“The numbers that die on Everest is about 12.5% of climbers.
Its easy for everyone to armchair on whether aid should have been rendered. How many of the above comentators have climbed a high altitude glaciated peak (Rainier)? A really high glaciated peak (Denali)? An extremely high glaciated peak (Everest)? At 4 miles above above sea level there there ain't much O2 to fuel the brain.
People solo Rainier, get hurt and die. Rescue at 14000 is difficult. Imagine twice that height. Everest has big time objective danger.
How practical is rescue someone from 28,000? shortroping? carry? It would be damn hard if not impossible. What are the chances the rescue will be succesful (HAPE, HACE)? What about danger to rescuers? In lifesaving (water) the rescuer does not endanger their life to the point of causing 2 fatalities (their own and victim)
BTW I have climbed multiple glaciated peaks in the Cascades, some solo. I also have had an unplanned nightime winter bivouac at 6600 with a 1 hour moonlight guided hike out (at 11 pm) to effect a rescue of a dehydrated and exhausted partner.”
“edoc, the 4:1 ratio I quoted was for actual summits, not just climbers. That was Krakouer data from his book, I hope he researched it before posting. It would be easy to check. There have been 190 or so deaths. That would mean that there should be 760 successful summits.”
“i am glad that it changed, because damn, I don't wanna be alone on Everest [if I ever would go].”
“damn that krakouer. It appears that through 2004 there have been 2249 summits and 186 deaths.
this is the quote from krakauer: "The statistics I quote at the end of the book are constant: for every four people who summit, one dies; for every 30 people who even attempt the mountain, one dies. Being a brilliant climber doesn't ensure your safety; as many brilliant climbers have died as stumblebums."”
“Quick look (google: deaths per everest summit)has ~775 summiters (25% of 3101) 1980-2002 with ~62 (1.8 % of 3101) deaths. Thats like 8%?? (If I did my math right)
All activity has, or doesn't have, objective danger. Its all about ones comfort zone and acceptance of risk. I solo hike in all conditions. My comfort zone is wide, as is my acceptance of risk. (But I do try to minimize my risk.)”
“That's it! I'm cancelling my climb up Everest!”
“I'm not even remotely capable of undertaking something of that magnitude, but I don't know if I could make a blanket statement affirming that the passers-by were justified in ignoring him. I also noticed that no one even mentioned the possibility of seeking help from the other climbers (40 passed him by?) to make a collective effort to do something to help him. I don't know the logistics of a venture of this sort and I don't profess to. But, if you can be that callous as to say, from your armchair, that you would be endangering yourself by aiding this man, you could, at least, entertain the thought that something could be done with the help of other climbers...”
“I am not justifying their actions. I am just saying they are all grown men and women on that mountain all capable of making their own decisions and that is the culture of the mountain. If you go up their without your own team of climbers (and I say team, not a group of clients) and are expecting others to help you when you get in a tight spot, then prepare to be dissappointed.
Krakauer, an experienced climber and probably no less respectfull of human life than anyone else on this board comments on the culture of Everest best in this quote:
"As for Krakauer's own sense of why things went so horribly wrong? "We had never climbed together, there was a disparity in strengths among us, so, wisely, we were taught to rely on the guide if things went wrong. Not only that, we were never ever roped together. Everyone climbed independently, at their own pace, which was good. But when you're roped to someone you develop this weird intimacy; every time you take a step, they have to take a step. You develop a bond that was just lacking on Everest. We weren't encouraged to look after our fellow clients and certainly not after the guides.
"And that's inexcusable to me. It's the thing that eats at me most. If I'd been up there with a bunch of friends, instead of guides and fellow clients, I can't imagine that I would have left [guide] Andy Harris up there in a storm when I clearly should have seen that he wasn't feeling well. And having gotten down to the South Col, I just wouldn't have crawled into my tent and into my sleeping bag without accounting for each of my partners. Climbing is a subculture that prides itself on the purity of its ideals. It has these weird rituals and rules that most people wouldn't understand. Some of it is kind of sick, because it idealizes boldness and risk-taking to such a degree. But its ideals about respecting your partner and about 'how you climb being more important than what you climb' are really good. I betrayed those ideals. For that I really beat myself up."”
“It was just a thought of mine, Hyway. I was just opening up the possibility that something could have been done with a bit more resourcefulness and teamwork. But, I am so out-of-the-loop when it comes to climbing, it would be wrong of me to exert any hint of expertise on the matter...”
“Folks take lessons, buy the latest gear and look down their noses at those in leather boots. It's become a status symbol. If you don't have the new, cool, color coordinated gear you somehow don't belong out there.
That's pretty accurate of most trailrats who think hiking marked, groomed footpaths is a real backcountry experience, too.”
“tree, I am not a climber, but I have read a lot about Everest. Fr
