KICKS A-HOLE!
CX
2:12:51 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
The neutral colors are to enhance the wilderness experience of your fellow hikers.

I once sat atop Iron Creek Summit, ID glassing the surrounding drainages, valleys, and mountains. I saw no signs of humans other than my camp, a very distant road, and a red shirted individual some miles distant. If that person had been wearing a neutral color, I would have never seen them, and consequently, would have thought I had all those hundreds of square miles to myself...
gojo
2:26:47 PM
4/20/01

RE: A wilderness ethic
I also prefer natural attire. Especially when no one else is around.
(.)(.)
) . (
( Y )

Login Form

Username:
Password:

 

 

Post a New Thread
Search Threads
Browse Archive

Create a New Account

Trail Talk Main Page


Search

Search thebackpacker.com for:


Ready to Buy Gear?

Sponsored Links

Great Outdoor Sites

Posters



Links

  • Phil's Photo Page

  •