What is a stem cell?

“I believe GWB suggested that these cells should be brought to term and the babies adopted....perhaps his daughters will be willing hosts.”

“Carlette, fine for you, but if you need a kidney can you take it from KK just because you want it?”

“I love how Ewker attempts to bash me with his silly name calling even if I'm nowhere around a thread.
Pitiful
It's actually kinda creepy I'm in his mind so much.
LOL”

“What Treebeard said...the embryos are discarded...by the presumption of opponents of stem cell research that this research 'destroy's life', isn't discarding embryos an act "destroying life?"”

“Yes ChicagoMark, discarding the embryo's is destroying life. The question we should, and many have been asking all along is should we be creating them in the first place. Of course helping people have children is a worthy goal. But we need to be honest about the fact that these embryo's are human beings and when they are discarded you are killing someone.”

“No I can't Hyway and as a mother I wouldnt' take my own kids kidney...no more than I'd take the last bite of food she needed.

But I would hope thru research should God forbid any disease reach into my family , which for the record it already has...then maybe she'd have a chance to live.”

“exactly ChicagoMark, thinks for finally seeing the light. The destoying of life must stop.”

“Carlette, the question is when does life begin. When did you first become a mother? When the baby could survive on its own without you? When the baby took its first breath? When it first got a heartbeat? when it was first concieved?

Too many people want to disregard another's belief on when that moment is. The Germans made exterminating jews legal, it was a govwernment wide operation. Since they were already going to exterminate them, why not further medical science while they were at it?”

“Before our baby was born this past February, we looked into saving the unbiciall cord for its richness in stem cells that could be useful in the future to treat her against disease, cancer yada yada yada.

We decided that it was too costly for us at the time, plus we missed the deadline to have paper work turned in.

Does anyoone have a problem with this? She was born, we did not abort her. The procedure would not have caused any pain to her or mother. Maybe this is not the same thing, I don't know. I may be just talking out of my ass here.

Link to place we would have contacted
http://www.viacord.com/

Picture of the cute little one
http://image34.webshots.com/34/9/84/94/343098494qkhuLf_ph.jpg”

“as long as its legal..talk to your president if you have issues with that. Then I DO NOT see the point in throwing away something that can be helpful.


Don't ever question what I would do for kk again.”

“Too many people want to disregard another's belief on when that moment is.

I agree with you...I wish these people would quit standing in the way of those seeking cures that could save millions.
last edited: 5/25/05 9:38:01 AM”

“If you read the story above it said that was Bush's alternative that bill passed 430-1”

“WK, using cord blood for stem cells isn't controversial at all.

It's promoted as an alternative by researchers and others who have ethical problems with using embryos, while other researchers etc... say that embryonic stem cells have much more potential.”

“oh dam LOL

kk must be carlette's child.

i read too quickly and thought it was KKK!

man, was i lost for a minute there LOL”

“Thank you Wounded knee....I was waiting to see when somebody would actually come up with the other optino and how long others would make it an abortion issue.”

“I don't think anyone has yet Carlette. Bison advised that it isn't controversial at all.

If we are able to have a second child, we have already decided to save the cord for possible future use.”

“I think the point though, Carlette, is that we're not talking about throwing away you're old chewing gum, we're talking about throwing away people. And yes they probably are going to get thrown away regardless, but they're still human beings.

And embryonic stem cell use IS an abortion issue, no way around that. Cord blood stem cells are of course not an abortion issue, hence, not really controversial.
last edited: 5/25/05 9:40:20 AM”

“no but you're very ready to jump on people who don't believe what you do are baby killers and put a whole different spin on it. I truly see your point...I just don't buy it.”

“mtnsteve, I was meaning everyone involved in the issue. But thats the point isn't it. If you believe life starts at birth then its easy to see stem cell research as no worse than whacking off into a sock. Its just molecules.

But if you believe life starts at conception then stem cell research is the equivalent to the studying high altitude sickness on concentration camp prisoners.

And no matter who has the most votes, being legal isn't the same as being right.”

“Correct me if I am wrong but isn’t this congressional act about the money for the research, not the research itself? There is no prohibition on the research, just the use of tax money to fund it. If you support it, make a donation. If you oppose it don’t donate. I have a hard time understanding why so many people think that if the goberment doesn’t do it, it wouldn’t get done. Why do they have such great faith in the goberment? I have heard people say that it was the “Christian” thing to do to raise taxes and use that tax money to care for the needy. The goberment is the most inefficient, wasteful and slow way to help the needy. I give about 12% of my income to charity and to ones that I know use it efficiently. I wouldn’t go into how forced contributions (taxes) don’t qualify as a Christian charitable act. Something like 80% of the money used for stem cell research is private (not from the feds). If you feel strongly about it, donate the money you got in tax rate reductions in the past years directly to the research.”

“Pro-stem cell researchers sound like 16 year old boys trying to get laid, “But, but, but, I’ll die without it!”.

The absolute disregard for the human life sickens me to the point of wanting to puke. Frickin’ hippy types take to the streets and march and cry and scream about animal testing but then also take to the streets and protest when they are denied the chance to kill more babies. They should be boiled in excrement for their blasphemous and traitorous acts against humanity! DIE DIE DIE!









































BTW- anyone see that new sandwich they got at Hardees?”

“If some of you guys had your way quite a few of us would have to be interviewed by homicide detectives.

Why?

Anyone who has had a miscarriage would be liable for possible murder charges, both mother and father.

Since there is no statute of limitations on murder there would be a lot of work for the detectives to do.

This would cost a lot of taxpayer's money for extra prosecutors and police personnel.

Let's not be pikers here, there are murderers to put away.

We must pony-up the dough for all that extra police work, and don't forget to build more prisons to hold all these killers.”

“You are correct mtn gal, we are talking about money here, funding for research, not whether the research is legal to do or not. (Oh and BTW Bush is the first Pres. to allow ANY government funding for research on embryonic stem cells, something Clinton never did). I think asking those who want this research done to donate their own money, and not asking those who believe this is murder to fund it involuntarily, is a great idea.”

“Those who have to throw away the "left overs" should be prosecuted as murderers, along with those that "conceived" them to begin with?

I believe if men had babies, this wouldn't be an issue.”

“I love how Ewker attempts to bash me with his silly name calling even if I'm nowhere around a thread.
Pitiful
It's actually kinda creepy I'm in his mind so much.
LOL”
StoveStomper
9:22:56 AM
5/25/05

did I mention your name?? So are you taking the job of the resident TT nanny?”

“MarkO you're stepping a little far out, come back in where it's nice and warm. Nobody's ever gonna go around investigating people who have miscarriages. Maybe if there was some obvious evidence that it was done on purpose, but otherwise that's like saying that anyone whose kid dies in car accident, or by drowning, or anything else while the parent is near would be liable to be investigated for murder, and that's just not reality.”

“Uh oh Ewker, SS gonna make you sit on the naughty spot!”

“Tell you whatm, Bison. I will donate to this(even though I have a running problem paying monthly bills to keep a family going) when you adopt one of those babies...”

“why isn't it a womans decision to have the abortion if she wants it. If she is wrong the time will come when she will be responsible for her actions.”

“I appreciate your condescension Bison.......the usual.

"Nobody's ever gonna go around investigating people who have miscarriages."

Never say never.

If the Ameri-Taliban get's it's way there's no telling how far they will go.
They might even put clothes on Paris Hilton.

You are still going to need more prison space to hold all of those killers.

And while I'm being an azzhole......what is your moral stance on pre-marital sex?
last edited: 5/25/05 9:58:39 AM”

“Nigal, behave, or I'll sic Sarge on you. ;-)”

“MarkO, don't be so obvious. heat it slowly then let it simmer”

“Same could be said for a woman (or man for that matter) who takes their 3 day old, stuffs him/her in a plastic bag and puts it in the dumpster. All we're talking about here is killing someone at one stage of development vs. killing them at another stage of development. You're still killing them. The only issue we have is that we, as a society, have decided that killing at one stage is acceptable is and killing at another isn't.

And Tree, people are responsible for their own actions, your choice to donate to the cause cannot in anyway be predicated on asking me to take care of someone else's self created issue.
last edited: 5/25/05 9:58:09 AM”

“why isn't it a womans decision to have the abortion if she wants it. If she is wrong the time will come when she will be responsible for her actions.”
Ewker



very simple answer. b/c there are only what, 3 or 4 women in the senate and house?”

““why isn't it a womans decision to have the abortion if she wants it. If she is wrong the time will come when she will be responsible for her actions.”
Ewker
9:53:21 AM
5/25/05
ignore this user

Good point Ewker! Probably the same reason that gay marriage has been banned.”

“Uh, Sacco, last time I checked abortion in the first two trimester's is currently legal, the number of women in Congress has nothing to do with it.

Again, WK, abortion is legal, it is the woman's decision.
last edited: 5/25/05 10:00:32 AM”

“people are responsible for their own actions
Bison
9:57:32 AM
5/25/05

Bison, that is true. So a woman is responsible for her action. not you or anyone else.

BTW comparing an early term abortion to a 3 day old baby is stretching it.”

“No it's not stretching it at all Ewker, we're just talking about two human beings in different stages of development.

The only "stretching it" comes from your personal need to feel alright with allowing some people to be killed.”

“Dang sacco, we can't be havin' wimmin in charge.

They might get in the way of such things as un-necessary wars and slow down the military/industrial/congressional gravy train.”

“Their poll was conducted by TNS Intersearch of Horsham, PA, on 2001-JUN-20 to 24 A random sampling of 1,022 adults were polled. Margin of error is 3 points. It showed that American adults support stem cell research by about a 2:1 margin (58% in favor; 30% opposed). 60% call for government grants.


Roman Catholics favor research (54% in favor; 30% opposed). They favor funding by 60% to 32%.
White Evangelical Protestants support research by 50% to 40%
The only identifiable group to oppose stem cell research are African-Americans (44% opposed)
62% of independent voters favor research
63% of adults who described themselves as "moderates" approved of research.
Self-identified pro-choicers favored research by 76% to 15%; 50% of Pro-lifers are opposed to stem cell research.


So isn't bush supposed to represent the people and not HIS own feelings and agenda????”

“Bison, like you said abortion is legal..killing a 3 day old baby isn't

so you are stretching it”

“I’m all for abortion. Look at it this way; who’s getting the abortions? Liberals! Every abortion, save the occasional stray and wayward catholic school girl, is one more child saved from being raised to be a liberal. It’s a simple waiting game of attrition.




Ah who am I kidding? I can’t even troll well anymore! 8(
Phuck ya'll! I'm goin' back to the Hardees thread!”

“uh, Bison, the number of women in Congress has a very critical role in the laws that are passed.

the number of women in the supreme court also has a thing or two to do with our legal system.”

“I haven’t expressed an opinion of the ethics of the research but will say this. There are plenty of people willing to adopt babies. This talk suggesting that there would be no one to adopt babies if they are not aborted is false and is not an argument a reasonable person would use.”

“Lordy LOrdy you boys must be thirsty....brb...pigs are slopped...”

“So a woman is responsible for her action. not you or anyone else.

"Responsible for your actions" doesn't mean you have the free reign to do whatever you want. It means if you do something wrong, you pay consequenses, and it also means you are to make sure you don't do anything wrong in the first place.”

“Why should a woman be allowed to be the sole decision maker in whether or not she aborts a child, yet can demand child support from a father who would rather abort? or why can't a father sue a woman in civil court for the destruction of his property (even if it is joint property)?”

“"The only "stretching it" comes from your personal need to feel alright with allowing some people to be killed."

I don't feel good about allowing some people(Iraqi civilians) to be killed.”

“Hey, save the stretchin' jokes for the birthin' threads! Pigs!”

“No Tango, Representatives in Government should never, ever be led around by the people on a leash. The idea, in my mind, is to elect leaders not followers.

If you think that he should do what polls tell him is what the people want, why don't we just have a national referendum on every issue that comes up? So that all of us, regardless of the degree to which we've thought about and studied the issue can have a say. Most of the issues that gov't deals with, this one included, are incredibly complex. That's why we elect people and pay them to spend their time dealing with the issues.

I take it you've never been to the musical 1776. Great philosophical scene about representation in that play.”